AndyJohnson

Edelmnas receiving yards, by game
7
50
28
7
8
0
58
64
13

Are we really calling that 'productive' in an offense that threw for 300 yards a game?

ivanvamp

Completely untrue. I'm saying that a reason we might think that Edelman would put up better numbers than he has is if he was the full-time starting WR.

Duh. *You* could "replace" Wes Welker "on some level". At some point the Patriots will have to replace him with somebody on some level. I have never said or hinted or suggested that Edelman would replace Welker's production. You're reading stuff into what I've said WAY too much.

I don't want to move Welker. But as he ages, and as his price tag goes up, the Patriots would be wise to consider alternative scenarios. My entire premise was that *IF* the Patriots think that Edelman can be a productive replacement for Welker, they could use the money saved to improve the team elsewhere, and they just might do something like that.

<sigh>

You don't have to be a top 50 or 100 WR to not be a jag. He might be a good fit *for the Patriots*, which is all Belichick cares about. Lots of guys appear to be good fits for New England, but poor fits elsewhere.

Andy, I don't know, really, what is going on inside your head because you obviously have missed my argument completely. I'm going to quote my entire OP here:

(bolded for emphasis)

So it's not a "totally different discussion" to talk about the $$ savings going from Welker --> Edelman. It was the entire POINT of my original post!

AndyJohnson

Yoiu compared him to Welker here, implying it was just an opportunity thing. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way, but many use that silly argument.


Am I? You are calling Edelman a key to the Welker decision. He really is irrelevant to it.

And ym entire premise is that its ridiculous to think he can replace Welker. If Welker is gone the Patriots need a front line receiver and whether they keep edelman or not is meaningless to that. If Edleman goes, they need another punt returner and end of the rotation WR too.


Seriously, there is no way the Patriots attempt to run the same offense with Edelman in Welkers role. You know that.



And they are jags.


Yeah, I read it. Your argument is that Edelman is the key to the Welker decision. He simply is not. If Welker goes, it will have nothing to do with Edelman staying or not. If Welker goes, we need to go out and find a starting WR. And we have to change our offensive scheme.

ivanvamp

The Patriots must think fairly highly of Edelman. After all, if he is just a jag, why have the Patriots kept him around for 4 years, despite a lack of production and a rash of injuries? And why did he start the first couple of games this season? They like him and they like what he brings to the table. And not just as a special teamer, but as a WR.

My argument is that IF the Patriots think that Edelman can be an effective player at Welker's position, then they might consider letting Welker go so they can use the cost savings to add either defensive help or another quality receiver. (like maybe Bowe or Jennings)

If you disagree, fine. But don't make things up and argue against things that I'm not saying. Geez, that's annoying.

AndyJohnson

Every team has numerous jags, many of whom play special teams and are backups and some who last a long time. They don't replace legends though.


If you don't want to discuss the topic, say so, but I cannot just keep repeating myself because you don't listen.
Welker's role is the top receiver and focal point of the passing game. It is totally ludricrous to think that Edelman can be that. The choice is keep Welker or change the offense and go find a starting WR, not make Edelman the focal point. You don't seriously think that is an option do you?
Welker position is not 'white WR'. It is the central piece of the design and scheme of the passing offense, and the go to receiver.

What did I make up?
I agree that is annoying, I am just assuming that when you say Edelman is the key, that you think it is realistic that we would leave the offense unchanged and put Edelman in Welkers spot, and that just isn't reasonable.

supafly

I can see the issue both ways about 100x through. I can agree that Edelman looked to have improved upon the WR role..although to be fair, the bar was set pretty low in that regard.

On the other hand, I can also see why posters would not think that his "most productive" season as a WR was anything special, because it wasn't.

Now, do I think he has progressed as a WR? Yes. Do I think that the coaches are willing to try and continue that progression? Yes. Is he probably anything better than a very good special teams player, a gadget player, and one who is the WR4? Probably not.

On the other hand, he may be able to fill in some of the loss if Welker is allowed to walk, but we don't even know what that plan would be, besides a lot of speculation about Hernandez and Edelman trying to make up for some of the production.

Overall I like the guy a lot, and I think that he shouldn't have any problem staying. While I want him to achieve some reps and looks, I don't want to have to rely on him as an outside receiver either, and I don't want the NEP decision regarding Welker to go hand in hand with what Edelman does.

__________________
Patiently waiting to defend the next "bubble" player in this summer's training camp.....

ivanvamp

There isn't a receiver in the league that could fully replace Welker, and yet at some point, probably in the pretty near future, they're going to have to do just that. The offense, as you say, WILL change. And the fact is that the Pats *did* have Edelman starting in place of Welker to start the year.

What the hell does "white" have to do with anything? Why would you go there? They had Edelman playing Welker's position, running the same basic routes as Welker did. He doesn't do it as well, but then again, he does some other things better than Welker does. There's a reason they had him starting.

And changing the offense doesn't bother me in the least. They have so much offensive talent that they could do a number of things and be successful. And at most in a few seasons, we're going to see such a change anyway.

You claimed that I was arguing that the only difference between Welker and Edelman was a lack of opportunity for Edelman.

You claimed that I was arguing that Edelman could replace (and by that you meant "fully replace") Welker.

Both of these claims are false - I never uttered any such things.

When Edelman started the first couple of games, how much did the Patriots change their offense? Obviously it's going to look a little different. But if I recall, it was pretty much what they normally do.