Building your draft board position by position - week 5: Linebacker

[Box_O_Rocks]

Week Four has come and gone and I'm still struggling to sort out what I want to do at Cornerback, but considering the limited interest in CBs it must time for Week Five, Linebackers.

If you want a 220 lb. guy who runs the 40 in 4.4, tell us how you see him fitting in the Pats' system as a linebacker (if you want him for Safety or Special Teams wait a bit, they will be discussed later in the process). Please tell us which sites or draft guides you've been reading for background, if a draft guide or pay-site, quote us a line or two which made the strongest impression - just to entertain us cheap devils.

Willie remains unsigned, Chatham is shopping around, and this is reportedly a strong year for LBs and DE-tweeners, seems reasonable BB would be shopping around.

[shirtsleeve]

Originally Posted by Box_O_Rocks

If you want a 220 lb. guy who runs the 40 in 4.4, tell us how you see him fitting in the Pats' system as a linebacker (if you want him for Safety or Special Teams wait a bit, they will be discussed later in the process).

You like him as much as I do, dont you? I cant see him going later than high three, but we will talk about that later.

[Box_O_Rocks]

Originally Posted by shirtsleeve

You like him as much as I do, dont you? I cant see him going later than high three, but we will talk about that later.

shhhhhhhh!

[drew4008]

If you're talking about Ernie Sims, he is actually up to 231 now.

[Box_O_Rocks]

Originally Posted by drew4008

If you're talking about Ernie Sims, he is actually up to 231 now.

Nothing up my 'sleeve'.

[patchick]

The OLB profile seems pretty clear: we're looking for physical freaks, 6'5" 250, fast, strong, athletic and explosive. Once you've narrowed it down to that miniscule sliver of humanity, you start looking for versatile players who could put their hand down or drop into coverage, and show Patriot-style intangibles. Then you marvel that such human beings exist.

But ILB is baffling to me. When is the last time the Patriots successfully added an ILB to their roster? What's the profile? The body type isn't so rare, but the position seems to be devilishly hard to master. Football intelligence is a must. With 4-year max contracts can you wait for an agile, athletic DE like Bruschi and Beisel to learn the trade? Do you hunt for the rare college LB with 3-4 experience like Ryan Claridge? Claridge, incidentally, is reputed to be smart, instinctive, athletic and good in pass coverage -- but lacking strength and suspect against the run. So is a run stuffer a higher priority? Overall I have no friggin' idea.

With that encouraging statement, I'll start on the OLBs:


Round 1

Manny Lawson, N.C. State
I don't think I need to do much persuading here, Lawson is a darling of this board. Looks like a prototype OLB, physical marvel, has played both DL and LB. Main question mark is how much he can improve against the run, which is a glaring weak point.


Bottom 1 / Top 2

Bobby Carpenter, Ohio State
This guy should be at the top of everybody's lists. He has all the physical skills, and get this--he's an actual *linebacker*. A productive one at that. Plus he seems to be a smart, hardworking guy with a good attitude from a football family. Nfldraftcountdown says: "Is very natural and does an excellent job in coverage...Does a nice job of filling against the run...Flies to the ball and makes plays sideline-to-sideline...Tremendous pass rusher and blitzer...Tough as nails and a true football player." So what's not to like about Carpenter? There are whispers about his intelligence and awareness. Also, the fact that he's a relatively polished finished product is oddly held against him -- not enough "upside." But while you wait for the upside of a Kam Wimbley (see below), Carpenter could be contributing steadily.

Kamerion Wimbley, Florida State
A lot of mocks have Wimbley neck-and-neck with Lawson, but I'm not sold...I like his talent, but not at #21. He's a terrific athlete, a hard worker and an explosive pass rusher, but not very strong and even more of a liability against the run than Lawson is. Here's a snippet from Nfldraftscout that gives me pause: "Lacks awareness and is slow to react to the play, needing time to digest what is developing around him."


Round 2-3

Stanley McClover, Auburn
McClover is another DE conversion project, a bit slower than Lawson and Wimbley but still explosive and far stouter against the run. Condraft says: "possesses tremendous quickness and speed and can wreak havoc as an edge rusher...He also is a sure tackler and can really stop the run. He plays with a lot of emotion and has a great motor." Fftoolbox says: "alert to plays all over the field, active & consistently in motion, and is very good in pursuit of the ball."

Mark Anderson, Alabama
Anderson might be the most well-balanced prospect for the position. He doesn't stand out in any one way, but is very respectable in size, speed, quickness, strength, run support, penetration, and movement in space. I might even rank him higher if he had LB experience. Fftoolbox says: "He displays explosive quickness and speed off the snap...a rather agile and athletic player for the defensive end position...reminds me of current NFL defensive end Willie McGinest."

Round 4-5

Charlton Keith, Kansas
A tall, lanky DE at 6'5" 237, and a very intriguing project. Condraft says: "Charlton displays an incredible amount of athleticism, possesses solid technique for knifing through an opposing team's offensive line." Nfldraftscout says: "All-out hustler...Has the functional strength to explode behind his hits...Has developed a nice feel for blocking schemes and is quick to locate the ball working down the line...Takes good angles and demonstrates superb lateral range to chase the play down." Downsides are his slight build and total lack of LB experience. Also, one of the most confusing names in the draft. Parents, if your last name is a first name, don't choose a first name that's a last name, ok?

Chris Gocong, Cal Poly
6'2" 263 4.70, Div 1-AA player of the year. Didn't try football until high school. A powerful player, Nfldraftcountdown says: "Makes a lot of plays in the backfield and simply has a knack for getting to the quarterback." Condraft says: "a dedicated player and a student of the game, who can breakdown game film and learn from it." Top-notch intangibles, unknown upside.

Brandon Guillory, Louisiana-Monroe
Tremendous athlete at 6'4" 250 4.5, 38" vertical. Call him a very, very raw Manny Lawson: explosive, fearsome penetrator who's iffy against the run. Fftoolbox says: "battles opponents till the whistle, with the physical nastiness needed to be a dominant figure on the field...disruptive playmaker and momentum changer...in his enthusiasm to get to the quarterback he leaves running lanes open...I would like to see him improve on securing tackles better."

[Box_O_Rocks]

Originally Posted by patchick

The OLB profile seems pretty clear: we're looking for physical freaks, 6'5" 250, fast, strong, athletic and explosive. Once you've narrowed it down to that miniscule sliver of humanity, you start looking for versatile players who could put their hand down or drop into coverage, and show Patriot-style intangibles. Then you marvel that such human beings exist.

But ILB is baffling to me. When is the last time the Patriots successfully added an ILB to their roster? What's the profile? The body type isn't so rare, but the position seems to be devilishly hard to master. Football intelligence is a must. With 4-year max contracts can you wait for an agile, athletic DE like Bruschi and Beisel to learn the trade? Do you hunt for the rare college LB with 3-4 experience like Ryan Claridge? Claridge, incidentally, is reputed to be smart, instinctive, athletic and good in pass coverage -- but lacking strength and suspect against the run. So is a run stuffer a higher priority? Overall I have no friggin' idea.

With that encouraging statement, I'll start on the OLBs:

Round 1
Manny Lawson, N.C. State

Bottom 1 / Top 2
Bobby Carpenter, Ohio State

Kamerion Wimbley, Florida State

Round 2-3
Stanley McClover, Auburn

Mark Anderson, Alabama

Round 4-5
Charlton Keith, Kansas

Chris Gocong, Cal Poly

Brandon Guillory, Louisiana-Monroe

Very nice list, we will parallel each other closely when I get my board up.

When you discuss ILB skills I'd say there are four essentials: A nose for the ball; An ability to play through trash; An ability to fight off blocks (this one is interesting, TJ used to batter the opposing Guards, Tedy side steps them and Vrabes just tries to stand them up and use them to plug the hole); Great tacklers - once they get their hands on you the play stops.

I've had the opportunity to watch Lawson, Wimbley, Anderson, and Gocong play in All-Star games.

Lawson and Gocong had a really desirable talent, they found the ball quickly. I like Gocong more for ILB, he's a High School signal caller (QB), he started out as a NT at Cal-Poly his Sophomore year, before moving to DE and exploding on the scene - NT suggests he has some of the hand skills he'll need to battle Guards.

Anderson did remind me of Willie, slower, but better able to set up the OT and us a mix of power and moves. I'm still not sure if he just slid under people's radars or pulled a Gabe Watson and let the talent show in the money games....

Wimbley ate slow OTs like Trueblood alive in the Senior Bowl, then TE Klopfenstein stayed in and handled him one-on-one without breaking a sweat - I read that as one dimensional (speed) only.

Keith left me with mixed, but generally positive feelings after his Combine workout. Carpenter sounds like the real deal with only the reservations Ochmed (I think you were the one) raised about his smarts. Mclover leaves me thinking eh, maaaaybeeee. Guillory sounds hopeful since he has played OLB, I just doubt if he's learned to do it Pats' style.

[Ochmed Jones]

With regards to LBs I want to say this real quick. The beuaty of the 3-4 when done correctly is that the opposing QB is not supposed to know where/if the 4th pass rusher is coming from. It could be any of the 4 LBS or even one of the safties. However if you are not the designated pass rusher, then you have to be able to cover.

I think that with Willie and Colvin out there at the same time, opposing QBs tended to know that one of them would be coming and that the ILBs were going to be dropping into coverage. That may have taken away some of the advantage our defense was designed to incorporate.

If BB drafts a Lawson and lines him up at OLB, the opposing QB knows 1) that Lawson is coming and 2) draws, screens and running plays to Lawson's side have huge potential for big gains.
If BB waits til day 2 and drafts a Brandon Johnson of Louisville, opposing QBs know this guy is droping into coverage.
Rookies LBs (not named LT) in our defense will key the opposing offense. How much of the versatility of our defense is BB willing to sacrifice by going the rookie route?

However that being said, unless BB goes on a FA splurge real soon, I see us taking a LB or two in the upcoming draft. When do/if they get on the field is a different question.

[Box_O_Rocks]

Originally Posted by Ochmed Jones

With regards to LBs I want to say this real quick. The beuaty of the 3-4 when done correctly is that the opposing QB is not supposed to know where/if the 4th pass rusher is coming from. It could be any of the 4 LBS or even one of the safties. However if you are not the designated pass rusher, then you have to be able to cover.

I think that with Willie and Colvin out there at the same time, opposing QBs tended to know that one of them would be coming and that the ILBs were going to be dropping into coverage. That may have taken away some of the advantage our defense was designed to incorporate.

If BB drafts a Lawson and lines him up at OLB, the opposing QB knows 1) that Lawson is coming and 2) draws, screens and running plays to Lawson's side have huge potential for big gains.
If BB waits til day 2 and drafts a Brandon Johnson of Louisville, opposing QBs know this guy is droping into coverage.
Rookies LBs (not named LT) in our defense will key the opposing offense. How much of the versatility of our defense is BB willing to sacrifice by going the rookie route?

However that being said, unless BB goes on a FA splurge real soon, I see us taking a LB or two in the upcoming draft. When do/if they get on the field is a different question.

Vrabel moving outside doesn't worry me, Beisel showed improvement as the season progressed and I expect him to be better set up physically after the off-season program resets his playing weight to one better suited for the ILB role. I'd like to see TBC in coverage more to get a feel for his status. I think Lawson will do okay dropping into coverage, but any rookie is going to be a target for misdirection stuff to keep him confused and off-balance.

Brandon Johnson Louisville 6047 228 4.44 - this is his Combine weigh-in, he may have the frame to pack on another 25 lbs, but that limits him for a full year, maybe two while he gets built up. Still, he's an intriguing 2nd day prospect.

[Box_O_Rocks]

ILB prospects:

1. A nose for the ball.
2. An ability to play through trash.
3. An ability to fight off blocks.
4. Great tacklers.

Minimum measurables: 240 lbs, 5'11", 4.8-ish 40

1st round:

Chad Greenway, Iowa, 6'2.5" 242 4.75. I see him in Phifer's coverage role as opposed to an every down player. He could eventually work his way into an every down role as he builds up strength and bulk.
http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sco...dgreenway.html

2nd round: None.

3rd round:

Chris Gocong, Cal-Poly, 6'2" 263 4.70. As already noted he demonstrated an ability to find the ball quickly with his play in the Shrine Game - I also liked his lane discipline. Draft Daddy http://www.draftdaddy.com/prospects/EastWest.cfm had this to say.

Small school prospect showed top level burst, first step on sack and multiple hurries of the quarterback. Stout against the run, especially back-side.

He looked good in drills at the Combine and has pretty impressive stats: http://condraft.com/player.php?id=498

2005: 98 tackles, 31 TFL, 23.5 sacks, 14 QB pressures, 4 PD, 2 FR, 4 FF
2004: 71 tackles, 21.5 TFL, 17.5 sacks, blocked kick, 2 FF
2003: 37 tackles, 8 TFL, sack

Chris Gocong came out of Carpinteria HS (Santa Barbara, CA), where he racked up over 150 tackles in both his junior and senior seasons at linebacker. He also started at option quarterback his junior and senior seasons. This is pretty amazing considering he never played football, at all, until his freshman year. After playing in 6 games as a true freshman filling in for an injured lineman and redshirting the next year, Chris started at the nose in the 3-4 in his third season. He was a bit undersized for that position, and his production suffered, registering only one sack. In his fourth season though, he moved to end and exploded on the scene with 17.5 sacks. He finished second for the Buck Buchanan Award only to teammate Jordan Beck (now with the Atlanta Falcons).

Beck is 30 lbs lighter and listed as a LB for Atlanta, NFL.com has no stats for him.

Tim McGarigle, Northwestern, 6' 242 4.73. NCAA's all-time leading tackler with 545 take downs. http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sco...mcgarigle.html From my Shrine Game notes:

Tim McGarigle (Northwestern) immediately caught my eye when he took on 340 pound Aaron Merz (California) and won the head to head. McGarigle is Vilma-size, a little small for a 3-4 ILB, but he was a ball magnet and unafraid of engaging the big boys in the trenches.

Tim Dobbins, Iowa St., 6'1" 246 4.63. More of a two down run stuffer, but could learn coverage skills. http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sco...imdobbins.html


Mike Kudla, Ohio St., 6'1.5" 265 4.70. The Huddle Report had him as one of their features and listed his strengths:

He is very strong and fast and has the athleticism to play a few different positions. When Mike plays, he is always being double-teamed because one O-lineman cannot handle him. He has a great burst off the line and is relentless in pursuit until he hears the whistle. He can play LB just as good as he can play DE.

His weakness is the injuries he wracked up playing with reckless abandon.