2009 Preview - Where's the talent? - Page 3 - New England Patriots Forums

Ochmed Jones · 09-18-2008, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillEM

2009 Team Needs

ILB - Starter - Or atleast someone to split snaps with Bruschi and eventually replace him. ILB is a must in the first round unless there's a really good can't-miss prospect that slips to us.

SS - Starter/Depth - Is James Sanders really the future when Rodney retires? I don't think so. I'm not a fan of Sanders as he lets up some big plays and misses quite a few tackles. I hope we draft his replacement in the 2nd round.

CB - Depth - Hobbs and ONeal look good so far. Wheatley will eventually become a starter. Wilhite looks like a decent depth/ST player. Still, a CB in the 2nd/3rd or 4th(at latest) is a must. Unless ofcourse we find something in Free Agency or make a big trade. More likely scenerio though, we draft one.

Other than that, there aren't any needs. WR could use some youth. Though after the Chad Jackson BUST, I doubt we use a high pick on WR again. Our Offense is set right now. WR's are solid, QB is the best in the game, OLine is one of the best in the league, RB's are all good. The Defense is the main area of focus. I think we go Defense with our first 3 picks to fill those needs, then draft a WR and Guard in the later rounds.

I still think our #1 most burning need is a pass rushing OLB demon that can get help get this defense off the field on third and long. Even KC converted 50% of their third downs against our defense.

dryheat44 · 09-18-2008, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ochmed Jones

I still think our #1 most burning need is a pass rushing OLB demon that can get help get this defense off the field on third and long. Even KC converted 50% of their third downs against our defense.

Well, right now we have Vrabel and Adalius, who can still bring it, and young players like Woods and Crable, who may or may not be able to fill that role. With BB spending a 3 on Crable last year, I would hope he's that guy, although I've pushed hard for Spencer and Groves in the last two drafts, so I know where you're coming from.

I think our bigger needs are all-around TE and a safety who can preferably play both positions. I really like Will Moore out of Mizzou. As for TEs, I like Beckum in the passing game...he strikes me as a Dave Thomas type. But I think BB might want more of an athletic freak who can also block. Maybe Pettigrew is that guy, or the guy from BC (Pervis?) but I want to take a look at Bear Pascoe at Fresno.

And I would love to find a way to get Darrius Hayward-Bey to Foxboro.

***cstjohn17*** · 09-18-2008, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dryheat44

Well, right now we have Vrabel and Adalius, who can still bring it, and young players like Woods and Crable, who may or may not be able to fill that role. With BB spending a 3 on Crable last year, I would hope he's that guy, although I've pushed hard for Spencer and Groves in the last two drafts, so I know where you're coming from.

I think our bigger needs are all-around TE and a safety who can preferably play both positions. I really like Will Moore out of Mizzou. As for TEs, I like Beckum in the passing game...he strikes me as a Dave Thomas type. But I think BB might want more of an athletic freak who can also block. Maybe Pettigrew is that guy, or the guy from BC (Pervis?) but I want to take a look at Bear Pascoe at Fresno.

And I would love to find a way to get Darrius Hayward-Bey to Foxboro.

Here is a good list from the National Football Post, early top 100.
The National Football Post | Top 100 Prospects

Almost all the units could use an impact player or more youth. But I agree Safety is a big need along with TE (I am fine with rounds 2nd - 4th round, please not another first round TE). O Line is a concern going forward and even D Line, Seymour and Wilfork are free agents after 2009. One of them will likely be locked up, the other will have to be replaced.

Players I will try to watch (it is damn hard to scout Safeties on tv, most plays you can't even see them on the screen).

William Moore, S, Missouri
Taylor Mays *, S, USC
Myron Rolle *, S, Florida State
Nic Harris, S, Oklahoma
Brandon Pettigrew, TE, Oklahoma State

***KillEM*** · 09-19-2008, 01:00 AM

It would be a shame if we used ANOTHER 1st round pick on a TE.

BB and Pioli are genius when it comes to drafting OLine, DLine, CB's

When it comes to "skill" players... not so much. Look at Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson, even Maroney is somewhat of a bust considering where we picked him. He's more of a #2 change of pace back. Not what you expect from a 1st round RB. Plus we already used two 1st rounders on Graham and Watson at Tight End.

Time to go with Defense. Don't forget in the past few years we've lost a ton of good players on defense; Willie McGinest, Ty Law, Lawyer Milloy, Asante Samuel, Ted Johson, Roman Phifer, Rosevelt Colvin, Junior Seau... and soon Bruschi and Rodney Harrison.

Meriweather, Mayo, Wheatley, and Crable are a good start to rebuilding, but we need more.

As for OLB - Vrabel may be slowing down a bit, but he was still a Pro Bowler last year. So was Adalius Thomas. So with two Pro Bowl OLB's and a young 3rd rounder (Crable) who is looking pretty good, it's doubtful that we draft another OLB unless someone really good slips to us. Like I said before tho, Cushing would be ideal because he could play ILB for the time being and then take over OLB when Vrabel (who's getting up there in age) retires.

Alot of if will depend on how the rookies fare this year. Crable looked good in pre-season. And UDFA Gary Guyton has already passed Eric Alexander on the depth chart and is taking some snaps when Bruschi's off the field.

Ochmed Jones · 09-19-2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillEM

As for OLB - Vrabel may be slowing down a bit, but he was still a Pro Bowler last year. So was Adalius Thomas. So with two Pro Bowl OLB's and a young 3rd rounder (Crable) who is looking pretty good, it's doubtful that we draft another OLB unless someone really good slips to us. Like I said before tho, Cushing would be ideal because he could play ILB for the time being and then take over OLB when Vrabel (who's getting up there in age) retires.

Alot of if will depend on how the rookies fare this year. Crable looked good in pre-season. And UDFA Gary Guyton has already passed Eric Alexander on the depth chart and is taking some snaps when Bruschi's off the field.

If we learned anything from last year, it is that Vrabel will wear down and by week 16, playing on guts and fumes. As for Thomas, who really knows how he will handle a full year at OLB in this defense.
One thing we do know for sure is that Crable's lack of ST ability is keeping off the 45 man roster, at least compared to Woods. Add that with Crable's inability to seal the edge because of his lack of sand in the pants, and Crable could wind up as one of a long list of BB 3rd round flops.

The bottom line is that the 2008 Patriot defense can NOT get off the field on third down against two very weak clubs thus far. Denver, Indy, and San Diego are coming up quick on the schedule, does anybody feel confident that we have the pass rushing threat that can strike fear in the hearts of these opposing QB's? I don't.

Geat safeties and TE's can be found in the later rounds. Great Pass rushers are like free Red Sox tickets, they are extremely hard to find; and when you do find them; they go quick as a blink.

***cstjohn17*** · 09-19-2008, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ochmed Jones

If we learned anything from last year, it is that Vrabel will wear down and by week 16, playing on guts and fumes. As for Thomas, who really knows how he will handle a full year at OLB in this defense.
One thing we do know for sure is that Crable's lack of ST ability is keeping off the 45 man roster, at least compared to Woods. Add that with Crable's inability to seal the edge because of his lack of sand in the pants, and Crable could wind up as one of a long list of BB 3rd round flops.

The bottom line is that the 2008 Patriot defense can NOT get off the field on third down against two very weak clubs thus far. Denver, Indy, and San Diego are coming up quick on the schedule, does anybody feel confident that we have the pass rushing threat that can strike fear in the hearts of these opposing QB's? I don't.

Geat safeties and TE's can be found in the later rounds. Great Pass rushers are like free Red Sox tickets, they are extremely hard to find; and when you do find them; they go quick as a blink.

A lot to swallow in this post, I agree about TEs and Safeties. But everyone knows pass rushers are high value players. They are also damn hard to find in the draft, especially if the team is consistently picking around #30.

Woods is a three year veteran, Crable is a raw rookie of course Woods is getting the nod because of special teams. Woods is excellent on ST, and as fans we undervalue its importance. Slater, Woods, Alexander, Eckel, Izzo, Aiken, Washington, Ventrone are all on the team primarily for special teams. Over 15% of the roster, that doesn't even include specialists.

I really see any of these positions as being a possibility in the first round (S, OT, ILB, OG, OLB, DL, CB, TE, RB) <-- listed in order of need IMO

***KillEM*** · 09-19-2008, 09:36 PM

A lot of great OLB pass rushers go after rd 1 too...

LaMarr Woodley - 2nd round

James Harrison - Undrafted

Joey Porter - 3rd round

Justin Tuck - 3rd round

Shaun Phillips - 4th round

Osi Umenyiora - 2nd round

Jason Taylor - 3rd round

So there you have it. Why pick an OLB in round 1? Who's he going to start ahead of... Vrabel or Thomas? The answer is Neither.

and I'm confident Crable will turn out just fine. Belichick doesnt have too many early round busts on defensive players.

rookBoston · 09-20-2008, 02:58 AM

The last time the college game produced a weak draft class, we ended up with Wes Welker and Randy Moss. More of that, please.

PonyExpress · 09-20-2008, 01:37 PM

Haven't dug into this draft yet. Mayo wasn't even on the 1st radar at this time last season.

There seems like some good talent, from Maualuga to Oher to Wells. Selvie is interesting.

I've been watching Laurinitis for years and have yet to see the 1st rd talent. Poz post injury looked better.

BelizePats · 09-20-2008, 04:39 PM

As to the 2009 draft, I would be so happy to see our first, two seconds and one of the thirds, all be spent on the D. This will serve us very well 2010-13.

I would love to see us draft ILB Ray M out of USC. How we get him though is another story, given we will be drafting 25 on. The thought of him and Mayo plugging the middle of our D for the next 10 years is a nice one!
Rodney needs to be replaced, no doubt about it!
I wish I had time to follow the college game more. I rely on the excellent draftniks on this site for a lot of the info I get on college players.
My positional draft board for 2009

1) ILB
2) SS
2a) OLB
3) CB