2012 Surprises/Disappointments - Page 10 - New England Patriots Forums

***AndyJohnson*** · 01-06-2013, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triumph

Edleman has shown enough to play the slot.

For what team?

***AndyJohnson*** · 01-06-2013, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patfanken

I just wanted to add to my list of biggest disappointments the fact that there are still too many Pats fans who think that Devin McCourty didn't play well at CB this season, despite the fact all the statistical data that comes from stat sites like Football Outsiders, Cold hard Football facts, PFF, etc.

This reminds me of how long it took (years) for Tom Brady to lose the "game manager" label that was put on him early in his career. McCourty had a down year in 2010, which I believe was due to a combination of having to play more man coverage after a lifetime of playing zone, having a lot of very good passes made on him even when he had decent coverage, and then losing confidence which affected his play.

But whatever the reasons were, the fact is his play at CB improved greatly and the stats back it up. Its time for the fans to recognize it too. Now I don't know if CB is even in McCourty's long term future, because he'd done such a nice job at FS. Maybe its just me, but I think he should be recognized for what he accomplished at CB as well. He is by far the most valuable DB on this team.

Bravo. McCourty had trouble last year with closing on receivers going deep. This year he was well above average, yet, like everyone else, was beaten on a few occassions. The sad thing is on this board (and in Gilette) every completion allowed by McCourty is treated like 10 allowed by anyone else.

asfpnepRefugee · 01-06-2013, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1%er

It was adderall not a huge difference maker trust me

That's what his camp said it was. Why do you actually believe it? "Adderall" has just turned into the excuse of the day. I wish the league would publish what the players actually popped for so we wouldn't have to see our intelligence questioned.

***1%er*** · 01-06-2013, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyJohnson

Bravo. McCourty had trouble last year with closing on receivers going deep. This year he was well above average, yet, like everyone else, was beaten on a few occassions. The sad thing is on this board (and in Gilette) every completion allowed by McCourty is treated like 10 allowed by anyone else.

McCourty is a very good #1 CB, a great #2 CB and a great FS.

He had a tough year in 2011 but his return and willingness to switch to safety was a key reason we made it to the SB. I'm with you 100% we have a 3rd year stud and he gets no appreciation from fans.

***Rob0729*** · 01-06-2013, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patfanken

I just wanted to add to my list of biggest disappointments the fact that there are still too many Pats fans who think that Devin McCourty didn't play well at CB this season, despite the fact all the statistical data that comes from stat sites like Football Outsiders, Cold hard Football facts, PFF, etc.

This reminds me of how long it took (years) for Tom Brady to lose the "game manager" label that was put on him early in his career. McCourty had a down year in 2010, which I believe was due to a combination of having to play more man coverage after a lifetime of playing zone, having a lot of very good passes made on him even when he had decent coverage, and then losing confidence which affected his play.

But whatever the reasons were, the fact is his play at CB improved greatly and the stats back it up. Its time for the fans to recognize it too. Now I don't know if CB is even in McCourty's long term future, because he'd done such a nice job at FS. Maybe its just me, but I think he should be recognized for what he accomplished at CB as well. He is by far the most valuable DB on this team.

McCourty suffered this year from Matt Light Disease. Matt Light for years would have solid games where he shut down the guys he defended all game and then late in the game he would let his defender on a single play. Then all you would hear from fans is how Light was a turnstile or he is the worst LT in the league or whatever. Part of the reason is because people didn't notice when he was doing his job correctly because you don't see when an o-lineman performs well.

McCourty is getting the same treatment at CB. He is being damned for a handful of plays and one bad quarter at CB. Ironically, guys like Talib and Dennard are getting praised for inferior play than McCourty performed at CB when he was there.

I think for at least the rest of this year, he is best at FS because I think a good and smart safety to stabilize the secondary is what makes a Belichick defense run at a high level (see Rodney Harrison and Lawyer Milloy) and he is the best secondary player the Pats have. I don't know if long term he is better there or at CB if they can get a very good safety to replace him (I am thinking Ed Reed will be starting at FS next year even if he is showing wear on the tread of his tires).

supafly · 01-06-2013, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob0729

I think for at least the rest of this year, he is best at FS because I think a good and smart safety to stabilize the secondary is what makes a Belichick defense run at a high level (see Rodney Harrison and Lawyer Milloy) and he is the best secondary player the Pats have. I don't know if long term he is better there or at CB if they can get a very good safety to replace him (I am thinking Ed Reed will be starting at FS next year even if he is showing wear on the tread of his tires).

It was my opinion (right or wrong) that the inadequate safety play earlier in the year was greatly affecting our CB's too, and our secondary as a whole in a very negative way. It is no surprise that the secondary really started to gel with the addition of much better safety play, at least in my opinion.

I think the play of D.McCourty is the single biggest reason that the secondary has shown such improvement, although most others feel that it was the addition of Aqib Talib, which I greatly disagree with even despite his obvious positive attributes.

***Rob0729*** · 01-06-2013, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by supafly

It was my opinion (right or wrong) that the inadequate safety play earlier in the year was greatly affecting our CB's too, and our secondary as a whole in a very negative way. It is no surprise that the secondary really started to gel with the addition of much better safety play, at least in my opinion.

I think the play of D.McCourty is the single biggest reason that the secondary has shown such improvement, although most others feel that it was the addition of Aqib Talib, which I greatly disagree with even despite his obvious positive attributes.

I agree that McCourty is the real primary reason the secondary has improved greatly. I think Talib has been overrated for the most part since he has been here. He has been great at times, but mostly he has been adequate at best. He has gotten burnt quite a bit. I think it is the overall improvement of the secondary than any one player, but that has a lot to do with McCourty QBing the secondary.

supafly · 01-06-2013, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob0729

I think Talib has been overrated for the most part since he has been here. He has been great at times, but mostly he has been adequate at best. He has gotten burnt quite a bit.

Those are just some of the reasons why I would be very leery of giving Talib some of the big money quotes that many have come up with in recent days.

He certainly wasn't having anything close to what could have been considered a "good" year prior to coming here, and that isn't even bringing up the suspension or the attitude problems.

I'm thinking that Talib's true value isn't even really known at this point in time, and if it is, it certainly isn't at the 10 million+ per year with almost 30 million guaranteed rate that some are throwing around in comparison to last year's pacts for top tier CB's such as Carr and Finnegan.