Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era - Page 2 - New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard
NEWS
|
FORUM
|
PHOTOS
|
VIDEOS
|
FULL STATS DATABASE
|
PODCAST
|
RUMOR MILL
Get Social With PatsFans.com
Early Roster Projection
Ryan's Journey Started Early
POST DRAFT PODCAST

Go Back   New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard > PatsFans.com Forums > PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum
Forgot Password? Join PatsFans.com!
Register Blogs FAQ Members List Calendar Arcade Mark Forums Read Chat Room

WELCOME TO OUR FORUM HERE AT PATSFANS.COM!
ARE YOU NEW HERE? NOT LOGGED IN? PLEASE TAKE A MOMENT TO REGISTER FOR AN ACCOUNT AND LOGIN TO REMOVE THIS WINDOW

Welcome to PatsFans.com. Do you have an account? If not - please take a moment to register for our forum and experience a much smoother experience with fewer ads, along with no longer having to see this notification window. Also learn about how you can receive a free Patriots T-Shirt from the Patriots Official ProShop by CLICKING HERE. Please enjoy your stay here, and Go Pats!

Like Tree12Likes

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-12-2012, 08:27 AM   #11
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
ForThoseAboutToRock's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 804
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayoclinic View Post
I think that BB is very honest with players, and for the most part I think they appreciate that. It's a brutal business, and he's not sentimental ... But it's not personal, and players understand the nature of the business. ... Cut your losses, don't waste any energy over it, and focus on the team. But it makes for lousy media drama.
Agree again. Being un-sentimental is one of BB's best strengths - I'd even argue it was this trait that let him have the confidence to sit Bledsoe to start a skinny 2nd year dude.

Back to what I've snipped and quoted from you above - the example I think of is Adalius Thomas. The guy was benched and later cut despite being one of the biggest FA acquisitions the Patriots will ever make. I get the impression that, for Adalius, it was personal. He couldn't hack it long term in the Patriots no-nonsense, no coddling environment. He took offense to the environment at times - to the detriment of his performance and the success of the team. Belichick didn't bend the rules for Adalius - now one of them is out of football and the other is atop the AFC East for the millionth time.
The Gr8est and mayoclinic like this.
ForThoseAboutToRock is offline  
FEATURED ADVERTISEMENT
DONATE TO PATSFANS.COM
RECEIVE A FREE PATS T-SHIRT AND SAVE 15% OFF WHEN YOU BUY FROM THE OFFICIAL PROSHOP!

Free T-Shirt & Save 15% Off!
Like Our Site? Please help support our site and server costs by DONATING TO PATSFANS.COM and receive a FREE PATRIOTS T-SHIRT and SAVE 15% off EVERY purchase you make from PatriotsProShop.com. You'll also receive added benefits to your account
including Removing All Ads During Your Experience Here At Our Forum.

NEEDED YEARLY SITE DONATIONS: 345 | CURRENT # OF SUBSCRIBED SUPPORTERS: 98

Updated 07/08/11

Help Us Reach Our Goal!

Old 12-12-2012, 09:05 AM   #12
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
mayoclinic's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 9,780
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForThoseAboutToRock View Post
Agree again. Being un-sentimental is one of BB's best strengths - I'd even argue it was this trait that let him have the confidence to sit Bledsoe to start a skinny 2nd year dude.

Back to what I've snipped and quoted from you above - the example I think of is Adalius Thomas. The guy was benched and later cut despite being one of the biggest FA acquisitions the Patriots will ever make. I get the impression that, for Adalius, it was personal. He couldn't hack it long term in the Patriots no-nonsense, no coddling environment. He took offense to the environment at times - to the detriment of his performance and the success of the team. Belichick didn't bend the rules for Adalius - now one of them is out of football and the other is atop the AFC East for the millionth time.
BB has some flexibility, but it has a limit, and no one is above the team. Moss and Seymour were traded, Branch traded when things couldn't be worked out, Samuel allowed to leave in FA. Mankins sat out half a season when he got miffed, and Waters ended up sitting home this season. No one makes a big deal of it, they just say "we have to make do with the guys who are here" and go on. Guys like Brady and Wilfork have shown that they are willing to work within the system, and they are very cognizant that they are part of a team, no matter how great they are on an individual level. That's part of the value of having guys like Rob Gronkowski play on special teams. It carries some risk, but it sends a message about teamwork. And so far the other players have stepped up in his absence, which should only help the team when he returns.

AD not only wasn't willing to step up, he dragged the team down in 2009. That was an unforgivable sin.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"OVER Loading at ANY position can create a Fatal Advantage. THAT is what interests ME. Attacking With Concentrated Force. THAT is what WINS. In the words ~ more or less ~ of General Patton: 'I'm fighting a WAR, here. Let the B*****ES worry about their FLANKS.' " - Off the Grid

"The key to any successful organization is to anticipate things, not react to them." - Michael Lombardi
mayoclinic is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 09:15 AM   #13
On The Game Day Roster
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 395
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Agreed --- and this cyclical nature should be a decent indicator of where the Patriots will be looking to draft in the next two cycles, or at least a consideration in the Best Available Player at a Position of Need and Value schema. Right now Interior O-line is a bit expensive (albeit working at good productive value) as the two guards are off their rookie contracts, with one, Mankins, whose contract is included in Transition tag calculations for his position. So as running backs get comparatively more expensive, proportional savings may be found on the O-line, especially if we think that there are soft budget constraints for the offensive, defensive and special teams coordinators.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayoclinic View Post
The salary cap forces you to pick where you want to put your money.

I'd say right now that the DB position is fairly cheap. McCourty, Talib, Chung and Wilson are all still on rookie deals. Dennard is a started making late round rookie money. Arrington is making RFA money. Gregory got a decent deal, but peanuts compared to the big money some teams have shelled out to starting DBs. The rest are getting chump change.

RB is obviously the best price/performer on the team right now, as TE was last year. That will change, but there will be positional cycles.
__________________
Come on over to the Newshoggers for blogging on economics, football, policy analysis,and beer:


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
fester is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 09:21 AM   #14
Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
 
IllegalContact's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 7,650
My Mood: Amused
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

the pats won 3 superbowls with a cheap offense and an expensive defense

they haven't won any with an expensive offense and a cheap(relatively speaking) defense.
__________________
“ I think good coaches will coach with the personnel they have, and if you only have one (good) linebacker, you’re not going to play a 3–4. ”
—Hank Bullough, who installed one of the first 3–4 defenses with the New England Patriots.
IllegalContact is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 09:27 AM   #15
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
mayoclinic's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 9,780
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by fester View Post
Agreed --- and this cyclical nature should be a decent indicator of where the Patriots will be looking to draft in the next two cycles, or at least a consideration in the Best Available Player at a Position of Need and Value schema. Right now Interior O-line is a bit expensive (albeit working at good productive value) as the two guards are off their rookie contracts, with one, Mankins, whose contract is included in Transition tag calculations for his position. So as running backs get comparatively more expensive, proportional savings may be found on the O-line, especially if we think that there are soft budget constraints for the offensive, defensive and special teams coordinators.
Tackle will probably get more expensive, assuming the team extends Vollmer. This year it has been dirt cheap with the retirement of Matt Light. Solder, Vollmer and Cannon are all on rookie deals. But even if Vollmer is extended it won't be terrible compared to many teams.

Interior OL cost has been mainly driven by Mankins. Connolly's salary is reasonable, and the rest are fairly inexpensive: Wendell, McDonald, Thomas. Mankins has base salaries of $5.75M, $6.25M, $6.75M and $6.75M over the next 4 years. He'll turn 31 in March, and he's been banged up. So it's not inconceivable that he could not play out the remainder of his contract.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"OVER Loading at ANY position can create a Fatal Advantage. THAT is what interests ME. Attacking With Concentrated Force. THAT is what WINS. In the words ~ more or less ~ of General Patton: 'I'm fighting a WAR, here. Let the B*****ES worry about their FLANKS.' " - Off the Grid

"The key to any successful organization is to anticipate things, not react to them." - Michael Lombardi
mayoclinic is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 11:43 AM   #16
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
ForThoseAboutToRock's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 804
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

My impression is that BB has attempted to mitigate what should've been an enormous surge in the cost of the TE's by the early extensions that Gronk and Hernandez got this year. Even though it's more money than paying two rookies, it feels to me to be very economical - especially given how they can both back each other up and complement each other on the field at the same time.

The bump in the pay for those two guys isn't as high as it could've been, had they not planned well in advance for it.
ForThoseAboutToRock is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 12:09 PM   #17
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
ctpatsfan77's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Fairfield County, CT
Posts: 17,587
My Mood: Grumpy
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForThoseAboutToRock View Post
Agree again. Being un-sentimental is one of BB's best strengths - I'd even argue it was this trait that let him have the confidence to sit Bledsoe to start a skinny 2nd year dude.

Back to what I've snipped and quoted from you above - the example I think of is Adalius Thomas. The guy was benched and later cut despite being one of the biggest FA acquisitions the Patriots will ever make. I get the impression that, for Adalius, it was personal. He couldn't hack it long term in the Patriots no-nonsense, no coddling environment. He took offense to the environment at times - to the detriment of his performance and the success of the team. Belichick didn't bend the rules for Adalius - now one of them is out of football and the other is atop the AFC East for the millionth time.
And then he acted like a **** when he knew there was nothing the Patriots could do about his contract in 2009. Of course, they cut him in 2010 and he hasn't played a down since.

I also find it quite amusing that the day they deactivated him was the day they went 59-0 on the Titans.
Off The Grid likes this.
__________________
"Momentum was quickly snatched away by New England, who once again proved that any Patriot, at any moment, can make a play." —Inside the NFL, Packers v. Patriots

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
ctpatsfan77 is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 12:10 PM   #18
PatsFans.com Supporter
 
ctpatsfan77's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Fairfield County, CT
Posts: 17,587
My Mood: Grumpy
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by IllegalContact View Post
the pats won 3 superbowls with a cheap offense and an expensive defense

they haven't won any with an expensive offense and a cheap(relatively speaking) defense.
Correlation != causation.
__________________
"Momentum was quickly snatched away by New England, who once again proved that any Patriot, at any moment, can make a play." —Inside the NFL, Packers v. Patriots

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
ctpatsfan77 is offline  
Old 12-12-2012, 03:11 PM   #19
Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
 

Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,118
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

While technically the Patriot have not lost a "starter" to IR, the situation at CB would be much better with a big, talented CB like Ras-I Dowling available.

Similarly, the LB position and the forced play of Donta Hightower before he was ready, would have been much better with the availability of Dane Fletcher.

The Defensive line would have been much better without having to overplay Vince Wilfork if Fanene and Pryor were available.
AzPatsFan is online now  
Old 12-12-2012, 03:28 PM   #20
Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
 
Fencer's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,399
My Mood: Grumpy
Default Re: Mountain Climbing in the Salary Cap Era

Quote:
Originally Posted by ctpatsfan77 View Post
That really has almost no effect on the salary cap: at that point in the season, only the top 51 players' hits count towards the cap anyways.
Guaranteed money affects the salary cap all season long.
__________________
"To lose one parent may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both looks like carelessness." -- Oscar Wilde
Fencer is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Sponsored Links



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Updated Salary Cap Numbers - Remaining Salary ausbacker PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum 9 08-30-2011 04:22 PM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2

© Copyright 2000-2012. PatsFans.com Is a Partner of USA TODAY Sports Digital Properties.
The opinions posted in this forum do not necessarily reflect the opinions of our staff at PatsFans.com or USA Today.
We are not affiliated with the New England Patriots™ or the NFL™. The Photo Used In the header was taken by Ian Logue.

This site is owned and operated by I&K Internet Design Enterprises, LLC