ARE YOU NEW HERE? NOT LOGGED IN? PLEASE TAKE A MOMENT TO REGISTER FOR AN ACCOUNT AND LOGIN TO REMOVE THIS WINDOW
Welcome to PatsFans.com. Do you have an account? If not - please take a moment to register for our forum and experience a much smoother experience with fewer ads, along with no longer having to see this notification window. Also learn about how you can receive a free Patriots T-Shirt from the Patriots Official ProShop by CLICKING HERE. Please enjoy your stay here, and Go Pats!
I had a different question on the same play. The way I saw it, on a play where they had stopped Greene cold on 4th down. Greene fumbles the ball forward (Illegal I thought) and the end result is the Pats lose about 12 yds, plus they ran the small risk that the Jets could recover the ball. On that fumble the Jets had no downside, and had everything to gain. Fumbles aren't supposed to work that way. In the end, all I could think was, "what's up with that."
And whats even more surprising (at least to me) is not a single member of the media or board has commented on it.
The rules for advancing a forward fumble are funny they differ from 4th down and other plays and also inside of the two minute warning. But in all aspects it is in play for, and this being 4th down it was in play, it reads the offense can't advance a forward fumble so had the offense recovered it would have gone back to the spot it was fumbled.
Some people think it was stuffed and we lost 12 yards but who knows how far Greene could of stretched it had Spikes not been there. Awesome play by an awesome heady player.
__________________
"We go down to New Orleans, and ain't anybody give us a chance? Nobody! And what did we say to them?"
"DON'T TALK TO ME!!!"
FEATURED ADVERTISEMENT
DONATE TO PATSFANS.COM
RECEIVE A FREE PATS T-SHIRT AND SAVE 15% OFF WHEN YOU BUY FROM THE OFFICIAL PROSHOP!
Free T-Shirt & Save 15% Off!
Like Our Site? Please help support our site and server costs by DONATING TO PATSFANS.COM and receive a FREE PATRIOTS T-SHIRT and SAVE 15% off EVERY purchase you make from PatriotsProShop.com. You'll also receive added benefits to your account including Removing All Ads During Your Experience Here At Our Forum.
NEEDED YEARLY SITE DONATIONS: 345 | CURRENT # OF SUBSCRIBED SUPPORTERS: 98
The rules for advancing a forward fumble are funny they differ from 4th down and other plays and also inside of the two minute warning. But in all aspects it is in play for, and this being 4th down it was in play, it reads the offense can't advance a forward fumble so had the offense recovered it would have gone back to the spot it was fumbled.
Some people think it was stuffed and we lost 12 yards but who knows how far Greene could of stretched it had Spikes not been there. Awesome play by an awesome heady player.
OK, so let me get this straight. Had the Jets recovered the fumble on the 17, the officials would have brought the ball back to the spot of the fumble, which we all know was short of the first down marker. That makes sense, btw.
Thanks to you an Mo for the explanation. Interesting thought though. Assuming Gregory knows the rule, AND assuming he realizes the Greene didn't make it. Can you imagine the confusion of watching the Pats allow a Jet player to recover a fumble....and then watch the ball go back to the spot of the fumble.....Pats ball.
Of course I understand that in the heat of the game you'd never take that chance and Gregory did the right thing, but its fun to think about all those Jets fans whose heads would have exploded if they'd seen that turn of events
OK, so let me get this straight. Had the Jets recovered the fumble on the 17, the officials would have brought the ball back to the spot of the fumble, which we all know was short of the first down marker. That makes sense, btw.
Thanks to you an Mo for the explanation. Interesting thought though. Assuming Gregory knows the rule, AND assuming he realizes the Greene didn't make it. Can you imagine the confusion of watching the Pats allow a Jet player to recover a fumble....and then watch the ball go back to the spot of the fumble.....Pats ball.
Of course I understand that in the heat of the game you'd never take that chance and Gregory did the right thing, but its fun to think about all those Jets fans whose heads would have exploded if they'd seen that turn of events
THe evil Kraft/Belichick/Patriots conspiracy types would have blamed the loss of the entire game and missing a playoff berth on the refs in that one play. Woulda been classic!
Great thread, OP, smg93. And great informative responses.
__________________
Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded — here and there, now and then — are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty.
This is known as "bad luck." RAH
I think Greene actually believed he could get a first down there by "breaking the plane." More great coaching.
To be honest that looked a poorly coached, poorly prepared team, dearth of talent aside. Something is wrong at a fundamental level with that team. The Browns look like they are going in the right direction in comparison, and that would scare any sane Jets fan.
to be honest that looked a poorly coached, poorly prepared team, dearth of talent aside. Something is wrong at a fundamental level with that team. The browns look like they are going in the right direction in comparison, and that would scare any sane jets fan, could one be found.
..............
__________________
My prized possessions: Our family pictures; my dad and me getting doused by Bruschi in Super Bowl XXXIX [Shalize Manza Young Up Close with ... Bill Belichick]
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
They say what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Well, Pats fans should be invincible by now. [Fitzy, 16 November 2009]
I had a different question on the same play. The way I saw it, on a play where they had stopped Greene cold on 4th down. Greene fumbles the ball forward (Illegal I thought) and the end result is the Pats lose about 12 yds, plus they ran the small risk that the Jets could recover the ball.
Forward fumbles aren't illegal. A forward fumble isn't the same as a forward pass (which is illegal past the LOS), unless the refs consider it an intentional forward fumble, in which case it is considered a forward pass.
However, on 4th down (and in the last two minutes of the half) a fumble (forward or backward) can only be advanced on offense by the player who fumbled it. In other words, if a Jet other than Greene had recovered that fumble the play would be immediately dead, it would be Jets' ball, but it would be marked back to the point of the fumble (or to the spot of the recovery if the recovery spot is behind the fumble spot) . This is the rule change that was made after the Holy Roller play all those years ago.
However, on 4th down (and in the last two minutes of the half) a fumble (forward or backward) can only be advanced on offense by the player who fumbled it. In other words, if a Jet other than Greene had recovered that fumble the play would be immediately dead, it would be Jets' ball, but it would be marked back to the point of the fumble (or to the spot of the recovery if the recovery spot is behind the fumble spot) . This is the rule change that was made after the Holy Roller play all those years ago.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoLewisrocks
It comes back to the spot of the fumble on a 4th down or within 2 minutes of a half ending unless the player who fumbled it recovers it. He is the only player on offense allowed to advance a ball under those circumstances.
Thanks for the clarifications. So even if the Jets would have recovered that ball it'd have been ours since the spot of the fumble was behind the first down marker?
__________________
Organized madness
The young Gott-stra
Young Frank Sinatra
7Likes
Re: Shonn Greene Fumble
Linear Mode
