KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated - New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard
NEWS
|
FORUM
|
PHOTOS
|
VIDEOS
|
FULL STATS DATABASE
|
PODCAST
|
RUMOR MILL
Get Social With PatsFans.com
Early Roster Projection
Ryan's Journey Started Early
POST DRAFT PODCAST

Go Back   New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard > PatsFans.com Forums > PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum
Forgot Password? Join PatsFans.com!
Register Blogs FAQ Members List Calendar Arcade Mark Forums Read Chat Room

WELCOME TO OUR FORUM HERE AT PATSFANS.COM!
ARE YOU NEW HERE? NOT LOGGED IN? PLEASE TAKE A MOMENT TO REGISTER FOR AN ACCOUNT AND LOGIN TO REMOVE THIS WINDOW

Welcome to PatsFans.com. Do you have an account? If not - please take a moment to register for our forum and experience a much smoother experience with fewer ads, along with no longer having to see this notification window. Also learn about how you can receive a free Patriots T-Shirt from the Patriots Official ProShop by CLICKING HERE. Please enjoy your stay here, and Go Pats!

Like Tree13Likes

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-19-2012, 01:43 PM   #1
In the Starting Line-up
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,061
Default KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

The New England Patriots' defense is underrated - NFL - ESPN

Decent read, although not much that we haven't heard about from Pats statheads all year. If you don't have ESPN insider, I'll summarize:

-Joyner points out the obvious fact that yards allowed are often not the most indicative stats. He also notes, though, though that the Pats are near the last in yards per play

-Pats ranked 15th in points allowed, but had they allowed just one less point per game, they would have been top 10.

-Joyner looks at some advanced stats and notices that although they get a lot of sacks and interceptions, the interceptions were not often the result of bad quarterback decisions. Rather, they were forced by an opportunistic defense. Joyner seems to speculate that Belichick has not opened up a lot of creative gameplanning to fool opposing QBs. Not sure if that means there is still more up Bill's sleeve, or if he just thinks it's not a good idea with this defense.

-Also notes that the Pats intercept the ball about 65% of the time when they have an opportunity to do so. 50% is considered very good, so he suggests that Belichick emphasize capitalizing on interceptions more than anything else.

-Although the Pats have allowed the most 20+ yard plays in the NFL, they have not allowed many 40+ yard plays. So, while they give up a lot of big plays, they don't give up many huge, gamebreaking plays. (I can't remember many besides the Eagles, Bills, and Giants game.)

-The part that's disappointing about this article is Joyner didn't really look at any individual players or packages. He just looked at the overall team unit in terms of results.

Last edited by Ice_Ice_Brady; 01-19-2012 at 01:44 PM..
Ice_Ice_Brady is offline  
FEATURED ADVERTISEMENT
DONATE TO PATSFANS.COM
RECEIVE A FREE PATS T-SHIRT AND SAVE 15% OFF WHEN YOU BUY FROM THE OFFICIAL PROSHOP!

Free T-Shirt & Save 15% Off!
Like Our Site? Please help support our site and server costs by DONATING TO PATSFANS.COM and receive a FREE PATRIOTS T-SHIRT and SAVE 15% off EVERY purchase you make from PatriotsProShop.com. You'll also receive added benefits to your account
including Removing All Ads During Your Experience Here At Our Forum.

NEEDED YEARLY SITE DONATIONS: 345 | CURRENT # OF SUBSCRIBED SUPPORTERS: 98

Updated 07/08/11

Help Us Reach Our Goal!

Old 01-19-2012, 02:29 PM   #2
On the Roster
 

Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 89
My Mood: Happy
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

"Joyner seems to speculate that Belichick has not opened up a lot of creative gameplanning to fool opposing QBs. Not sure if that means there is still more up Bill's sleeve, or if he just thinks it's not a good idea with this defense."


This I agree with whole heartedly. The Pats defense has been very vanilla this year. IMO Belichick doesnt get creative until his defense can prove it can do the basics. With all the turnover in the secondary they spent all their effort just getting the basics down.

That is actually a positive for our playoff run, there isnt a lot of tape on the Patriots doing anything exotic.

Denver was completely unprepared for our DLine running stunts on what seemed like every other play, probably because we have not done much of it this year and they had no film of it.

With our defense as healthy as it has been all year, Belichick now has the ability to dial up some Coverages that have not been used all year.


Edit: Posting frequency 0.03 posts per day! haha

Last edited by hughthehand; 01-19-2012 at 02:31 PM..
hughthehand is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:38 PM   #3
Third String But Playing on Special Teams
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 563
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

It's impossible to gauge the defense w/ the level of competition they have had, particularly in the 2nd half of the season & so far in the playoffs.

They have played a series of 2nd string QB's and lower tier QB's, and teams that had offenses who were struggling in general. They have not played quality competition.

Even Baltimore's offense isn't that good, but it will be the 1st real test the D has had in months.
Fball is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:40 PM   #4
2nd Team Getting Their First Start
 

Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,895
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

I agree with Joyner's premise that the Patriots' defense is underrated. If I had a dollar for every time over the course of the season I have heard or read 'worst defense ever', 'worst defense in the league', or the current '31st defense' I could pay next month's mortgage with plenty left over.

The Patriots defense is not elite; it's somewhere around the middle of the pack. Kudos to him for being someone in the national media that finally mentions points rather than yardage.
Ron Sellers is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:42 PM   #5
In the Starting Line-up
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,625
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fball View Post
It's impossible to gauge the defense w/ the level of competition they have had, particularly in the 2nd half of the season & so far in the playoffs.

They have played a series of 2nd string QB's and lower tier QB's, and teams that had offenses who were struggling in general. They have not played quality competition.

Even Baltimore's offense isn't that good, but it will be the 1st real test the D has had in months.
A good point. I'm optimistic though for three reasons. 1. The speed on defense is undeniable, especially with McCourty at safety. 2. Kyle Love is locking down the nose, allowing Vince to be more disruptive 3. Belichick is clearly happy with this team and I get the feeling they have the ability to listen and learn on a week to week basis for gameplanning purposes.
letekro is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:52 PM   #6
In the Starting Line-up
 
patfanken's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Canton MA
Posts: 4,889
My Mood: Buzzed
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fball View Post
It's impossible to gauge the defense w/ the level of competition they have had, particularly in the 2nd half of the season & so far in the playoffs.

They have played a series of 2nd string QB's and lower tier QB's, and teams that had offenses who were struggling in general. They have not played quality competition.

Even Baltimore's offense isn't that good, but it will be the 1st real test the D has had in months.
The reason why the defenses have been so vanilla isn't that BB has been holding back for AFCCG, its because he's been missing his most important pieces. Think about it. He's had to play a majority of the season without:

Chung,
Barrett
Dowling
Boddin
Pryor
Fletcher
Spikes
Wright

When you are playing with the likes of Sergio Brown and assorted WR and UDFA pick ups, don't you think you might want to KEEP IT SIMPLE. Its frustrating to think what this defense MIGHT have evolved into if most of the players listed had remained healthy. On the bright side, having Chung, Spikes, and Fletcher back for a couple of games now, might allow BB to get a little creative as least

FBall I would remind you that this defense just completely shut down (15 negative plays) an offense that put up close to 500 yds of offense against the #1 rated defense in the league, so I wouldn't undersell them because a month or two ago they gave up a bunch of garbage time points and yards to the likes of Orlovsky and Palko
patfanken is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:59 PM   #7
All Pro Poster
 
upstater1's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,795
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fball View Post
It's impossible to gauge the defense w/ the level of competition they have had, particularly in the 2nd half of the season & so far in the playoffs.

They have played a series of 2nd string QB's and lower tier QB's, and teams that had offenses who were struggling in general. They have not played quality competition.

Even Baltimore's offense isn't that good, but it will be the 1st real test the D has had in months.
Tell you what, I'd rather face Baltimore's offense than say Buffalo or especially Philadelphia's
Gwedd likes this.
upstater1 is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 03:02 PM   #8
Third String But Playing on Special Teams
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 563
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Quote:
Originally Posted by patfanken View Post
The reason why the defenses have been so vanilla isn't that BB has been holding back for AFCCG, its because he's been missing his most important pieces. Think about it. He's had to play a majority of the season without:

Chung,
Barrett
Dowling
Boddin
Pryor
Fletcher
Spikes
Wright

When you are playing with the likes of Sergio Brown and assorted WR and UDFA pick ups, don't you think you might want to KEEP IT SIMPLE. Its frustrating to think what this defense MIGHT have evolved into if most of the players listed had remained healthy. On the bright side, having Chung, Spikes, and Fletcher back for a couple of games now, might allow BB to get a little creative as least

FBall I would remind you that this defense just completely shut down (15 negative plays) an offense that put up close to 500 yds of offense against the #1 rated defense in the league, so I wouldn't undersell them because a month or two ago they gave up a bunch of garbage time points and yards to the likes of Orlovsky and Palko
The D had one of the most dominant performances against Denver last weekend as I've seen any D have against any team all year.

But, it's still tough to gauge. Denver's O is what it is - Tebow played the absolute game of his life against Pittsburgh. It will likely be the pinnacle game of his career, barring major improvement in his skills. Add to the fact that he was playing from behind the entire Pats game. As one announcer pointed out, that O-line just wasn't practiced in pass blocking so much in a game.

I really can't read that much into last week. It was a great defensive performance, but against an O that simply isn't good.
Fball is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 03:11 PM   #9
In the Starting Line-up
 
Metaphors's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,662
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice_Ice_Brady View Post
-Pats ranked 15th in points allowed, but had they allowed just one less point per game, they would have been top 10.
I'll go one further. If the Pats were historically bad (as several mediots have indicated) then they should be getting ripped up in the 2nd half of games. That just isn't happening. In fact, after the 1st Jets game, the Pats have only had 2 games where they surrendered more than 7 points in the 2nd half...24 against the Giants and 21 against the Colts. The Giants game was infuriating with the PI calls and Goober Jr. throwing no-look downfield passes, while the Colts game was just a case of the defense losing focus in a blowout. BTW, the Pats defense gave up only 3 points combined in the 1st half of those games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice_Ice_Brady View Post
Joyner seems to speculate that Belichick has not opened up a lot of creative gameplanning to fool opposing QBs. Not sure if that means there is still more up Bill's sleeve, or if he just thinks it's not a good idea with this defense.
Been saying this all year. Belichick is responsible for 2 of the greatest gameplans of all time (Giants vs. Bills and Pats vs. Rams) and yet he continually threw out very basic gameplans this season. I figure it was a combination of focusing on the basics and not wanting to put anything on tape for his playoff opponents.

Now that the playoffs have started? Well the gameplan against the Broncos was pretty much perfect. Doesn't mean he will ace the gameplan against the Ravens or that the Pats have the horses to pull it off, but I'm optimistic.
ay-yo likes this.
Metaphors is offline  
Old 01-19-2012, 03:15 PM   #10
In the Starting Line-up
 

Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,929
Default Re: KC Joyner: New England Patriots' defense underrated

Lets not forget they played denver and Tebow last week.If Flacco has all day to throw then he will carve this secondary up.They have to make him uncomfortable.
D-Money is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Sponsored Links



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pats Defense: Underrated? (& a blown punt!?!?!) RodRustsGhost PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum 3 01-13-2008 11:22 AM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2

© Copyright 2000-2012. PatsFans.com Is a Partner of USA TODAY Sports Digital Properties.
The opinions posted in this forum do not necessarily reflect the opinions of our staff at PatsFans.com or USA Today.
We are not affiliated with the New England Patriots™ or the NFL™. The Photo Used In the header was taken by Ian Logue.

This site is owned and operated by I&K Internet Design Enterprises, LLC