One Way Parcells Was Better Than Belichick - Page 2 - New England Patriots Forums

***DarrylS*** · 03-16-2007, 01:31 PM

The Mike Woicjik being possibly responsible for the injuries comes up about once a month, and then we have to put it to bed for the next month, FYI he has the most superbowl rings of any coach of player(6).

http://www.patriots.com/team/index.c...achbio&bio=532

Mike Woicik was named the Patriots strength and conditioning coach on Bill Belichick's staff on Feb. 16, 2000. The 29-year coaching veteran is now in his 17th season in the NFL and has initiated strength and conditioning programs that have contributed to the success of six Super Bowl Championship teams, three with the Patriots and three with the Dallas Cowboys. Woicik's six Super Bowl rings are more than any player or head coach in NFL history has earned. Woicik is a two-time winner of the Professional Football Strength and Conditioning Society's Coach of the Year Award, earning the honor in 1992 and 2004.
Woicik's year-round conditioning program has proven to be a significant factor in the Patriots' success, as the team has remained fresh and saved its best football for the end of the season. Since 2001, New England has compiled a 46-9 (.836) record in games played after November 1, a record that exemplifies the solid conditioning approach employed by Woicik. Additionally, New England has been able to sustain lengthy winning streaks during Woicik's tenure, compiling an NFL-record 21-game winning streak from 2003-04 and also achieving a 12-game winning streak from 2001-02.

Woicik entered the NFL coaching ranks with the Dallas Cowboys in 1990 and was voted the NFL's "Strength Coach of the Year" in 1992. During his seven seasons (1990-96) with the Cowboys, the team totaled an 89-38 record, including 12 playoff victories and three Super Bowl championships.

Prior to joining the Patriots, he spent three seasons with the New Orleans Saints (1997-99) working under head coach Mike Ditka.

***PATSNUTme*** · 03-16-2007, 01:43 PM

I guess people have to point their finger at someone to explain their reasoning.

This thread was started on the premise that Parcells teams had less injuries than BB teams, so Parcells is better in that way. This was done without one shread of evidence to back it up.

So, lets blame the S/C coach, who happens tot be one of the most respected in football. Not, my opinion, but the opinion of another NFL S/C who I happen to know.

aluminum seats · 03-16-2007, 02:08 PM

Wow, some real testiness on these last couple of posts. GJAJ15, if a topic has come up before, I’m not surprised. This board is wide open for threads, so I’m sure everything is repeated. It’s not something I’ve specifically seen, but I wouldn’t doubt it’s been raised before. I brought up the topic because I think it’s interesting.

I did NOT say that Mike Woicjik is responsible for the Pats having huge numbers of injuries the past few years, I simply noted that in comparison to what I RECALL over the years with Parcells’ teams, there seems to be more. PatsNut, I’m not “pointing my finger at someone to explain my reasoning”, I’m asking why a perception that I have regarding the two may (or may not) be true. So take a deep breath and relax. There’s been some intesting posts on this thread about different philosophies regarding injuries, the element of luck, etc. It’s clearly a topic that pertains to the Patriots as of late. If you don’t think so, you haven’t been paying attention.

SamBam39 · 03-16-2007, 02:14 PM

I'd like to see some statistical data if it were available to show just exactly how different the volume of time missed from games there is between BB run teams and Parcells run teams. I do think the Pats have had to deal with alot the past couple of seasons, but it would surprise me if there was a definate difference year after year between the two.

All I know is, BB leads us to super bowl wins, so he's obviously doing all the right things!

VJCPatriot · 03-16-2007, 02:30 PM

I'd rather have 3 rings and a rash of injuries yearly than 0 rings, broken promises, and then Parcells hightailing it out of town on the midnight train.

Besides don't injuries have MORE to do with a team's training staff/physicians/health care professionals? We wouldn't want to attribute HEALTH problems to the guys actually responsible now would we?
PS with no statistical data backup or investigative reports or even anecdotal evidence the premise of this thread looks like complete hogwash.
It holds about as much water as LT's now retracted famous statement that the "lack of class" shown by the Pats was due to the Head Coach.

aluminum seats · 03-16-2007, 02:49 PM

Certainly injuries might have something to do with a team’s training staff/physicians/health care professionals. Many possibilities—that’s why I’m asking the question. I do think Bill Belichick would be the first to say that he bears responsibility for what happens on his team, though—don’t think he’d the pass the buck to the training staff. The anecdotal evidence comes from my recollection; you’re right, I have yet to conduct an investigative report into the matter.

The “premise of the thread” was to wonder about the Pats’ seeming rash of injuries in recent years, which I find intriguing. I suppose we could just say GO PATS! all day but that gets old pretty quick.

godef · 03-16-2007, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aluminum seats

Injuries. Maybe it's luck of the draw (and obviously is to a certain extent) and maybe I'm relying on a faulty memory, but it seems to me that consistently over the years wherever Parcells went a common theme was an empty injury report. Even this past year in Dallas--when I think most would agree Parcells had sort of lost it as a coach--I remember looking at the injury report in the paper and there was none listed.

What conditioning coach(es)/programs did Parcells use? Was it different that what Belichick does? Seems that over the last few years it's been such a huge problem for the Pats. One game last year I actually realized my enjoyment of the game was being hampered by the fact that I was EXPECTING an injury to occur. With so much talk right now of the Pats FA pickups, I notice a recurring theme of "if we stay healthy" how dominant the Pats will be. That's always the case, of course, but I don't think I'm alone that the threat of injuries just seems too great now. And I'm not sure why.

I think its simply a matter of BB getting his players committed to all playing Rodney-ball and not worry about exposing themselves to injury. He can do this because, with a few notable exceptions, the coach has shown that its his plug'n'play system that's the big winner.

aluminum seats · 03-17-2007, 07:38 AM

Well, I think guys played hard for Parcells too. Since the injury bug has hit the secondary more than anywhere else, there might be something to the idea that it's the kind of D-backs the Pats draft (tend to be smaller guys.) With someone like Harrison, age plays a part too.

***DarrylS*** · 03-17-2007, 08:02 AM

Injuries are part of football, some teams are hit harder than others.. to me it looks cyclical and the luck of the draw.. there have been posts before by those who are adept at these things and shown where we are about in the middle of games not played by starters due to injury.. not the highest and not the lowest.

Do not confuse testiness with fact, do not confuse anecdotal evidence with long term results. I have never seen documented where the injury situation has anything to do with coaching, training or anything else, but football.. injuries are what they are, part of the NFL. For example Rodney, broke his shoulder on a very freak play and then had knee problems because of a cheap shot, neither was due to anything except football. Seau broke his arm, on and on..

aluminum seats · 03-17-2007, 10:00 AM

It might be "a fact" that a topic comes up repeatedly, but it was a testy point to make. Don't sweat it.

More to the point, if injuries have nothing to do with training, why was your first post a press release about Mike Woicjik? Fact is, there might obviously be a link. Something interesting to think about.