p8ryts

Maybe we should be more concerned with our first opponent before we worry about our second one.

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Stan the Man the Patriots Fan from Wareham

MassPats38

While the bottom line is wins and losses, and I am never a fan of the "what if" scenarios as that cuts both ways, I am not as concerned about this road issue as others seem to be.

It matters when you play teams. Given injuries, confidence, "swagger", wear, and any other number of relevant considerations, teams are tougher or weaker at various points of the season. The "strength of schedule" metric at the end of the season is a poor indicator as teams can come out of the gate fast and crash, and others crash out of the gate and then get hot. The Pats played Denver when it was getting huge points for defense and surprised many, and the Pats' offense was trying to find a receiver other than Welker and Moss at the same time Brady was trying to find his form. Not an apology for the loss, just an explanation. The Pats ridiculously played 5 straight games against teams without a loss and lost two road games in that series. No team in the NFL had to deal with that.

The Pats won the game against Tampa Bay in England, but that somehow was not a road game. They then played road games against Indy and New Orleans, teams also undefeated and rolling over everything in their path. Indy won with a miracle comeback. The Saints laid the smackdown on the Pats. The last road loss was Miami, which frequently wins one game per season against the Pats.

With the Saints loss, the team was flat. It had suffered a traumatic loss in Indy to a major rival and then beaten the Jets, the biggest divisional rival, paying it back for the theater of the first game. The Pats went on the road against a non-conference opponent and I suspect after two emotionally draining games just phoned it in. Excluding that loss, the other 4 losses were by a grand total of 12 points. As such, the 21-point loss to the team that just dropped a game to the Bucs sounds like a pretty big anomaly to me.

I expect the Pats rank up there at the top of the level of difficulty in road opponents. The plus to that is if the playoffs require road appearances, no team has had to deal with that level of adversity as the Pats, thus no team is as prepared to do so at this point in the season.

pao

Excellent post. Have to say I agree that the Patriots are a team no other team should want to face in the playoffs, they are going to be tough to beat. However, whoever does face them, if they can beat them, advancing in the playoffs will be all the more sweeter.

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“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly;..."

We confide in our strength, without boasting of it; we respect that of others, without fearing it -- Thomas Jefferson

SoCalPatsfan90

Actually, if you read his posts, he says they're always dangerous, but then continues on using the misleading 2-5 record on the road as a yardstick for things to come.

I haven't been to the chargers board, so I don't know what they're saying. I only know what jc was saying, because he posted it here... And he is who I was responding to. Something you're doing, is taking certain sections of my post out of context by splitting up the quotes (with regards to the ashamed comment), and I'd respectfully ask you to stop doing that.

It IS ludicrous at best to use the Saints game as a yardstick for NE's road games in the future. Which he's essentially trying to do by pointing out that game specifically. Which was an epic failure on 7 of 50 plays, but he's only looking at the results, and not the rest of the game.

He, and apparently you, aren't looking at the whole picture, with the young DEF, the QB coming off of major surgery, sifting through receivers like Galloway who cost us the jets game etc... There are a WHOLE host of reasons that need to be considered instead of just looking at the 2-5 record and making an immediate judgment that NE WILL suffer on road games because they HAVE suffered on road games. You can look at them, but you can't make a legitimate correlation to future performance.

It absolutely IS foolish to discount a team who has been consistently improving (with admitted bumps along that road) week after week, and is a division winner. People try and discount NE based on the division their in, playing and barely beating the bills, jets and phins etc... I do recall SD struggling mightily against the raiders in week 1, so we should discount you on your close victories too right? And just chalk up 5 of your wins to a really weak division too huh? Didn't think so, so why do it to NE?

NE came in in 2006 to San Diego, where both teams played HORRIBLY and upset the #1 seed. It's hard for ANYONE to go on the road in the playoffs and win, so your assertion that it would likely be more difficult is true, but not true enough to discount the teams past history in situations that they may find themselves in this season.

Paying lip service by making one VERY general statement that the Patriots are always dangerous, followed up by nothing but negative nancy statements isn't respect. And the last part of that is taken way out of context, which I already addressed earlier in this post.

As for Rivers, the reason I think he's cry baby is how I've seen him behave on the field... When things don't go his way, or he doesn't get calls that he thinks he should, he seems to get really whiny based on facial expressions (so I could be wrong, but he seems to throw tantrums on field like my 2y/o does). I don't recall any truly whiny statements he's made (which is why I don't like LT).

So feel free to question my statements, but do NOT partially quote me and then take the text out of context. Also expect a rebuttle if I believe you're incorrect in your assertions.

MoneyFX

It could end up a shootout with either team pulling it out at the end with a field goal. But, LT is NOT a factor anymore, the Patriots have to contain that running game which isn't that good anymore as it has in recent years and bring the pressure to Philip Rivers just as Dallas did to Brees.

SoCalPatsfan90

This is pretty much what I was trying to point out. But apparently it came across differently. The easiest thing to look at is ones record... but there are too many nuances to look at when you get under the hood of said record, to use that record as the true measuring stick of a team.

Deus Irae

Chest thumping? There's you trolling, but not much beyond that. When this:

From a poster with 3 posts on the site is what you come up with for "chest thumping", the issue isn't Patriots fans. The issue is you.

__________________
"The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."
- Marcus Aurelius

PrairiePat

Two factors will help SD this time around -if- the Pats end up playing them (still have to finalize the seedings, and the Pats have to win the first round game).

The first is the memory of 2006; no way the Bolts are going to take the Pats lightly this time around. it's a somewhat similar scenario to that one, though I think the 2009 Pats are better than their 2006 counterparts.

The second factor is the Pats' young defense. The defense has lost a lot of veteran leaders the past year or 2, and I think that stuff shows up the most when on the road in a hostile environment. Hopefully the experiences of the Denver and New Orleans games have toughened up the team somewhat - hard to imagine any more hyped fanbases than those 2 were for a regular season game.

All that being said, the Pats didn't have Moss or Welker in 2006. So I'm cautiously optimistic that TB and company can score enough to keep them in the game with SD.

patsfaninpittsburgh

The 2009 SD defense is not as good as the 2006 defense.

The receivers are obviously better.

However, while people get on Rivers for personal behavior, having him as the team leader is infinately better than having a "classy" LT or "Lights Out". With Rivers in charge, they just seem to be more disciplined and focused. That's why I would rate them more dangerous.

pao

Actually what he has said was that the Patriots are dangerous BUT he doesn't understand the "chest thumping" considering the 2-5 road record AND what happened in NO. Now I don't agree that anyone here is chest thumping (maybe a few) but to say the 2-5 road record and NO game is misleading as to the future road game possibilities is simply your opinion backed by your observations (I actually agree with you, doesn't make us both right...yet). If the Patriots win at SD and at Indy then you can say that the road record was misleading and have it be more than just your opinion, imo.

How did I take your post out of context? It's beside the point anyway. Nothing he wrote should make him be "ashamed to be a fan". Good grief.

I just don't see how you can just throw the NO game out the window. It happened, it can happen again. Do I think it will? No. But to say it is "ludicrous" to consider is just not right. Agree to disagree on this one.

My understanding of his comments is that NE fans should not be "chest thumping" about their chances when you consider their road record. Now I didn't notice anyone "chest thumping" but I do understand why he would consider the Patriots road record when trying to predict what COULD happen the rest of the year. You obviously disagree. That is the nature of message boards. My opinion? Pretty close to yours actually. The Patriots have improved on the road through out the year and is a team to be reckoned with in the playoffs...at home OR on the road.


Again, this is your opinion. I don't think that it is foolish for people to question how well the Patriots will play on the road when looking at the stats. Having said that I believe anyone looking at the Patriots' road record should do so with the qualifiers you spell out. Am I one that thinks the Patriots will do poorly when they come to SD for the divisional round based on thier road record? Nope. I think they bring their A game and it will be a battle.
I am not one that discounts the Chargers OR the Patriots for winning while belonging to a "weak" division. Division games are usually tough no matter how poor of a record one of the teams playing may have. Don't know why you are asking me these questions. I never have said the Patriots should be discounted because of their division opponents.

Again, I've never said differently. In fact I posted earlier that the toughness of TB and BB's genius in the playoffs are big reasons why the Chargers should fear them.


I believe you are wrong about Rivers (not about LT, he has been a bit of a cry baby in the past). Whatever.

Show me where I took something out of context and I'll apologise, until then I stand by my statements. As far as expecting rebuttal, well, that's the reason we are all here right? To discuss football and our differences? That's the way I look at it.

__________________
“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly;..."

We confide in our strength, without boasting of it; we respect that of others, without fearing it -- Thomas Jefferson