Box_O_Rocks

The National Football Post | Diner Morning News: Brown’s Trade DemandAsante is proving to be very expensive for Philly.

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Rob0729

I don't know if either reference is valid for the Patriots and Peppers situation. The Bills are notorious for not paying their top teir talent and letting them go elsewhere (Nate Clements, London Fletcher, etc.). Being a small market team, I don't think the can afford the real dollars needed in a signing bonus and subsequent roster bonuses needed to sign these players. As for the Eagles, they are in this situation because they resign their young players early (usually with 2-3 years left on their current deal) to below market deals offering them a lot of money early in their career which shortchanges them in the long run. They are the only team that I know of who do this practice on a regular basis.

If the Pats do trade for Peppers, he probably won't get as much as he gets elsewhere. It will still be a below market deal. Even if they do, I don't think it will affect negotiations with Wilfork, Seymour, etc. as much as people want to think it will. First, if next year is an uncapped year and Kraft is willing to open his wallet, there will be no problem whatsoever. Also, since Peppers will be taking a below market deal if he is here, the other players will not be able to use it as leverage.

With the two examples you give, there are special circumstances that contributed to the problems they have. None of those special circumstances apply to the Patriots.

Pats726

Not sure I undesrtand....if they pay Peppers big money..OF COURSE that will upset the pay structure teh Patriots have in place. What facts do you have that will back that up?? They do not pay players out of line...that simple. They did in Phillie and look at all the problems with OTHER players that has happened. Don't want that here...sorry. Peppers is one that always wants his large piece of the pie..NOTHING less. If it's less..he'll be grumbling about it and complaining. That is one reason I would prefer not to think of him coming here...more problems than he is worth.

PatsWickedPissah

Box is warning of the consequences of the Pats overpaying for a glamor FA. Box did not just fall off the pumpkin truck unlike many folks; he knows that BB is too smart to overpay and therefore the likelihood of Peppers coming here at a WAY below market deal is small. The fantasy is quite unlikely.

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This is known as "bad luck." RAH

Box_O_Rocks

I just wish those folks falling off the truck would watch where they land, I'm getting almost as punchy as they are.

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Rob0729

I never advocate way overpaying for a glamor FA. But if Belichick thinks Peppers is worth it, who are we to argue. I personally am hesitant to get Peppers because he would be switching positions, but he does have the POTENTIAL of being a stud OLB in the 3-4 (but potential is not always met and quite frequently not met).

As for Peppers taking a below market deal, don't be shocked if he does. I heard a Panthers' beat writer on Sirius NFL radio a month or so back and he said Peppers isn't all about the money and has turned down a lot of endorsement deals. Part of the reason Peppers wants to leave Carolina is not the money, but the fact he has spent his entire life in North Carolina and wants to experience life somewhere else.

I don't know if Belichick is going to trade for Peppers, but I still don't see the relevance of the two examples Box stated. The Colts have made many of their players the top paid players at their position and you rarely if ever hear about other players being upset with their deals. Granted I don't want Belichick to start making his team top heavy like the Colts unless there is an uncapped year.

everlong

If you look at the players the Patriots have brought in they fit into two groups. The Moss and Dillon group where you essentially were on a one year prove it contract then they got extended to a nice but not top of the market deal. Then there's the AD and Colvin group where they came in for a 90-95% of what they could have received elsewhere to play for a winner. None of the contacts left the Pats cap poor at any point during the deal.

Assante for instance was signed above 100% market value. Same with Haynesworth.

If Peppers wanted to do either one of these deals I think his deal would be accepted in the clubhouse and it wouldn't cause a long term issues resigning Wilfork and company. The issue is he wants Haynesworth coin which would cause issues in the clubhouse and would cause cap issues at some point.

He's not walking through that door.

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patsfaninpittsburgh

Box

Great article.

However, I would say the "Patriot Way" helps to negate alot of those problems. When you place "value" and "team" up front, it probably eliminates a big percentage of "hurt feelings" type.

Also, the two organizations mentioned have their oddities. Philly is known for being cheap but overpay for Samuels. The basic inconsistency of their actions drive these problems.

We would have similiar problems today if the Pats conceded to Branch in 2006.

fair catch fryar

Isn't this area one of the reasons that Kraft and BB brought Floyd Reese into the fold? Wasn't he credited for being creative with contracts and extensions in past jobs like Tennessee?

Rob0729

If next year is an uncapped year which looks more likely every day, the pay structure is going to be upset no matter if they trade for Peppers or not because everyone's pay structure is going to be upset with guys like Snyder overpaying for every name out there to get them in.

Besides, i don't understand your beef when I said that if Peppers comes here it will be because he was willing to take less than what he would get elsewhere. There is my proof. So will Wilfork go to the bargaining table and say he wants to be overpaid because Peppers took a below market deal?

Also, you don't seem to grasp Philly's problem either. Their problem is not that they overpaid for Asante. It is that they went to both Sheldon Brown and Lito Sheppard when they had multiple years left in their rookie contracts and said that they would pay them now and discount the fact that they have multiple years left on their deal in the new contract or they can wait three years and cash in then. The players took the immediate gratification. If both players waited until their final year of their contracts to get a new deal, they would have been paid far closer to what Asante got. The Eagles strategy of trying to save a buck long term by locking up their long players long before they can sniff free agency is what biting them in arse, not the Samuel contract (although that was the catalyst to expedite the issue).

BTW, how do we know Peppers is truly about the money? He might be to stay in Carolina where he clearly doesn't want to be. He might realize that his desire to play for a 3-4 team may require him to take more of an incentive laced deal or one with hefty roster bonuses in later years because he would need to prove himself as a 3-4 OLB. Maybe he just asked for the world in Carolina because he didn't want to stay and it was a better PR move to not come to terms than try to shoot his way out of town