02-06-2009, 10:26 AM
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#51
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Third String But Playing on Special Teams
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Arkansas (Formerly New Jersey)
Posts: 652
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Re: Comparing Tom Brady & Ben Roethlisberger - THE FIRST 5 YEARS
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deus Irae
Look, let me try to lay this out for you, again.
The initial premise was that teams have historically wanted him to throw.
I went to the data to point to the season where he threw the most passes.
He has 2 seasons where he's thrown the exact same number of passes as his highest pass totals. That's not me gerrymandering anything.
Those 2 seasons happen to be 2 of the past 3 seasons. Again, that's not me gerrymandering anything.
Those two seasons have resulted in the statistics I pointed out. That's not me gerrymandering anything either.
Whether you look at those seasons individually or together, the touchdown/int ratios and the passer ratings are still not good. That's not me gerrymandering anything. That's just the data.
You can try inserting the one year in between all you want. It doesn't have anything at all to do with the point I was making.
Furthermore, are you saying that one good year out of 3 makes him a quarterback developing into a Brady? Brady has never had a season throwing more picks than touchdowns, unlike Ben. Brady's lowest rating as a starter iis 85.7. Ben's been below that twice already, including a 75.4 season 3 years ago, and an 80.1 rating just this season.
Frankly, rather than tossing in a season that had nothing to do with the point I was making, you should have taken a look at the number of rushing touchdowns inside of 10 yards, or something along those lines to try to explain the numbers. I don't know if it would have helped the argument, but I doubt it could have been worse than "But this other season that WASN'T one where he threw the most passes!".
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You know, you keep going back to the 06 Season as his "worst year" and using that to point out how he isn't great. That was the Same season he face planted a freaking windshield in the Summer, had his appendix removed in August and basically only played because the 2nd option was Maddox and that was a disaster.
Yeah, they threw way to much in 06. Bettis had just retired, the Head Coach didn't have his heart in the game, and Ben probably should have sat out that season. The following year he tried to take the entire offense on his back and had a great passing season, but this year, he played within his means, and did exactly what he needed to do in the Big Games. That's the discussion.
Is he not as good as Payton as a pure passer. He is not as good as Tom as a leader of the offense. However, he is a great Player of the Game and he makes Big Plays in big Games.
He's a winner. |
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) But I was lurking around and noticed this thread....I got to say that stats are important and so are rings and what not, but I think that it can be a bit analyzed too much. mediocre stats can be misleading as can inflated stats due to an offense that runs a high percentage of passing plays. The most simple way to decipher whether or not a quarterback is a good player or not is just to watch them play. Peyton and Brady are the two best qb's in the league and you can tell they are pretty awesome players without ever looking at a stat line, and I believe the same can be said for Ben. I dont know that I could say the same for a guy that puts up a lot of big time passing numbers like Palmer or Bree's, when I watch a Bengals game ( though I admit to be a little biased lol) I dont really feel like Palmer would be my top choice to win the game with everything on the line. Well, anyways now I am rambling, but there's my two cents. 
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