A Couple Of Modest Proposals: move McCourty back to CB, or franchise Talib - Page 3 - New England Patriots Forums

***mgteich*** · 02-18-2013, 09:17 PM

The open question is whether it is easier to get two corners and a safety, or two safeties and a corner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deus Irae

Or....

Keep McCourty at safety
Sign a CB1 (Talib or other)
Re-sign Arrington
Draft Safety in round 1

Just doing that gives you plenty of safeties (rookie replaces Chung) and sets up the team at CB1, CB2 and CB3/CB4. At that point, they can bring in the annual parade of CB3/CB4 wannabes and find one that sticks, while hoping that Dowling isn't already a broken china doll and also has some game left in him.

There's no need to franchise Talib. In fact, I'll look at any decision to franchise Talib over Welker as evidence that the Jets have gotten to the Patriots brain trust with some sort of mind altering (and dumbing down) substance.

supafly · 02-18-2013, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgteich

We currently have
Dennard (waiting for prIson sentence)
Dowling (waiting for this year's injuries)
and no one else except Practice Squad quality players.
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I don't understand why most of you seem to be fine with keeping McCourty at FS, and simply hoping that we will be able to field an adequate set of corners.

I think that Belichick will obviously do what he feels is best for the secondary, so we'll have to trust that. So far it has produced decent overall results even despite a horrible secondary lately. I don't think it will be ignored though.

I also think you are being a bit negative with the overall situation. We have no idea as to whether Dennard will get jail time or not, and if he does he would likely still be out by the end of the summer.

They may also have a plan in place to re-sign Arrington, or at least make a very good attempt at doing so.

It should also be noted that maybe Belichick feels just as strongly as you do about the dire state of the secondary, and that is one of the reasons he may take a chance at trying to keep the offense going without Welker, so that the money can be used for issues like this.

supafly · 02-18-2013, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgteich

The open question is whether it is easier to get two corners and a safety, or two safeties and a corner.

I think we would need to have inside information as to how the organization feels about the progress made in year one from Tavon Wilson, and how they feel about their prospects in the draft/FA regarding safeties vs cornerbacks.

In other words, probably only one man truly knows which way he'll approach it, and even then he may let the situation come to him and play with what is left after the initial overpayment rush in week one of FA.

The Dennard situation is also probably being watched closely, but we should know tomorrow how much jail time he'll get, if any.

***mgteich*** · 02-18-2013, 09:25 PM

You may be correct in the issue of needing a safety to be captain of the defense.

If we are "going to let the market speak and deal with the fallout", I can only hope that we make some of the more minor signings before free agency starts (perhaps 2-3 of Edelman, Woodhead, Arrington and Thomas).

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoLewisrocks

I have a feeling this team is presently willing to sit back and let the market speak and deal with the fallout even if it means they lose 3-4 UFA. Hopefully they are guessing right, although that hasn't been their strong suit for some time now. If not the FA market for corners might still yield just enough and the draft is looking good for safeties. And both provide options at OL. WR will be the toughest hole to fill if they let Welker walk.

***Deus Irae*** · 02-18-2013, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgteich

The open question is whether it is easier to get two corners and a safety, or two safeties and a corner.

No.....

The open question is whether it's better for this team to have good safety play and look for help at corner, or to look for help at safety and hope that McCourty doesn't wet himself at corner again.

I'll take the former. You seem content with the latter.

Metaphors · 02-18-2013, 09:33 PM

I'm not sure how jerking McCourty back to corner (except in an injury emergency) would be a positive thing.
Dennard has shown enough to assume he will be a part of the rotation assuming the trial works out (can't believe he gets jail time past the summer).
Not sure why people are so down on Gregory, but he has been at least a steady veteran in the secondary. Can't credibly cry for J.Sanders and diss Gregory.
Wilson is 22 with one year under his belt. Writing him off as a bust doesn't seem very smart.
Dowling had found a niche as a physical between the numbers corner before his injury. If he can stay healthy, I think that becomes his role moving forward.

Seems to me that CB is a much greater need than safety. In fact, a case could be made that the safety position is set for next year (including Ebner as the 4th ST guy). I expect the Pats to get a CB early in FA (Talib or otherwise) and then use the draft and later FA to pounce on whatever DB opportunities appear.

***mgteich*** · 02-18-2013, 09:47 PM

I agree that we are all set at safety, if McCourty stays at safety. Even so, I would expect us to add a draftee in this excellent safety draft. Ebner is a STer, and can be carried as such, even in he's listed as our fifth safety.

You seem to greatly underestimate the need at corner. We need at least FOUR at this critical position. Even this is pretty light: 2 starters, a nickel and a backup who will play at least 50% of the defensive reps if anyone is injured. We currently have one corner on trial and the other who was injured for all but two games in his first two years. That's just not good in this passing league.

I understand that we can simply say that we were unlucky that Dowling and/or one of the free agent corners doesn't work out well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metaphors

[LIST]

Seems to me that CB is a much greater need than safety. In fact, a case could be made that the safety position is set for next year (including Ebner as the 4th ST guy). I expect the Pats to get a CB early in FA (Talib or otherwise) and then use the draft and later FA to pounce on whatever DB opportunities appear.

***DaBruinz*** · 02-18-2013, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helmet2Helmet

So the general consensus is Tavon Wilson is hopeless?

No. That isn't the "GENERAL Consensus". That might be the idea of a few hair-brained posters who insist on thinking the sky is falling because every pick isn't an immediate All-Pro, but it's certainly not the consensus.

Most fair-minded posters believe that Wilson showed plenty during his rookie season. Especially a rookie in the Pats defense.

nzahir · 02-18-2013, 10:38 PM

How about we keep Mccourt at safety, re sign talib or a corner of his talent or higher, hope that dennard can play next season(or we will have to rely on dowling and his health), and draft the honey badger to play slot cb. Then for ss we can use tavon wilson or try to draft a guy like elam or if not maybe eric reid. The pats should try to add some interior pass rush to help the line and secondary, a guy like desmond bryant is ideal. Henry melton is nice but he will probably be too expensive and franchised. Maybe someone gets cut or traded like a cullen jenkins.

***DaBruinz*** · 02-18-2013, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgteich

We are short 3 corners and a safety.

Perhaps we need to consider moving McCourty back to corner and be short 2 corners and 2 safeties.

This plan requires less resources than others. For example, we could re-sign Arrington and Cole (and/or their upgrades) and also add a couple of safeties (ideally one from free agency and one from the draft.

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Or we can simply decide to franchise Talib.

Where do you get that the Patriots are short 3 Corners and a safety? Because they have Chung, Arrington, Talib, Cole and Martin as free agents? You seem to forget that only 3 of the 5 actually started the season with the Pats.

Lets do a rundown of what the Pats have on the roster currently.
McCourty, Dowling, T. Wilson, S. Gregory, Ebner, Dennard, Malcolm Williams. Of them, Ebner and Williams are almost exclusively special teamers. That still leaves the Pats with 3 safeties and 2 Corners. Yes, I am counting McCourty as a Safety because I believe that is where the Pats want him to be full time.

That means the Pats should a minimum of 2 DBs. Whether they are 1CB and 1 S or 2 CB/S combos or 2 CBs, that's what they'll l;ikely look at for the final roster. But it's a long way between now and then and there will probably been 6-10 guys that they bring in and give a look at.

The key is to bring in someone for the STAR position. Someone who can cover the slot receiver. Be it a WR or a TE.

But, in addition to that, the Pats need to jam the TEs at the line with a LB to throw the timing off.