Peter King :It's time to make room for Flacco in upper echelon of QBs - Page 10 - New England Patriots Forums

Dscola · 01-18-2013, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikolai

Ok, it's just my take. But here are my thoughts on QB tiers, in no particular order within the tiers:

Tier One (Elite)
Brady
Rodgers
Manning
Brees

Tier Two (Very good/Sub-elite)
Roethlisberger
RG3
Kaepernick
Stafford
Wilson
Ryan
Newton

Tier Three (Good)
Luck
Romo
Schaub
Cutler
Rivers

Tier Four (Average)
Dalton
Flacco
Palmer
Tannehill
Fitzpatrick
Vick
E. Manning
Bradford
Cassell
Freeman

Tier Five (Not Good)
Sanchez
Weeden
Locker
Ponder
Skelton
Gabbert

So, maybe you COULD move Flacco into the next tier, but three weeks ago, most people would have agree that he wasn't a top 15 QB. But what 22 NFL QBs are below Flacco for him to be a Top 10? And Top 10 isn't elite. Top 5 is elite, so who among RG3, Kaepernick, Stafford, Big Ben, Wilson, Ryan, or Newton would you wanna replace with Joe Flacco?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR

Are there people out there that consider Stafford, Cutler, Rivers, Romo or Newton in the upper echelon? The question is would you take him over a Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Manning, etc...?

Yea this guy.

Dscola · 01-18-2013, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double TE

To me Flacco is like Terry Bradshaw, Phil Simms, and Troy AIkman ~ They all won SBs...multiple SBs. Joe needs to win at least one first right? I don't like these discussions because football is a team game. Joe is playing well now so ride that horse but he is too inconsistent to call "great" IMO. But all he needs to do now is be great for two more games and yes he can definitely do that. Feel better?

You are right and thats my point though. What other QB gets so much flak as Flacco. Not even Romo. And why, because he thinks he's elite? I think I'm the best Madden player in Baltimore, even thought I know there are players that could and have beat me.

Double TE · 01-18-2013, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dscola

You are right and thats my point though. What other QB gets so much flak as Flacco. Not even Romo. And why, because he thinks he's elite? I think I'm the best Madden player in Baltimore, even thought I know there are players that could and have beat me.

I think Romo and Sanchez get their fair share of flack. Especially Romo. I think Flacco suffers from the fact that he plays with an elite RB and historically an excellent D. Which leaves only one person to blame if the team does not win it all...you guessed it...the QB!

BSR · 01-18-2013, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dscola

Yea this guy.

I think a lot of people would disagree with the notion that they are considered top echelon QBs and finding one person that thinks otherwise doesn't make it a consensus. Is it really so outrageous to say that Flacco is middle of the road at this point in his career?

Double TE · 01-18-2013, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR

I think a lot of people would disagree with the notion that they are considered top echelon QBs and finding one person that thinks otherwise doesn't make it a consensus. Is it really so outrageous to say that Flacco is middle of the road at this point in his career?

I bet teams like AZ, Philly, Cleveland, Tenn, Jax...would love to have Flacco. Its all supply and demand. We've been spoiled here with Brady. Flacco is basically Bledsoe.

DaBronxPats14 · 01-18-2013, 09:15 AM

It's time for us to stop giving peter queen attention. Queen of mediots brings nothing valuable to'da table. Same'ole gearbage.

Double TE · 01-18-2013, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaBronxPats14

It's time for us to stop giving peter queen attention. Queen of mediots brings nothing valuable to'da table. Same'ole gearbage.

I don't pay him any mind. He is useless.

***KontradictioN*** · 01-18-2013, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RayVNLewis

Attempt ?? hmm.. is like Attempted Hands to the face.. or lemme see.. Attempted Helmet to Helmet contact ??

I think you have just made my point...

Perhaps you would like to elaborate more on just what the hell you're talking about so I can challenge you directly instead of just beating around the bush?

***jb1095*** · 01-18-2013, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dscola

I'm just repeating what is being said by your board's fans.
I can go back and find threads where your team's fans are upset that Manning gets all kind of praise as well.

To me Flacco is like Terry Bradshaw, Phil Simms, and Troy AIkman. These QB's were overshadowed by other players on their team their whole career but at the end of the day, they won.

Other team's fans don't see the clutch 3rd and 9 throw to get a first down so that Rice can run the clock out.
They don't see that fact that Rice has lanes to run through because they saftey is playing deep.

When you have a Ray Lewis, Terrell Suggs, Haloti Ngata, Ed Reed, and Ray Rice all of whom have very large presence in interviews and are media darlings,then you get Flacco who is monotone and doesn't say much, he gets overlooked.

You can have Cutler with his top 10 defense who can't play a full season or make the playoffs. You can have Matt Stafford with the best reciever in the NFL with his picks at the end of games to get his team a top 10 pick every year. You can have Rivers and Romo and Newton. I'll take Joe Flacco and his steadiness.

And by the way, what was Flacco supposed to say when asked if he thought he was elite? "No I'm maybe in the top 15 of the league." Get out of here with that crap.

What was he supposed to say when asked?

How about what Brady regularly says when something stupid like that is asked. Something like the following would work wonders.

"I guess I'll have to read the papers to see if I am elite or not...you guys make the call, not me. I just try my best when I am out there and what ever happens happens. All I know is we have to prepare hard every day, <Insert opposing team here> has a lot of good players, they have the tools in place to make me have a really bad day if I don't prepare, <random opposing player> has great ball skills and is a play maker, he is versatile off the line and can really cause me problems, we really need to prepare for him.

Just because he took the bait and answered a stupid question with a stupid answer doesn't make him less culpable for the response he gave.

***TruthSeeker*** · 01-18-2013, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double TE

To me Flacco is like Terry Bradshaw, Phil Simms, and Troy AIkman ~ They all won SBs...multiple SBs. Joe needs to win at least one first right? I don't like these discussions because football is a team game. Joe is playing well now so ride that horse but he is too inconsistent to call "great" IMO. But all he needs to do now is be great for two more games and yes he can definitely do that. Feel better?

Flacco is like 3 Hall of Fame quarterbacks? A QB who:
- doesn't throw well to his left
- is overly dependent on throwing the long ball to move the team downfield
- struggles if his first receiver isn't open (according to London Fletcher on Colin Cowherd yesterday)

Flacco's good but let's not say he's a Hall of Fame type QB. He's been in a system with (up until now) a great defense, a great running back and a very good offensive line and at times has led the team to victory, but he's also (at times) been very dependent on those around him.

He's above average. He has potential to be great which is just that - potential - until he overcomes some of these flaws noted above. Mark Sanchez was touted as a really good QB as well when he had all the ingredients around him. Not so say that Flacco and Sanchez are all that comparable; Flacco is much better. But it's easy to be overhyped when you are on a really good team.

As far as the post that noted that the Ravens didn't do well in the playoffs until Flacco got there, I'd definitely agree. Flacco is an important piece in being a playoff team. But I think he was the player that put them over the top - not the player that defined the team. Flacco is relying on all the other pieces of the team to be there in order to get them as far as he has. That's what an above average QB can do. But he's not taking them to the next level because he's not quite good enough.