DE: Arkansas' Jake Bequette > UNC's Quinton Coples - Page 6 - New England Patriots Forums

UK_Pat37 · 03-02-2012, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patsderoer

Bequette blew him away in the 3-cone and short shuttle, not even close. Coples looked slow on "tape", and it confirmed to me at the combine. He doesnt have a better burst than Bequette. Coples has more potential to be a bust, than Bequette.

Pass rushing technique can be improved, better use of hands can be improved, but agility cannot. Either you have it or you dont. And Bequette blew Coples away in agility at the combine while being similar in size.
6.9 cone Bequette vs 7.57 Coples
4.07 short shuttle Bequette vs 4.78 Coples Not even close.

I wouldn't say that Bequette has "average athleticism". Only two DE guys beat him at the combine in the 3-cone, and both these guys didn't have the size of Bequette. Bequette has 30 pounds on Irvin and 4 inches on Ingram.
Considering his size, Bequette had actually the best athleticism among the DEs.
Bequette had a 34 inch vert, while Coples had 31.5 inch vert, being similar in size. So Bequette is more explosive, and has more lower body strength.

Coples is only faster in the 40, which I couldn't care less, because when was the last time you saw in the NFL a DE run straight ahead for 40yards? In the agility drills, Bequette is much much faster than Coples.
If Coples is a 1st round prospect, then Bequette undoubtely is also. For me Bequette is better prospect than Coples.

I don't know what tape you've been looking at

I could care less about the combine full stop. I rarely refer back to it. It's a day when people can elevate their stock a tiny bit...maybe a round...with a good workout. Drills are pi*s easy when you're running in shorts and running around some cones.

Snake Eyes · 03-02-2012, 10:31 AM

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Originally Posted by SeymourTrophies

How many people were looking at Cliff Avril being better than Vernon Gholston in 2008? How many DL were drafted before Red Bryant? Draft speculation really can't be ruled out because you really do not know who will pan out.

While speculation can’t be ruled out one must base it on the information available. If a player simply isn’t very athletic and explosive what is one going to base their evaluation/speculation on? You could say they have great instincts/diagnostics, and that’s fine, but it needs to be based on something, and stats aren’t nearly enough.

UK_Pat37 · 03-02-2012, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snake Eyes

While speculation can’t be ruled out one must base it on the information available. If a player simply isn’t very athletic and explosive what is one going to base their evaluation/speculation on? You could say they have great instincts/diagnostics, and that’s fine, but it needs to be based on something, and stats aren’t nearly enough.

I agree with you his combine numbers were decent...better than what I expected. I didn't expect him to be one of the better DE prospects in the shuttle or 3 cone. I just don't see it when I watch the tape of him. There are a lot of workout warriors and guys who perform well in shorts and t0-shirts but when you put the pads on and have to implement it when someone is trying to block you, when you have to think...it isn't the same.

I definitely don't want to rule him out though. He's later round prospect who could be very interesting. It's tough to compare Bequette being a bust to Coples though. You aren't going to really care for calling someone a bust in the late rounds...it's going to be more obvious if Coples doesn't pan out if he's drafted where people expect him to go.

I'd have said fourth round before the combine...probably elevated himself to the third with strong drills which could mean he shows someone you could work with and convert elsewhere on the field as well as DE.

Coples is likely to be a pure DE...Bequette probably won't play much with his hand down...I think he'll struggle in the NFL to do so. LB is a decent shot for him if he can do what he did in his drills on the field.

patsderoer · 03-02-2012, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UK_Pat37

Drills are pi*s easy when you're running in shorts and running around some cones.

Not for Coples. Apparently they aren't that easy, since he was among the worst DEs in the 3-cone and short shuttle, confirming that what I saw on his "tape' is true, and what you saw on his "tape" is false. And if you claim that the 3-cone and short shuttle times are meaningless, maybe you need to read the first post in this thread.NFL Forum :: - Study on pass rushing 3-4 OLBs: 3-Cone Drill; Vert and Broad

captain stone · 03-02-2012, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patsderoer

Coples is only faster in the 40, which I couldn't care less, because when was the last time you saw in the NFL a DE run straight ahead for 40yards? In the agility drills, Bequette is much much faster than Coples.
If Coples is a 1st round prospect, then Bequette undoubtely is also. For me Bequette is better prospect than Coples.

Coples is also faster in the 10-yd split, 1.63 to 1.72 (as per NEPDraft.com); a time > 1.70
is not very encouraging, though not nec. a draft-killer. Superior anticipation can compensate somewhat
for Bequette's lack of natural explosion in this particular area.
(OTOH, inferior to piss-poor anticipation can negate any advantage in natural explosion;
e.g.: Gholston, Vernon and Cunningham, Jermaine.)

If Bill has somehow neglected again the Pass-Rusher position before #63, then I would have no problem
seeing that pick used on Bequette, or Shea McClellin.

Off The Grid · 03-02-2012, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeymourTrophies

How many people were looking at Cliff Avril being better than Vernon Gholston in 2008? How many DL were drafted before Red Bryant?

Draft speculation really can't be ruled out because you really do not know who will pan out.

Nicely put, Sir.

I don't agree that Bequette, in particular, is a guy I'd rather pick ahead of Coples...

But dozens of longer shots pay off every single year.

VrabelJr · 03-02-2012, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeymourTrophies

How many people were looking at Cliff Avril being better than Vernon Gholston in 2008? How many DL were drafted before Red Bryant? Draft speculation really can't be ruled out because you really do not know who will pan out.

The funny thing about your Avril-Gholston comparison is that it fits this whole Derek Wolfe/Jake Bequette mania perfectly. Gholston had all of the on field stats and production while Avril didn't.

We all know how Vernon Gholston ended up working out.

patsderoer · 03-02-2012, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VrabelJr

The funny thing about your Avril-Gholston comparison is that it fits this whole Derek Wolfe/Jake Bequette mania perfectly. Gholston had all of the on field stats and production while Avril didn't.

We all know how Vernon Gholston ended up working out.

BS. Gholston didnt have a sub 7.0 3-cone, like Bequette.

MrNathanDrake · 03-02-2012, 04:59 PM

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Originally Posted by DaBruinz

Yes, you are a dumb poster. There are such things as TYPOES in life. That is all my spelling of colleague was.

LMAO@"TYPOES"..... go back to grade school, dumb ass.

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Also, when people have to resort to talking about a persons post count, you know they have already lost the argument and can't actually bring anything of intelligence to the table.

Actually it's quite reflective of your lack of social life and why you act like a douchebag at this forum. We all know you're a loser in real life.

Quote:

BTW, here's a little something to think about. I've been on this board for 10 years. And the post count was resent in 2005. So, in 7 years, I've averages 8 posts a day.. WOW.

8 posts a day for a team that plays 16-20 games a season. Yup. You need to get a life. And if you're that active here in off-season and still haven't landed a job in the front office, you're obviously wasting your time.

Quote:

I hate to break this to you, but missing a double "x" or an occasional "a" doesn't make my spelling the equivalent of a 12 year old immigrant. It makes my spelling that of someone who types fast and misses a letter now and then.

Or in other words: Someone who speaks before he thinks. What many refer to as "an idiot".

Quote:

Again, please show me where I said that Bequette wouldn't be anything but an OLB in the Pats system. That's right. YOU CAN'T. Why? Because I never said it. What I did say was that Bequette would be better as a 4-3 DE. Clearly you have issues with reading comprehension.

What are you rambling about at this point? You are a joke of a human being and obviously misunderstood this thread since the OP.

You were saying Coples would be a DE in our 34 despite weighing 285lbs. That alone kills your credibility.

West Philly Patriot · 03-04-2012, 10:26 PM