What does this draft tell us about the roster? - Page 3 - New England Patriots Forums

Ochmed Jones · 04-29-2011, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rookBoston

I do think he's a CB, but let's see. I assume he's insurance against Bodden and competition for Arrington and Butler. But he does have the versatility that BB values in DBs. Ras-I could certainly go to FS... or, for that matter, so could Bodden. But, I think BB isn't too worried about having too many options in the secondary. Training camp will illuminate exactly what we've drafted.

Bodden to FS is an intriguing idea that I had not thought of,but makes some sense. Good Point.

Patriot_in_NY · 04-29-2011, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unoriginal

Once again count on patchick to put forward the only intelligent question asked today.

Back in January I advanced the theory that DL was not going to be a draft priority for the Pats going forward, despite the DL having many top prospects in this draft and there seemingly being a chance to significantly upgrade the base 3-4.

Naturally I (and many others) assumed the Pats would instead try to find a DE/OLB player, but that player is notoriously difficult to find at a draft slot that maximizes value. So no surprise the Pats didn't make a pick there.

Naturally I (and many others) assumed the Pats would not go DB, but perhaps we misevaluated just how far out the door Meriweather is, the health of Leigh Bodden and/or, as patchick mentioned, the skills of Darius Butler. Anyways, it's a passing league.

I would like to note that each of the Pats' first three picks, OT Sodder, CB/S Dowling and RB Vereen, each project as 3-down players if the Pats hit on them. That seems to be the Pats' modus operandi at the top of drafts, and why I felt DL, or a pure sub-rusher, would not be taken.

I would not at all be surprised if the Pats threw another DL into the mix as a late draft choice, though you would expect OLB or OG flyers if they are available tomorrow, as there seems to be less depth there.

I think the two runningbacks selected were less about BJGE than they were about Sammy Morris's role and adding depth.

Funny how it's the more knowledgeable posters like patchick who always go back and check their assumptions. How many draft picks did you get right this time, 3 out of 5?

To sum up; most of us got it mostly wrong once again.

Excellant post. The more I marinate over today's picks, the more this post makes sense.

I am totally good on the RB picks. It's not about Ellis either. It as about the old guys behind him........ We needed to get much younger at this position. We did, in a major way.

Everyone though we were crazy taking 2 TE's last year too

Ochmed Jones · 04-29-2011, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patriot_in_NY

Excellant post. The more I marinate over today's picks, the more this post makes sense.

I am totally good on the RB picks. It's not about Ellis either. It as about the old guys behind him........ We needed to get much younger at this position. We did, in a major way.

Everyone though we were crazy taking 2 TE's last year too

And with Vereen, we added a ton of speed.

Patriot_in_NY · 04-29-2011, 11:44 PM

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Originally Posted by Ochmed Jones

And with Vereen, we added a ton of speed.

and that too

......

Ochmed Jones · 04-29-2011, 11:55 PM

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Originally Posted by Patriot_in_NY

and that too

......

Should be an interesting training camp to see how the carries shake out. I would feel better about the running game if Mankins is signed long term and we pick up an OG on day 3.

Metaphors · 04-30-2011, 01:26 AM

Obviously Belichick likes the 14-2 2010 squad. Returning just about everyone on the depth chart except Light and Neal (though this was Connolly at the end of the year). If Light returns on a 1-year deal and the team stays relatively healthy in 2011, the Pats can win without this draft class. So what does this draft class tell us?

- Belichick wants tackles that can survive on an island. Vollmer rarely needs help. With some coaching, Solder could reach that level as well. A risk at #17 but the upside is a relaxed Brady in the pocket with his eyes downfield scanning the maximum number of receivers.

- Belichick wants more big plays in the running game. BJGE and Woodhead were steady and dependable but rarely broke anything in the 2nd level. Maroney was mercilessly derided around here but he was a sweet runner once he got into space. The hope is that Vereen has that kind of ability without the vision and decision-making issues.

- Belichick wasn't happy that 3rd and 1.5 yds was a passing situation. Ridley specializes in getting tough yards in short yardage and goal line situations while still fitting a tailback profile.

- Belichick wasn't thrilled with the ability of the secondary to get the defense off the field (turnovers and 3rd down). The blame shifts between the CBs and safeties depending on matchups. Is Dowling a CB or S? Hopefully opposing QBs will be asking themselves that question before the snap.

- Belichick is content with the receivers and DL. Likely means Wright will recover, Deaderick isn't too much of a butthead, Warren is motivated, Stroud still has something in the tank and Price/Tate can threaten downfield. Sounds OK to me.

- Belichick thinks the interior OL is in reasonable shape. Once Boling goes (he won't be there in round 5), the OG pickings are slim. This is a vote of confidence for Connolly, Ohrnberger and (to a lesser degree) Austin. With plenty of centers still on the board, I fully expect Koppen 2.0 to be drafted tomorrow.

- Belichick didn't see the answer to the pass rush issues in this draft class. Since he knows the Pats need to deliver more pressure and there are likely 2 open spots at OLB on the roster, he must be thinking about trades or free agency at that position.

- Belichick found the talent cliff in this draft class around #75. At that point, why not go for a luxury pick (Mallett) or start turning picks into future assets?

- Belichick is prepared for the consequences of a lockout through the summer. Conversion projects would be difficult to pull off without camp/practice time. Solder may need some time so Light on a one year deal is still a possibility. Dowling shouldn't be pushed too quickly with plenty of DB candidates under contract (less so in 2012). The RBs can be brought in gradually behind BJGE and Woodhead. Mallett is on a multi-year plan.

The real question isn't whether or not this draft class made the Pats better on paper now or even when the season opens. A better question is whether or not this team will be better when it counts. That means winning the division, getting homefield and winning the Super Bowl. With the labor situation and an uncertain set of CBA rules to come, we will have to wait and see if the plan is a good one.

***ctpatsfan77*** · 04-30-2011, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unoriginal

Funny how it's the more knowledgeable posters like patchick who always go back and check their assumptions. How many draft picks did you get right this time, 3 out of 5?

FWIW, some of us wanted Nate Solder as soon as we heard about his size and speed a year or two ago.

supafly · 04-30-2011, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctpatsfan77

FWIW, some of us wanted Nate Solder as soon as we heard about his size and speed a year or two ago.

And some of us had the earlier high picks targeting QB, RB, and OL--and saw the obvious bigger picture with re-loading on offense...and a little thing called 'BPA.'

***ctpatsfan77*** · 04-30-2011, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metaphors

- Belichick wants more big plays in the running game. BJGE and Woodhead were steady and dependable but rarely broke anything in the 2nd level. Maroney was mercilessly derided around here but he was a sweet runner once he got into space. The hope is that Vereen has that kind of ability without the vision and decision-making issues.

I'm not sure how far "the second level" is, but (A) almost no RB gets 20+ yards rushing more than ~5% of the time, and (B) Woodhead, at least, averaged 5.6 YPC, which was third among backs averaging 5+ carries a game.

AzPatsFan · 04-30-2011, 03:12 AM

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Originally Posted by patchick

A draft with an unexpected shape tends to point to fan misperceptions about the existing roster. For instance, a 1st-round CB in 2010 wouldn't have been any surprise at all if we hadn't all been penciling in Darius Butler as a starter. So let's read these tea leaves! Here's some conclusions I'm tempted to draw:

- No, despite his solid numbers LawFirm is not seen as a feature back by the team.

- The DL weakness at the end of last season reflected the incredible rash of injuries at the position more than a lack of talent. Add Ty Warren, Marcus Stroud, Ron Brace, Myron Pryor and (hopefully) Mike Wright to the mix and subtract Gerard Warren; even without a draft pick, the projected DL bears little resemblance to the one that lined up in the playoffs.

Hand the man the prize.

We have 9 DLs with some level of productivity, and you usually keep 5-7 linemen. There was never a NEED for a 5 technique 3-4 DE, (but it wouldn't be a bad idea).

In our best year we seldom carried more than 3 OLBs. Last year we started 2 new ones, Ninko, and Cunningham and spotted TBC, a former starter. The results were not spectacular, but they were not hopeless either.

OTOH, BB decided we needed some new RBs, another development QB, a little more depth at CB, and some young starting capability on the Oline. Every one of those needs was addressed.

Perhaps most Pats fans misread the Team needs, that BB diagnosed.