captain stone

1) Amen to that.

2) That would be Kirk Ferentz, HC of Iowa.

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captain stone

Why would Charlie know about Greg Jennings? Did ND play W. Michigan in '05?

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captain stone

1) What sux is that instead of delivering sweet crude, the ND pipeline has had only gunk (Stevenson, Richardson, LeVoir) ooze out its hole.

2) If Dallas had offered you Fasano & Akin Ayodele for #94, would you have accepted?

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DaBruinz

Ok, in previous years, I had reviewed the Pats picks strictly in terms of Saban because that was the only name being mentioned as part of the "pipeline." I did some more research and have now included the likes of Urban Meyer, Pat Hill, Kirk Ferentz, and Charlie Weis to this list. However, I do not know when the relationships started with Hill, Ferentz, and Meyer so I limited it to the 2005 to current drafts when reviewing them. I'm willing to update the players that these coaches hae potentially provided insight on whom the Patriots actually drafted.

In the past, I have felt that the "pipeline" theory was a myth and, well, it kind of is. However, when you look at it from a broader perspective of whether or not the pipeline coaches might be giving the Patriots information on players they play against, there is much more to it.

Here are the picks that Saban either coached or coached against (Bold are players who have contributed to the Patriots) prior to his joining Miami:
Jarvis Green, Rohan Davey, TJ Turner, Greg Robinson-Randall, Marquise Hill, Ben Watson, Guss Scott, David Givens, Matt Light, Cedric Cobbs, Brock Williams, Jabari Holloway, Tom Brady, and David Nugent.

Since Saban returned to the college ranks, here are the picks he might have had insight on because he coached against them: Jerod Mayo - Tennessee and Jonathan Wilhite - Auburn.

The Patriots have not drafted anyone that Saban has coached since he returned to the college ranks.

Saban could have had a hand in on Eric Alexander and Randall Gay, UDFA, as well.

For the purpose of this post and to keep it in line with other posts on the subject I've done, I am including players came directly from teams or who the coach's team played against. Players in RED mean that more than one coach in the pipeline have seen them play.

Pat Hill - (Started in 1997 at Fresno State. Not sure when he and BB became friends, so I will only go back to the 2005 Draft)
Logan Mankins and James Sanders - Fresno State, Clint Oldenburg - Colorado State,

Charlie Weis (Started in 2005 at Notre Dame)
Mike Richardson - Notre Dame , Shawn Crable- Michigan, Jerod Mayo - Tennessee, Matt Cassel - USC, Dan Stevenson - Notre Dame, Oscar Lua, USC, Matt Slater - UCLA,

Kirk Ferentz - (Started at Iowa in 1998. Not sure when he and BB started their friendship, so I'll limit this to the last 3 drafts)
Mike Elgin - Iowa, Ellis Hobbs - Iowa State, David Thomas- Texas, Shawn Crable - Michigan, Laurence Maroney - Minnesota,

Urban Meyer - (Utah & Florida , Not sure when he and BB became friends)
Chad Jackson - Florida, Jeremy Mincey - Florida, Mike Elgin - Iowa, Jerod Mayo - Tennessee, Jonathan Wilhite - Auburn, Shawn Crable - Michigan


For D-Cleater, Weis' Notre Dame did not play against W. Michigan during the 2005/2006 season, so I am not sure how you can mention Greg Jennings.

What I find interesting is that Shawn Crable, Jerod Mayo, and Jonathan Wilhite show up on the list of at least 2 coaches.

Something else to keep in mind. If these coaches are feeding the Pats info, its not just on the positives of a player. They are also feeding them the negatives. Which could explain other players not having been picked.

DaBruinz

1) Please remember that Richardson, Stevenson and LeVoir were players whom Weis did NOT recruit. They were already in the program when he took over.

This should be the 1st year that Weis recruits actually hit the draft.

2) #94? Isn't that the pick the Pats used to take Kevin O'Connell? That all depends on what the Patriots saw in Fasano and Ayodele. I think Fasano is definitely an upgrade in blocking over Watson and Thomas, but he's not really an upgrade in the receiving aspect. Also, Fasano was coached by Weis for a year so Weis had some insight on him. And, considering how many of the Pats recent picks Weis has weighed in on, I think his voice may have carried some weight in the decision.

Seneschal2

My first post since the draft.

BB has mentioned how Florida's passing offense is different than most college offenses in that they're very similar to what the Pats do -- and the NFL in general. Players who play in that offense have a good understanding of passing concepts which (hopefully), will make their transition to the NFL an easy one.

The Pats did their homework on Jackson (aside from Meyer's input) with their own scouts and coaches. Based on his career, impressive workouts, and that passing offense -- he was a solid pick. So why do they call the draft a crapshoot?

He did with Gay. Saban is known to be a hands-on coach -- especially with his DBs. It also remains a pet position for BB. And Alexander as we know, converted from Safety to LB at LSU.

A little tidbit that's never been mentioned on this board is that Meyer was David Givens' WR coach at Notre Dame. So we now know their relationship goes back at least that far.

Great topic!

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- Bill Belichick -

captain stone

The reason I used #94 is that before the draft, Miami traded its first pick of the 4th round, #100 overall, to Dallas for Fasano & Ayodele. These 2 could have filled positions of need on the NEP: Blocking TE & ILB. FreeTedW was very high on Fasano, so I am curious if he would've made that deal. I'm still not sure if I would've made it.

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BelichickFan

Although there's no evidence of this piece of the pipeline affecting the Patriots yet, remember that Virginia HC Al Groh is still good friends with Belichick too.

PatDaPatriot

Ferentz and Hill were assistant coaches for BB in Cleveland...

cstjohn17

That was an absolute steal, they got a adequate starting ILB and a very good backup TE for a 4th, sounds like a sweetheart deal between Dallas as Parcells.