Vikings at Pats re-watch thread.

[Kontradiction]

Pats were masters of disguise on defense

On eight passing downs -- typically third-and-five or more, but also on second and fourth-and-long plays -- the Patriots had just one down lineman. On those plays they often had two corners out wide. The other eight players? They'd stroll around between the tackles and within 10 yards from the line of scrimmage, talking to each other and refusing to declare their intentions to either rush or cover.

The players you'd expect to rush in those situations often did: Trey Flowers was typically the lone lineman on the nose; Van Noy and fellow linebackers Dont'a Hightower and John Simon were frequent rushers as well out of that look.

But the defensive backs on the field were the ones who were hard to pin down, particularly the safeties. At times, the Patriots used four safeties at a time -- Duron Harmon, Devin McCourty, Patrick Chung and Obi Melifonwu -- and they all rushed at different points.

The results were spectacular and led to more sacks for the D. Definitely not the kind of front you're going to see against a more mobile QB with more of an emphasis on contain.

 

[TheRainMaker]

I liked the fronts they had yesterday. It looked like the early 2000’s defenses where you didn’t know who was coming.

 

[PP2]

Welcome to the analysis only thread. No hot takes allowed in here. Plenty of other threads for that.

Please be civil. Feel free to critique the play or disagree, but please don't become personal or start attacking each other. If you attack another poster, your post will be flagged for removal.

Also, this thread is not some sort of "exclusive club." Everyone is welcomed to participate, to post an analytical tweet that's relevant, or to post original analysis, or a clip from the game.

Above all, if you don't understand something, whether it be terminology or concept, etc. Please ask!

 

[PP2]

 

[PP2]

 

[PP2]

And that 1 DL lineup that was frequently used on 3rd downs really threw Cousins for a loop. He couldn't key off on anything:

 

[PP2]

 

[Sicilian]

Question for those who are better versed in the X's and O's (unintentional rhyme):

When the Pats are doing their amorphous defense on 3rd down, where only Flowers has his hand down and everyone else is cris-crossing, wandering, and looking like a prowling predator, how do the defenders know where to go and who to cover? I know the purpose is to create doubt and confusion, so you don't know who's coming and who's dropping, but I saw Chung, Van Noy, Hightower, etc changing positions multiple times without knowing when the snap would actually occur. So, once it does, what do they key on to decide where they go in coverage? Is it just, "If I'm to your right when they snap, I've got this guy/zone", or is there more to it?

I love seeing it, because it looks so disruptive, so I'm curious what the weaknesses are on it, and what situations where it wouldn't be advisable.

 

[luuked]

That right there is the golden standard for how to do film review of a play. Explain things verbally, add in visual helpers to make it all easier to digest and then play the clip afterwards. Everyone watching it -- from the novice to the pro -- understands and maybe appreciates the design.

That is exactly the kind of content for here. Also, McDaniels had a great night.

 

[PP2]

Question for those who are better versed in the X's and O's (unintentional rhyme):

When the Pats are doing their amorphous defense on 3rd down, where only Flowers has his hand down and everyone else is cris-crossing, wandering, and looking like a prowling predator, how do the defenders know where to go and who to cover? I know the purpose is to create doubt and confusion, so you don't know who's coming and who's dropping, but I saw Chung, Van Noy, Hightower, etc changing positions multiple times without knowing when the snap would actually occur. So, once it does, what do they key on to decide where they go in coverage? Is it just, "If I'm to your right when they snap, I've got this guy/zone", or is there more to it?

I love seeing it, because it looks so disruptive, so I'm curious what the weaknesses are on it, and what situations where it wouldn't be advisable.

They all know what they're doing post-snap so it doesn't matter what they do pre-snap as far as they don't get too far out of position. Corners were in either man or blitz, backers either rush or drop back into zone, and occasionally a safety would drop back into a cover 1. There was no exotic coverage schemes, only exotic disguises. But it does require switching assignments on the fly- requires a lot of solid and clear communication. Very impressive performance, overall.

Pats were masters of disguise on defense

 

[PP2]

Sorry I missed this thread. I started one without looking.

 

[PlanB]

Matt Chatham has a great voice!

 

[TheRainMaker]

I love seeing it, because it looks so disruptive, so I'm curious what the weaknesses are on it, and what situations where it wouldn't be advisable.

I'd like to see the Pats use more of these fronts like they did in the early 2000's as most QB's in the NFL are incompetent. Cousins looked truly confused and was doing freak out throws in the 2nd half particular on that 3rd and 4th and long late in the game where he threw it 10 yards short of the 1st down. He made it too easy for the Pats defense.

Credit to the Pats secondary though. The amoeba defense doesn't work if your back end can't cover.

However, this defense may not work as well against mobile QB's as they would freak out and just take off running.

 

[Sicilian]

I'd like to see the Pats use more of these fronts like they did in the early 2000's as most QB's in the NFL are incompetent. Cousins looked truly confused and was doing freak out throws in the 2nd half particular on that 3rd and 4th and long late in the game where he threw it 10 yards short of the 1st down. He made it too easy for the Pats defense.

Credit to the Pats secondary though. The amoeba defense doesn't work if your back end can't cover.

However, this defense may not work as well against mobile QB's as they would freak out and just take off running.

It may also be more effective against teams with fluctuating o-lines (like the Vikings had), because it plays off of the QB's lack of confidence that the surprise blitz will be picked up. That same defense against a QB who trusts his OL completely may not work, because he won't panic and will give the play time to develop as it should.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Nice observations regarding the Amoeba defense..

___________________________________

During the game day thread, a few posters (good people by the way) starting arguing about the play calling; specifically regarding the late emergence of Josh Gordon. I believe that it was in fact a prudent move to "hold back" a little. Basically play calling may be like playing cards. Anyone with X & O knowledge or film technology care to comment?

 

[oldrover]

And that 1 DL lineup that was frequently used on 3rd downs really threw Cousins for a loop. He couldn't key off on anything:

Hope this doesn't qualify as a hot take, but this lineup was a key part of the success against the Vikes, 10 guys milling around, VERY noticeable... and I don't recall Joe and Troy mentioning it ONCE. Thankfully, the results outweighed the annoyance.

 

[Kontradiction]

Nice observations regarding the Amoeba defense..

___________________________________

During the game day thread, a few posters (good people by the way) starting arguing about the play calling; specifically regarding the late emergence of Josh Gordon. I believe that it was in fact a prudent move to "hold back" a little. Basically play calling may be like playing cards. Anyone with X & O knowledge or film technology care to comment?

They went away from Gordon early on because the Vikings were specifically focused on taking away everything that the Patriots were doing at the sticks. They concentrated on the short passing game as a response. When the Vikings adjusted to try to take away everything underneath in the second half, they went to Gordon.

 

[bresna]

I thought for sure that was going to draw a flag. I thought that would draw an unnecessary roughness call. We'll see if the league calls it that later this week.

 

[jah]

And that 1 DL lineup that was frequently used on 3rd downs really threw Cousins for a loop. He couldn't key off on anything:

That's some vintage Rex Ryan ****.

 

[Uptown]

Genius! In this NFL climate, you’d better be able to STOP DA YAC