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Julian Edelman doesn't tend to get the credit and respect he deserves around the league, but one former player took notice in a recent ESPN segment, putting him ahead of some notable names which created some controversy.

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The Derby 2019

Discussion in 'The PatsFans.com Pub' started by Triumph, May 4, 2019.

  1. XLIX

    XLIX Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    It’s a no-win situation that sports face. People complain about too much replay. Then when a bad call happens, people complain about how the bad call was allowed to stand.

    The vast majority of experts I have heard speak on this issue say they made the right call yesterday. I don’t see a problem with using replay to get the call right. The point was made that if it was any other race, the replay review would have taken about 60 seconds to DQ Maximum Security.

    I have no problem using replay to prevent egregious errors like the one we saw in the NFCCG. Quite honestly, it boggles my mind why anyone would oppose that.
     
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  2. captain stone

    captain stone Pro Bowl Player

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    I wonder how quick the stewards would have been to DQ the winner if he had been trained by Pletcher or especially Baffert.

    What makes the decision to DQ so wrong is that the horse who benefitted the most from the disqualifying event - Country House, by galloping past the two stalled horses ahead of him, from the outside - is the same horse who benefitted the most from the actual disqualification. That's not the way it's supposed to work.
     
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  3. robertweathers

    robertweathers PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I see Tom in that hat I think of...

    5b8d36d0a639e004e1cab552.png
     
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  4. Actual Pats Fan

    Actual Pats Fan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    yeah just like the Democ -- oops! no politics
     
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  5. Actual Pats Fan

    Actual Pats Fan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    [​IMG]
    "Sandman, this is Viper Command, you're being spooked by com chatter, over!"
     
  6. Actual Pats Fan

    Actual Pats Fan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    By far the worst, in terms of most egregiously biased in favor of the inferior team, case of incompetent officiating in basketball was the 1987 NBA Finals Game 4 at the Garden.

    What a disgrace, and a joke.

    This is the coherent, thorough, objective analysis of what was, amazingly, worse than the Kings-Fakers robbery in the 2002 WCF:

    Highly questionable officiating led to late Laker rally in epic shootout that came down to a final Bird buzzer beater

    This was only one of an avalanche of wrong calls which are recounted in detail:

    Jabbar made the first free throw to pull LA within one point, and the center eyed the 14th Laker foul shot of the final period (Boston had shot just one free throw, McHale's miss on the hook putback at the 8:35 juncture).

    As the Garden crowd howled its loudest and the fans behind the basket went crazy to distract Jabbar, the second free throw was just short and thus went in and out, spinning off to the right. Parish had sealed out Johnson on the left box (why wasn't he matched up with the taller Thompson? - while McHale battled his former Minnesota teammate, and Bird boxed out the shooter).

    On the rebound, Thompson shoved McHale under the hoop, and gave him an extra push with his right arm as the ball went in and then kicked out toward them. Playing with the bad feet and unable to hold his position, McHale had gotten too low in trying to fend off the more muscular Thompson.

    Parish went up for the ball with McHale as both had inside position, and Kevin appeared to have his left hand on it as his body was moved forward from the Thompson push. Thompson then hit McHale's hand to knock the ball out of his grasp and out of bounds to the left.

    But to the casual eye, the ball appeared to be knocked out by McHale, especially due to the direction the ball caromed out of bounds from.

    Evans was stationed on the right end of the baseline, far from where the ball went out, but not far from where McHale had been pushed.

    The Celtics screamed for a foul, or at least possession. Strom was positioned outside, diagonally away from the play, and Evans walked down the baseline toward the ball initially without making a call. McHale, DJ and Ainge all pointed in Boston's direction for possession, waiting for a decision.

    But the closer Johnson immediately clapped and acted decisively like it was definitely LA's ball, and the hesitant Evans pointed the Lakers' way.

    "It's off white, Lakers' ball," Evans finally said. "Hugh made the call and it looked right to me," Strom added as Auerbach fumed in the stands, hands over his head as if trying to pull down the rebound himself. Fellow owner Harry Mangurian stood with his hands on his hips and glared toward the court at the officials in anger and disbelief.

    McHale pleaded in Evans' face, saying, "he hit the ball out" meaning Thompson, but to no avail.

    It was a critical decision lightly made by a pair of tired officials in such a monumentally decisive play. Strom was almost 60 and had spent half his life running up and down NBA courts officiating big games, while Evans just seemed overwhelmed by the situation, the heat, the clamoring crowd and the intensity of the pivotal championship contest.

    Had Boston gotten the call, they would have held the ball, been fouled and almost certainly won the game to tie the series 2-2. Their chances of winning the title would have been 50-50 at least, and NBA history might have been written much differently.

    Usually in such situations, if it is unclear who hit the ball out of play off a missed free throw, the referees almost always tend to give the ball to the defense. Or at least call a jump ball, as they had on the missed Cooper kick ball call. Or how about a pushing foul on Thompson, who had been getting with shoving all night?

    But none of the three rulings that would have helped the Celtics retain their hard-fought lead was forthcoming on the critical play. Instead, the worst scenario for Boston took place - a possible three-point possession to lose the game instead of at the very worst, going to overtime had Jabbar made both free throws. The Celtics would have been much better off if Jabbar had made the second foul shot to tie it.

    Like a prisoner on basketball's death row given a last-minute reprieve from the commisioner, LA had another new life and got the ball out of bounds in excellent position under the basket. Riley called timeout and set up a last play with seven ticks, plenty of time, to go in the epic battle.
     
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  7. 1960Pats

    1960Pats PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think instant replay is the best thing to happen to sports. Because of that we get the right calls more often and that's what I'm looking for, no matter which team they help.

    I'm also not a whining loser millennial. Far from it.

    This country never has and doesn't now suck.

    The worst thing to happen to sports is the idiotic idea that kids shouldn't be taught how to lose, or that all kids should pitch, play shortstop, play the same amount of time or that you don't have to earn a spot. That's the real problem with sports.
     
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  8. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yet another great example of why instant replay should be banned from sports.
     
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  9. Chevrolet

    Chevrolet Practice Squad Player

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    Objectively, Instant replay was available and used correctly. Maximum Security impaired the Other horse clear as day as running out of his lane. Stewards had a tough decision in such a big race, but they are supposed to enforce the rules. Damn sure, jockeys will be more careful in future races which is the way it should be.

    Yes Maximum security would have won without the violation, BUT the violation on replay was clear. Stewatds did the right thing and made the courageous call.


    Easy way out would have been not to call it.
     
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    Last edited: May 7, 2019
  10. 1960Pats

    1960Pats PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Too bad they didn't have instant replay back then. ;)
     
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  11. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Not to be a homer, but look at SB42. Even O’Hara admitted he got away with a blatant holding call. That cost the Patriots a 19-0 season. I don’t whine about it. Last year there was a huge pick play the Chiefs got away with. The Eagles got two TDS that stood that apparently were TDS but wouldn’t have been a few weeks prior.

    Then the Saints are whining about the blatant missed call, but they got away with a blatant automatic penalty for hitting Goff’s helmet
    the series before, so arguably they should have already lost or been in a position to lose.

    The point is it never ends. Now it’s coming down to WHICH plays should we review to arbitrarily contribute the outcome of the game, rather than arbitrarily contributing to the outcome of the game based on just human error alone. Both teams get the wrong end of close calls all the time - it’s part of sports. But you can’t have replay watching 22 players for infractions...instead they focus on 1-2 little “challengeable” events and the team that gets fortunate to have been screwed by challenge-worthy plays gets the advantage over the team that gets screwed by “non-challengable” plays.

    Also sports and officiating were designed to be played in real-time, not frame by frame.

    The experiment looks worse every year. Fans still gripe as often, if not more, that they didn’t get a fair shake. Might as well just play the damn game and quit this 10 minute review crap. Just move on and play the next play.
     
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  12. bormio

    bormio In the Starting Line-Up

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    There is no perfect officiating. Someone is always screwed, whether there are 20 bad calls or 3
     
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  13. 1960Pats

    1960Pats PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The main problem with instant replay is how it changed the way the refs work. It seems like they make certain calls because they know they'll be automatically reviewed.
     
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  14. XLIX

    XLIX Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    So taking a bad call and making it right is bad? Can’t say I agree.
     
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  15. primetime

    primetime Pro Bowl Player

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    Inquiries have been part of horse racing as long as it's existed. They just used still photographs to make calls before. There's a reason the term "photo finish" exists.
     
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  16. Triumph

    Triumph Pro Bowl Player

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  17. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'm sorry...all you post facto "experts" are just so full of shyt it stinks to the other side of the galaxy. That despicable social justice warrior re-engineering of the Kentucky Derby was the latest in a string of flabbergasting politically correct driven azzhat decisions in recent American history.
    Yeah, it's "cunnin'" that the old trainer what never won the big one got the prize of his life on his last race. "Gaa Gaa Goony everybody!! Participation trophies for everyone!" Max. Sec. LEAD THE ENTIRE RACE....in slop the likes of which NONE OF YOU have ever witnessed. No, you don't put that ridiculous SJW spin on it.."he veered to the right...NOT FAIR!! Mommy, hold me!!". This has NEVER BEEN CALLED in a Kentucky Derby in centuries and now YOU, the new breed arbiters of righteous indignation are going to denigrate the obvious winner because YOU don't understand MUD and how it affects any horse race??
    and Chevrolet, the stewards didn't make "the courageous [email protected]!!" what a load of horseshyt. I SAW the woman steward constantly pointing at the replays and the freeze frames and waving her arms animatedly. SHE WAS SOCIAL JUSTICE WARRIORING!!! I've seen horses run in slop for over sixty years and I've SEEN lead horses veer left and right looking for solid footing in the muck. Let me tell you something you ignorant ba$tard, that glue factory reject CountryHouse couldn't win a frigging big race if he was the only horse in the field. The point IS, you nitwit, to determine the BEST horse in the field.A horse leads wire to wire, THAT is the winner. You start with this SJW crap and every time there's a bump out of the gate or lane cut off inside we'll get these ridiculous "participation trophy!" decisions by fat slobs with sprayed on platinum hair to the utter disassembly of THIS sport. It sucks and HAS sucked with all these fukkin' soccer moms insinuating themselves into every freakin' thing we enjoy.

    Tell you what experts, I want all of you to bet your life's earnings, your house , cars and kids college education on Country House in the Preakness...if he's even running.
     
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  18. bormio

    bormio In the Starting Line-Up

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    POTY (in the non-Patriots category)
     
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  19. Pats1013

    Pats1013 Rookie

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    Most disreputable era ever IMO.
     
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  20. 1960Pats

    1960Pats PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    My favorite horse racing story;

    Years ago my wife asked me if she could bet $50 with a bookie friend of mine on a horse she read about in a magazine while flying back from Florida.

    The name of the horse was Spend a Buck, a very fitting name of a horse for my wife to bet on. I told her it was ok as long as she paid the bet if she lost and didn't ask me for the money.

    Well, it did lose and my wife asked me afterward if I thought she wouldn't have to pay because the bookie was a friend of mine. Holding back the laughter I got him on the phone and handed it over to my wife. I kept my ear close to the phone and could hear him asking her if she would have taken the $50 if she won.

    The next time I saw the man he was very defensive and wanted to explain why he couldn't let her go without paying. That was when I explained how I set it all up and got a big kick out of hearing him explain it to her.
     
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