Run defense discussion (thread starting from 2020)

[patsfanfromoversea]

Interesting article from usa today​

Patriots Week 15 film review: Defensive front seven needs offseason addressing

Patriots Week 15 film review: Defensive front seven needs offseason addressing

patriotswire.usatoday.com

Most Common formation 2-4-5
DT — Adam Butler
DT– Lawrence Guy/Byron Cowart
EDGE (stand-up) — Taswhan Bower/John Simon
EDGE (stand-up) — Shilique Calhoun
LB — Ja’Whaun Bentley/Anfernee Jennings
LB — Terez Hall
CB — J.C. Jackson
CB — Stephon Gilmore/Jason McCourty
CB (slot)/S — Jonathan Jones
SS — Kyle Dugger/Adrian Phillips
FS — Devin McCourty
Looking at this lineup I see the need to change up most of these guys.
Butler ok backup for passing downs but not a big money gy
Guy the one good player on the front, UFA would be nice to have back
Byron Cowart lots of praise but I didn't see the production can get along without him
Tashawn Bower/John Simon I always liked Simon but the last couple games he has gone downhill both need to be replaced
Shalique Calhoun looks good in uniform see you later
Jawhaun Bentley always a tick behind, good tackler 7 yards downfield see you later
Anfernee Jennings willing to give him another year but didn't really see much
Terez Hall big chops for trying,, like him but he's not the answer
JC Jackson good corner will return
Stephon Gilmore/ Jason McCourty both gone different reasons
Jonathan Jones moves to Free Safety
Kyle Dugger/Adrian Phillips both keepers, if Chung returns (iffy) he might get Dugger moved to Free Safety and Jones remain in slot
Devin McCourty will enjoy retirement.

So from this group I'm only keeping 4 secondary people, 1 LB and not expecting a lot from him, no edge and maybe 2 DT's. Wise needs to be replaced also, makes a play once in a while but not good enough. And who do we have left not included with this group? Uche, Winovich, Williams, Bryant, ,maybe Rashod Berry, Carl Davis and Beau Allen and we don't know ANYTHING about the last 2. So I'm not worried about WR/TE, because until this group gets better it won't matter.

​

I would agree with a part of it esp the DE/DT/ILB group..I see the most guys there like Simon Bentley Hall as solid backups rotational guys but not really starting caliber. There is a big lack of playmakers upfront...and we need to figur out how to use Uche and Wino more often..can't stand seeing simon bower bentley play so much and uche wino off the field...i know wino struggled against the run but i would still consider him as our best edge defender although might not be his best fit on early downs but definitely on passing downs..uche needs probably more time to play against the run but at off the ball lb his quickness could be nice there behind a better d line..having him phillips dugger athletic guys behind the d line can help against the run..on passing downs uche needs to rush his closing speed is great..bentley and jennings aren't showing any sort of speed or change of direction quickness...i don't give up on jennings he will find his role even as rotational dude on edge...butler and guy are keepers for me hopefully...a new ILB/NT/DE would be nice...preferring a DE who is steady against the run cause wino and uche o the edge against the pass please..showing promise there
I can see loosing gilmore and jmac as well which would require a No. 2 cb on the outside next to JC Jackson fill in Gilmore's role

 

[captain stone]

Interesting article from usa today​

Patriots Week 15 film review: Defensive front seven needs offseason addressing

Patriots Week 15 film review: Defensive front seven needs offseason addressing

patriotswire.usatoday.com

Most Common formation 2-4-5
DT — Adam Butler
DT– Lawrence Guy/Byron Cowart
EDGE (stand-up) — Taswhan Bower/John Simon
EDGE (stand-up) — Shilique Calhoun
LB — Ja’Whaun Bentley/Anfernee Jennings
LB — Terez Hall

Butler ok backup for passing downs but not a big money gy
Guy the one good player on the front, UFA would be nice to have back
Byron Cowart lots of praise but I didn't see the production can get along without him
Tashawn Bower/John Simon I always liked Simon but the last couple games he has gone downhill both need to be replaced
Shalique Calhoun looks good in uniform see you later
Jawhaun Bentley always a tick behind, good tackler 7 yards downfield see you later
Anfernee Jennings willing to give him another year but didn't really see much
Terez Hall big chops for trying,, like him but he's not the answer

​

Worst front-6 in the Entire Feckin League, easily, and certainly the Very Worst in the past 20+ years here...and that includes the 2009-11 years.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Front 7 needs to be blown up. Winovich is a complementary player at best as he has regressed from last season. Jury is still out on Uche and Jennings, but positions still need to be addressed in case these guys aren't good enough.

 

[Scotty]

And some posters are saying we are only a couple of players short of being play off bound ???

 

[sb1]

Bumping this thread. Could have done a copy and paste for 2021. Lol

it’s like teams have now discovered that we will not start fast with our rookie QB and make it tough on them to run so they don’t mind running. That’s a problem.

Can they even fix this in an off-season or is it a major overhaul?

Dugger turning into an impact player is a good start but he can’t do it alone. He was missed yesterday.

 

[Scotty]

Agree with your comments.
In another thread today , I said after reading the team game stats how do our 3 running backs run for (134) almost the same amount of yards (117) as 1 of the Miami backs ? There seemed to be a lot of balanced discussion on the board pre game that this was a run the ball down their throats game and the Miami running game is poor....yet here we are disapointed with the performance.

I get that this is a rebuild year c/w rookie QB etc and can see improvements but something is not quite right.

 

[zimmy]

The run defence is just awful. Even well defended plays seem to go for 4 or 5 yards with defenders carried downhill. It's complete team breakdowns though - setting the edge has been a problem, I've noticed Judon in particular recently. But we miss a real run stuffing nose tackle too and the inside guys have overrun the ball numerous times.

I suppose ironically they will be happy if Buffalo runs the ball on Saturday though.

 

[Kontradiction]

A toilet clogger, two-gapper, 0-tech a DT has been a need since 2017. I’d put it as the second biggest need on this team going into the offseason. Right behind QB. We could have an all-world Mike and nobody would know it because of the ease with which the guards are getting to the second level and putting a hat on them against the run. Think Ray Lewis before and after the Ravens drafted Ngata.

Still a need going into 2022. Jordan Davis would look great in a Flying Elvis.

 

[‘Mondre]

NO WE GOTTA GET A JAMAR CHASE

 

[Scotty]

NO WE GOTTA GET A JAMAR CHASE

we need both

 

[holyredeemer]

NO WE GOTTA GET A JAMAR CHASE

1. They don’t grow on trees.
2. To get one, you’ve typically gotta be picking a lot higher than the Pats usually pick.
3. I agree that a big playmaker at WR is a need, but feel that fixing our D is of higher importance.

 

[sb1]

Feels like we could see this defense blown up and rebuilt almost from scratch this offseason minus a few foundational pieces. Depending on what they do with JCJ secondary could be just as major a need as LB and a big run stuffer.

 

[p8ryts]

Feels like we could see this defense blown up and rebuilt almost from scratch this offseason minus a few foundational pieces. Depending on what they do with JCJ secondary could be just as major a need as LB and a big run stuffer.

Wise Bentley Hightower Collins Uche McCourty are candidates for upgrade.

 

[Steve102]

NO WE GOTTA GET A JAMAR CHASE

Can he stop the run?

 

[Toofy]

Wise Bentley Hightower Collins Uche McCourty are candidates for upgrade.

I thought wise has played good this season. Good pressure and batted passes.

HT, uche, wino seem invisible and recently van noy, Collins and Bentley.

 

[Scotty]

We still have Perkins , McMillan and McGrone to come back. (and Anfernee Jennings)

 

[borg]

The run defence is just awful. Even well defended plays seem to go for 4 or 5 yards with defenders carried downhill. It's complete team breakdowns though - setting the edge has been a problem, I've noticed Judon in particular recently. But we miss a real run stuffing nose tackle too and the inside guys have overrun the ball numerous times.

This!

I've watched this all season and got to see this in person yesterday.....Yikes!
Duke Freakin Johnson, who has averaged a whopping 5 carries per game over his forgettable 7 year career, steamrolled this sorry lot.

Patriots lose the LOS battles vs solid teams more often than not vs quality teams, it's almost a given now!

And don't get me started on the East-West speed of the slowing/aging/JAGgy LB corp

GM Bill has to address this in a major way this offseason because Coach Bill + Jr can't succeed with the existing parts

 

[sb1]

deleted

 

[ashley]

Feels like we could see this defense blown up and rebuilt almost from scratch this offseason minus a few foundational pieces. Depending on what they do with JCJ secondary could be just as major a need as LB and a big run stuffer.

JC has to be resigned. I think that's the first step, then after that we can never have enough pass rushers and then a big fat body in the middle.

 

[ashley]

That post was from last year. Haven't seem him around lately.

I bumped this thread up instead of making a new topic saying the same thing.

ahhhh....lol, thanks sb....will delete it then......having a rough Monday...