OT: LIV Golf

[venecol]

 

[Bill Lee]

I hope players take the PGA to court.

Reality:
PGA players are required to operate as independent contractors and cover their own costs...ie caddies, travel, lodging....for a chance to perform in front of paying audiences with zero guaranteed income for their services. In fact half or more of the field in a typical tournament earns $0.
The PGA limits entries at every tournament, restricts entry at certain tournaments, and players are required to adhere to the whims of the PGA when requesting permission to boost income by entering non PGA events .

Free agency in pro team sports fell decades ago.
The NCAA is losing battles almost monthly as amateurs are no longer restricted from income opportunities.
And IMO, the PGA's authoritarian practices and monopolistic stranglehold on its members are ripe for a take down

The hard part would be finding a judge who isn't a golfer...

 

[Bill Lee]

Right, so taking in $700M-$900M in one shot would really accelerate the growth of his portfolio, ASSUMING it wouldn't crater the value of the rest of the portfolio which is built up on many golf-related investments. I'd say that's a bad assumption, though.

 

[All3Phases]

I think Tiger is in legacy - protection mode now. Moving to the LIV would be a seismic event.

Plus he makes ~$60m in endorsements annually.

To me, the reason why Tiger didnt join LIV is pretty simple. Its like asking why Tom Brady plays football. Guys are just psychotic competitors.

 

[RobertWeathers]

To me, the reason why Tiger didnt join LIV is pretty simple. Its like asking why Tom Brady plays football. Guys are just psychotic competitors.

Agree 100%.

For him to come back from what he has endured (back, legs)...making a boatload of cash is not the motivation.

Same thing with Bird with the back issues. He could have retired but he wanted to play and beat people's asses.

That's Tiger.

 

[venecol]

Lol

 

[All3Phases]

Agree 100%.

For him to come back from what he has endured (back, legs)...making a boatload of cash is not the motivation.

Same thing with Bird with the back issues. He could have retired but he wanted to play and beat people's asses.

That's Tiger.

The competition on the LIV tour is not something that will drive these guys. The guys are going over there specifically for the money and to play an easy schedule. Personally I understand it for the fringe tour guys trying to make a living...Phil and DJ, for example, to me just screams lack of competitiveness

 

[XLIX]

I don't see why people think golfers leaving for LIV lack some sort of competitiveness. They will still get to play in most (if not all) of the majors, and those are the only tournies anyone really gives a sh*t about. No one is waiting with baited breath to see who wins the PGA's Barbasol Championship next month.

 

[RobertWeathers]

The competition on the LIV tour is not something that will drive these guys. The guys are going over there specifically for the money and to play an easy schedule. Personally I understand it for the fringe tour guys trying to make a living...Phil and DJ, for example, to me just screams lack of competitiveness

I don't see why people think golfers leaving for LIV lack some sort of competitiveness. They will still get to play in most (if not all) of the majors, and those are the only tournies anyone really gives a sh*t about. No one is waiting with baited breath to see who wins the PGA's Barbasol Championship next month.

I think they will still want to compete and beat the field but the stress of knowing if they miss a 4ft putt they lose a match or $700k purse for playing 2nd or 3rd will not be missed.

Guys like Tiger live for those moments.

 

[All3Phases]

I don't see why people think golfers leaving for LIV lack some sort of competitiveness. They will still get to play in most (if not all) of the majors, and those are the only tournies anyone really gives a sh*t about. No one is waiting with baited breath to see who wins the PGA's Barbasol Championship next month.

The majors point is fair, I guess we will have to see how it turns out. There is still a lot of prestigious events on Tour though, and simply being in the record books is competition. You dont know all of Tigers 82 wins, but you know he has 82 and a lot of them were throwaway tournaments. His stature was partially built on those. If the LIV events offered these guys less money, they wouldn't bat an eye. Golf is a lot easier when theres less pressure

Let alone the fact that they simply arent stacking themselves up against the best players in the world

 

[All3Phases]

I think they will still want to compete and beat the field but the stress of knowing if they miss a 4ft putt they lose a match or $700k purse for playing 2nd or 3rd will not be missed.

Guys like Tiger live for those moments.

I think all the stress is gone once you have the money in your pocket. I dont think the feeling of walking down 18 with a 1 shot lead in a big tournament will be there anymore. Especially with the shotgun starts.

 

[XLIX]

I think they will still want to compete and beat the field but the stress of knowing if they miss a 4ft putt they lose a match or $700k purse for playing 2nd or 3rd will not be missed.

I think all the stress is gone once you have the money in your pocket. I dont think the feeling of walking down 18 with a 1 shot lead in a big tournament will be there anymore. Especially with the shotgun starts.

You're kidding, right? You don't think there's stress when a player comes under center in the Super Bowl, goes to the plate in the World Series, or shoots a 3-pointer tonight at the Garden...?

Most sports do not have money on the line as a difference between winning and losing* but there is a tremendous amount of stress involved in competing on the highest stage in front of millions of people.

*The difference between the winner's share and loser's share in pro sports is pennies for the superstars

 

[All3Phases]

You're kidding, right? You don't think there's stress when a player comes under center in the Super Bowl, goes to the plate in the World Series, or shoots a 3-pointer tonight at the Garden...?

Most sports do not have money on the line as a difference between winning and losing* but there is a tremendous amount of stress involved in competing on the highest stage in front of millions of people.

*The difference between the winner's share and loser's share in pro sports is pennies for the superstars

Of course there is, that pressure and performance under pressure is what creates a legacy. But let me rephrase the question, is there as much pressure in shooting a 3 at the garden for the Maine Red Claws if youre Jayson Tatum? Or if Brady takes a snap in the XFL championship? These guys are no longer competing at the highest level and thats factual. The pressure is no longer as great

Specifically in LIV, they are playing for money, they arent gaining anything else. The notable players received 100-200 million just for showing up. I dont think Phil or DJ really cares how they play in these things. Like you said, if they are allowed to play in the Majors, then maybe its a win/win for them. We will have to see how this shakes out.

 

[Boomer B]

The competition on the LIV tour is not something that will drive these guys. The guys are going over there specifically for the money and to play an easy schedule. Personally I understand it for the fringe tour guys trying to make a living...Phil and DJ, for example, to me just screams lack of competitiveness

Phil is 51, he’s not gonna be competing week to week on the PGA tour anymore. There is no chance in hell on the PGA tour he could even earn 10% of the guaranteed money ($200m) that LIV is paying him. It’s a no brainer for him.

 

[borg]

To me, the reason why Tiger didnt join LIV is pretty simple. Its like asking why Tom Brady plays football. Guys are just psychotic competitors.

Totally disagree
Woods is "done" for all intensive purposes but his legacy will be forever linked with the PGA so a "delinking" via LIV would tarnish a legacy that took years to rebuild after whoring around with every hooker, escort, porn star and social climber who dangled their #*%& while wifey and kids were home baking Swedish cookies and listening to ABBA.
You also think Nicklaus took a hard pass on the LIV because of his competitive juices? The guy is the talisman of the PGA and would never circumvent the organization that reveres him so.
Severing themselves from the PGA for easy money was always a non-starter. Both get big money/no effort opportunities daily and they sift thru the silly and choose those that enhance their brands. LIV is a brand killer (for now)
FYI: Reported today Tiger is a billionaire

Norman on the other hand has been an opportunist from day 1.

Side note:
When I move to S. Florida years ago Norman was the big fish in the PGA and a huge presence down here. Ocean mansion , "Shark" boat company (tried to compete with Hatteras Yachts), golf course designer, buddied/whored around with Bill Clinton (while still in office) in Jupiter multiple times. Norman was a recent divorcee who hooked up with Chris Evert (used to see the two at my kids school parents nights). And the guy traveled everywhere in his helicopter. I probably saw it fly over head 40 times. I used to golf at a course in Delray and Norman would land his copter on the practice range and go drink beer with his buddy the pro while blocking the range for us hacks. Saw that move 4 times. Go to the beach, see the "Shark" copter fly by like clockwork.
When I learned he was the LIV point man, my first reaction was...."Ran out of money"

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Totally disagree
Woods is "done" for all intensive purposes but his legacy will be forever linked with the PGA so a "delinking" via LIV would tarnish a legacy that took years to rebuild after whoring around with every hooker, escort, porn star and social climber who dangled their #*%& while wifey and kids were home baking Swedish cookies and listening to ABBA.
You also think Nicklaus took a hard pass on the LIV because of his competitive juices? The guy is the talisman of the PGA and would never circumvent the organization that reveres him so.
Severing themselves from the PGA for easy money was always a non-starter. Both get big money/no effort opportunities daily and they sift thru the silly and choose those that enhance their brands. LIV is a brand killer (for now)
FYI: Reported today Tiger is a billionaire

Norman on the other hand has been an opportunist from day 1.

Side note:
When I move to S. Florida years ago Norman was the big fish in the PGA and a huge presence down here. Ocean mansion , "Shark" boat company (tried to compete with Hatteras Yachts), golf course designer, buddied/whored around with Bill Clinton (while still in office) in Jupiter multiple times. Norman was a recent divorcee who hooked up with Chris Evert (used to see the two at my kids school parents nights). And the guy traveled everywhere in his helicopter. I probably saw it fly over head 40 times. I used to golf at a course in Delray and Norman would land his copter on the practice range and go drink beer with his buddy the pro while blocking the range for us hacks. Saw that move 4 times. Go to the beach, see the "Shark" copter fly by like clockwork.
When I learned he was the LIV point man, my first reaction was...."Ran out of money"

Didn't he have to give his ex wife a $hitload of money in the divorce?

 

[Boomer B]

To me, the reason why Tiger didnt join LIV is pretty simple. Its like asking why Tom Brady plays football. Guys are just psychotic competitors.

Tiger may be done competitively. He hasn’t recovered from his accident and can’t last a full 4 rounds. Maybe part of the reason he didn’t join is he can’t play and who knows if he’ll ever get back in full.

 

[rochrist]

Didn't he have to give his ex wife a $hitload of money in the divorce?

Yes. He still has a billion+.

 

[XLIX]

Of course there is, that pressure and performance under pressure is what creates a legacy. But let me rephrase the question, is there as much pressure in shooting a 3 at the garden for the Maine Red Claws if youre Jayson Tatum? Or if Brady takes a snap in the XFL championship? These guys are no longer competing at the highest level and thats factual. The pressure is no longer as great

Specifically in LIV, they are playing for money, they arent gaining anything else. The notable players received 100-200 million just for showing up. I dont think Phil or DJ really cares how they play in these things. Like you said, if they are allowed to play in the Majors, then maybe its a win/win for them. We will have to see how this shakes out.

Fair statement

 

[All3Phases]

Tiger may be done competitively. He hasn’t recovered from his accident and can’t last a full 4 rounds. Maybe part of the reason he didn’t join is he can’t play and who knows if he’ll ever get back in full.

I think that’d be more of a reason for him to join, doesn’t have to play 4 rounds…just be a spokesperson and make a billion. He didn’t, I still think he internally believes he can win, Christ he makes cuts without being able to walk. His inner drive in unbelievable