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Kontra vs Pape


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Ice_Ice_Brady

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I never asked Ian, or any moderator for that matter, to ban kontradiction. But I am glad he's gone.
:evil: You rated PP2’s post as a Winner calling for Kontra’s ban, after you posted a thread inherently exposing him. You’re playing word games.
I don't mix things up just to go running to the moderators to protect me. I think The Post proves that point to a startling degree.
I’m glad you’re manning up to respond to this post, though you’ve clarified at the end you’ve decided to run away.
So don't try and cast me in that light. I knew what I was doing. This is not the first time a poster here has deliberately gone after my wife. Used her passing in order to hurt me. But it will be the last.
So Kontra isn’t the only poster who has done this? May I suggest you also consider why you’re choosing to interact with these types of posters and your own role in these multiple escalations? We know you also go personal to others.
I may not be the easiest person to get along with. I might be an *******. Don't care. Mute me. Ignore me. Go after me. Take pot shots at me. Make it personal about me.
Maybe you should be banned too. The irony that you’re saying you’re an ******* but people can just ignore you, while absolutely trying to get Kontra banned when you could just ignore him.
Leave my wife out of it.
Says the guy who went after Kontra’s wife first. Explain how a guy has dealt with nasty comments about his deceased wife decides to take a personal shot about another man’s wife first, then claims it’s a sacrosanct topic.
 
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Kdo5

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it seems like two tiered justice, just like the usa
I wish you were gone long before Kontra. Your outward racism and spamming has been non-stop garbage for years. Additionally you never miss a chance to inject your politics into the football threads.

That said I like Kontra, we have gone at each other before but at the end of the day we just got over it and had friendly discourse afterward. He is usually the “provocateur” when exchanges begin but personal attacks didn’t really start flying unprompted. Still I understand why you are upset @Pape. My condolences for your loss.

I think Kontra is a unique guy on PF and a valued member though at the end of the day Ian and the mods have the right to decide what is permissible. Kontra is the type of guy that would flourish on a no holds-barred type of forum.
 
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TB12TheGoat

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wow Kontra was perma banned? from what I’m reading, he didn’t start the personal insults, he just punched back harder. kind of like a school fight where a kid talks ****/bullies another kid and hits him, then the kid who got hit first lays the instigator out. kid who started it and got laid out goes and tells the teachers

I get why Pape is pissed off about what he said, but when you throw the first personal insult at someone about their family, don’t be surprised if the other person hits back harder…

a ****ty all around situation
 

Seacoast Fan

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Why exactly did Ian create partitions on this forum? Thread Ignores, Member Ignores.

Sure, many people do not like Kontra. He has pissed off a lot of posters. I’m not defending the way he’s alienated people, although I’d argue he’s usually of the same mentality as his “opponents” but is better at beating them into submission.

Others really like Kontra. Some have been through personal struggles and he has offered support. Some just seem to connect to him.

For long time board members to engage in a mudslinging fight with him and then cry to the mods is pretty ridiculous. As @Pape stated, he’s gone very personal in the past. You know what you’re getting into. You have many options to disengage.

I like @Pape . I’ve had a lot of good football banters with him. I don’t think going after the tragedy of his wife was appropriate, but I also think the severity of this ban is not appropriate and feel that Pape is like a kid in a schoolyard who goes up to a bully, purposely picks a fight, gets punched in the face, then cries to the teachers for an expulsion. It’s a weak look. It’s not a good precedent.

There are at least a dozen posters who are extremely opposed to this ban and communicated with Kontra frequently.

The site is losing the most interesting posters. The mentality that “we’ll be fine without this one” reminds me of Patriots thinking circa 2019. Ultimately you need to deal with personalities - and the bad stuff that comes with the good stuff - or you’re going to have a very lame, bottom tier, uninspired forum.
I have no dog in this hunt. I hope both pape and kontra can continue to post.
But saying that “he’s better at beating them into submission “ is the problem.
If you feel the need to beat someone on this board with whom you don’t agree into submission… especially on a personal level…you need to take a serious look at yourself. The problem is you, not Ian or the mods.
 

StockingAnarchyNumber12

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I don’t dislike either of these people, but bringing family into an online argument is never something that should happen. I read the post and it wasn’t a good look by either person. Talking about someone’s dead wife however is pretty bad and should never have been posted. It goes beyond being dirty. It is just a gross post. Pape did however initiate bringing family into it so he’s not innocent either. Ian was right in coming down on Kontra. It isn’t fair to say anything regarding Ian and his decision. There needs to be some form of punishment for what was posted. I do however think that maybe forgiveness could be used here also. Have a talk with both Pape and Kontra and make it known that an internet argument isn’t important enough to ever bring family into. This is a football forum. Nobody really wants to look at that on here or anywhere for that matter. Have them apologize in pm and move on so the insults can be used to the eventual 3-9 Patriots.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

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I have no dog in this hunt. I hope both pape and kontra can continue to post.
But saying that “he’s better at beating them into submission “ is the problem.
If you feel the need to beat someone on this board with whom you don’t agree into submission… especially on a personal level…you need to take a serious look at yourself. The problem is you, not Ian or the mods.

You make a good point, but this is an internet forum. It attracts these personalities like a honeypot. Both posters in this argument are incredibly headstrong.
 

Ross12

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I don’t dislike either of these people, but bringing family into an online argument is never something that should happen. I read the post and it wasn’t a good look by either person. Talking about someone’s dead wife however is pretty bad and should never have been posted. It goes beyond being dirty. It is just a gross post. Pape did however initiate bringing family into it so he’s not innocent either. Ian was right in coming down on Kontra. It isn’t fair to say anything regarding Ian and his decision. There needs to be some form of punishment for what was posted. I do however think that maybe forgiveness could be used here also. Have a talk with both Pape and Kontra and make it known that an internet argument isn’t important enough to ever bring family into. This is a football forum. Nobody really wants to look at that on here or anywhere for that matter. Have them apologize in pm and move on so the insults can be used to the eventual 3-9 Patriots.
I understand your POV, but the problem here is that this isn’t the first time this exact same thing was done. Hence the punishment.
 

JayNM

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How many long time board members have either left or been banned due to a dispute about moderation? Whatever is happening with this board, I’d suggest that is not how to do it.
Im pretty sure Pape is not at fault here either then. Moderation on the internet is not as easy as you'd think at first glance, but I can confidently say that Ian cares about this place a lot, so he would hear and take cristiscism honestly, so why create a public fuss about this incident that doesn't involve you?

He doesn’t have to answer to me. But I’d say that in creating a thread for everyone on the board to see (and advocate banning Kontra) @Pape has made this is a public board issue, not me.
Sure, it's a mistake. He was obviously hot-headed. Priority then should be to cool it off

It is hard to defend yourself when you can’t login or post, or when you can no longer access the PMs that mitigate your offense, and when the guy who can login and access the PMs refuses to share them because they’d modify the perception of this dispute.
Again, Kontra can come to this site whenever he feels like. He can very easily message Ian or anyother guy and get this moving. If he feels he was slighted by the consequences of macking fun of beloved one's death of cancer, then again, it's his problem with the moderation, not yours if he doesn't ask you to. Unless you are planning to do the same in future. Not to mention you also don't know what was talked between all of the parties.

Anyway, I want this place to be its best. And the best course of action is to spread goodness and levelheadness. Maybe you can show support to Kontra without trying to get one over someone

Just to be clear, I like mayhem and in general war between post members is what keeps most forums going. But I also know that there are limits.
 
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Guts

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They're both my boys so I'll refrain in giving a legit opinion but my only thing and I've been saying it always that nobody should be banned unless you hack the website, spam or deliberately insult the main man Ian. I want everyone around here that's what made the site awesome to me
Maybe a time out would have been the proper punishment
 

BTTA

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Kontra has been very supportive and generous to me over the years. And I to him. This all makes me very sad.
I'm recovering from an emergency quintuple bypass right now, and his positive messaging was among the best I got going in to that.
When he got married, had kids, and generally stabilized his life, it was a huge victory for him. I will continue to celebrate that.
Yeah, his temper and darker habits cause him to be a jerk sometimes. Brain chemistry is a mysterious thing. There but for the Grace of God go I.

The true measure of our support for Ian is whether we deescalate hostility here, vs. use this as a place to act on our worst impulses. That's the metric.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

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Again, I'm pretty sure Pape is not at fault here.
How convincing.
Moderation on the internet is not as easy as you'd think at first glance, but I can confidently say that Ian cares about this place a lot, so he would hear and take cristiscism honestly, so why create a public fuss about this incident that doesn't involve you?
Did I create either public thread? No. Are you also here giving your opinion? Yes. Maybe it’s time for you to press Thread Ignore. I don’t see the purpose of your responses here other than taking a side in a passive aggressive way.
Sure, it's a mistake. He was obviously hot-headed. Priority then should be to cool it off
Pape - Made multiple mistakes (started **** talk, created public thread), should cool off

Kontra - Mistake (responded to and escalated **** talk), permanent ban

Got it.
Again, Kontra can come to this site whenever he feels like. He can very easily message Ian or anyother guy and get this moving. I
You must not understand the word ban.
f he feels he was slighted by the consequences of macking fun of beloved one's death of cancer, then again, it's his problem with the moderation, not yours.
Again, why are you here commenting about all of this while telling me it’s not my concern? Are you the spokesperson for the site?
Unless you are planning to do the same in future. Not to mention you also don't know what was talked between all of the parties.
Or perhaps I do.
Anyway, I want this place to be its best. And the best course of action is to spread goodness and levelheadness. Maybe you can show support to Kontra without trying to get one over someone
Really? Pape’s ******** isn’t mutually responsible for this? The many members PM’ing me right now must all have it wrong.
 

Pape

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:evil: You rated PP2’s post as a Winner calling for Kontra’s ban, after you posted a thread inherently exposing him. You’re playing word games.
word games? Whos the one playing word games here? When was PP2s post made? Well after Kontra was gone.
I’m glad you’re manning up to respond to this post, though you’ve clarified at the end you’ve decided to run away.
Running away? No. Not responding in that thread is all. I am still here. Moving the topic off the boards.
So Kontra isn’t the only poster who has done this? May I suggest you also consider why you’re choosing to interact with these types of posters and your own role in these multiple escalations? We know you also go personal to others.
Yeah, well the other guy is dead. So no worries there.
Maybe you should be banned too. The irony that you’re saying you’re an ******* but people can just ignore you, while absolutely trying to get Kontra banned when you could just ignore him.
Maybe I should be. But If i'm banned, I'm banned. I won't be getting others to fight my battles for me.
Says the guy who went after Kontra’s wife first. Explain how a guy has dealt with nasty comments about his deceased wife decides to take a personal shot about another man’s wife first, then claims it’s a sacrosanct topic.
Oh please. We both know there is an exceedingly large gap between what I said in a joking manner compared to his malicious post. If you can't differentiate that, what is the point in talking to you?
 

Family

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Pape - sorry for your loss.

I wish nobody was banned and this could be turned back, but it's partly a result of losing football.

These fights should only occur during the off season.

I bet there was not this degree of in-season wife mudslinging during the Brady years.
 

JayNM

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How convincing.

Did I create either public thread? No. Are you also here giving your opinion? Yes. Maybe it’s time for you to press Thread Ignore. I don’t see the purpose of your responses here other than taking a side in a passive aggressive way.

Pape - Made multiple mistakes (started **** talk, created public thread), should cool off

Kontra - Mistake (responded to and escalated **** talk), permanent ban

Got it.

You must not understand the word ban.

Again, why are you here commenting about all of this while telling me it’s not my concern? Are you the spokesperson for the site?

Or perhaps I do.

Really? Pape’s ******** isn’t mutually responsible for this? The many members PM’ing me right now must all have it wrong.
At any point I have given Pape a free pass. But if you look at this unbiased, it's pretty clear who has exploded this into another gear

Clearly you are still worked up (edit - let me re-word things here, maybe this isnt the best choice of word: it seems that is still a hot-topic for you than for me) and I don't plan to be passive agressive, so I won't talk about who is more wrong or not, since I don't think we'll reach agreement.

Regarding his ban... You know he it's easy to create another account right? Or to message someone in a board without a main account, very easy, and that's not even considering that it appears that he knows people offline who are in here.

My purpose is here to do what I do in every thread that I choose to comment on: Stand on my grounds and develop thoughts.
 

NashuaPats

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I read this blog frequently and I post a bit.

I have also been avid lurker of sons of Sam horn and CelticsStrong (formerly Celtics blog). Both of those sites have been quick to ban posters for their political views and angry words during arguments. I don’t know the stats, but the number of posters and and the amount of discussion has fallen significantly over the years. The diversity of thought and quality of discussions have suffered.

This site has been reluctant to do the same. I think as a result, the quantity and quality of discussion has remained which is why I still frequent it so much.

I agree Kontra clearly crossed a line and deserves a suspension, but I hope the permanent ban is reconsidered. He’s a frequent poster here and adds to the site even though it may come with some warts.
 

holyredeemer

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This whole thing is sad. Not just for everyone involved but mostly for the forum. If anyone has a disagreement with Pape, Ian, the mods, or have opinions they would like to voice on the matter should keep it to the PM’s. There have been some really thoughtful responses in this thread that I’m proud of along with some others that just appear to be opportunities to light the torches and march. Let’s continue to be thoughtful on how we respond to this and keep the forum on Patriots football.

Period.
 

StockingAnarchyNumber12

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I read this blog frequently and I post a bit.

I have also been avid lurker of sons of Sam horn and CelticsStrong (formerly Celtics blog). Both of those sites have been quick to ban posters for their political views and angry words during arguments. I don’t know the stats, but the number of posters and and the amount of discussion has fallen significantly over the years. The diversity of thought and quality of discussions have suffered.

This site has been reluctant to do the same. I think as a result, the quantity and quality of discussion has remained which is why I still frequent it so much.

I agree Kontra clearly crossed a line and deserves a suspension, but I hope the permanent ban is reconsidered. He’s a frequent poster here and adds to the site even though it may come with some warts.
I noticed and was vocal at the time a drop-off in quality the moment Brady left. Arguments seemed to become more common and people endlessly compared Brady versus Belichick.
 
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