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Idle thoughts - the "good loss" edition

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Oct 24th

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jmt57

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primetime

Pro Bowl Player
I don’t think Belichick would want any part of Newton at this point. He won’t hold up as a runner and without running he really isn’t an nfl caliber QB.

If a guy with an AY/A of 7.0 "really isn't any NFL caliber QB" I'm curious to find out who is, in your mind. His passing stats are on par with Andrew Luck's over the course of their careers, and he's generally had much worse supporting casts.

On the other hand, this attitude is a good example of why Cam will be available to the Patriots if they need a new starter.
 

Ring 6

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If a guy with an AY/A of 7.0 "really isn't any NFL caliber QB" I'm curious to find out who is, in your mind. His passing stats are on par with Andrew Luck's over the course of their careers, and he's generally had much worse supporting casts.

On the other hand, this attitude is a good example of why Cam will be available to the Patriots if they need a new starter.
Stats. Ugh
 

mgteich

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Cam may indeed be the best option available. However, this would require a radical change in the offense. My gut says that Josh would be gone, next year or in 2021. Edelman and Sanu would also be playing their last in 2020.

Maybe it's time to change the role of a QB in the NFL. I would note that this would require teams to put a greater emphasis on backup QB's, and even #3 QB's. Many teams seem to have done that, given the results so far this year. Backups have done extremely well.

Idle thoughts of my own... On Cam Newton, I think it's totally possible he's the Patriots starting QB in 2020 if Brady does retire or otherwise leave as rumored, because I think the Panthers are dumb enough to think Kyle Allen is good.
 

mgteich

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I certainly agree that folks underrate the difficulty in finding a good QB, even though several teams do seem to have 2 solid QB's on their teams.

I'm just not sure that Cam is up to accurately getting to his 3rd option in 2 1/2 seconds, after having the exactly same read on the defense as his receivers.

But. as of now, Cam is a reasonable choice. Marietta will also be available.

I think Cam would probably be fine in the Patriots system. I also think folks underrate the difficulty in finding a good QB.
 

captain stone

Hall of Fame Poster
Read the response a few times and trying to find logic.....So, are all running QB's assholes (Flute, Tarkenton, Vick), or just one's that you judge are me-first?
Ummm, Michael Vick...

Flutie & Tarkenton were running for their lives quite a lot of the time.

Read the post a few times trying to find your logic...still looking...
 

scout

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Ummm, Michael Vick...

Flutie & Tarkenton were running for their lives quite a lot of the time.

Read the post a few times trying to find your logic...still looking...
Then a QB who makes plays running is not acceptable (Russell Wilson)?
 

PScottman

In the Starting Line-Up
Then a QB who makes plays running is not acceptable (Russell Wilson)?

This debate has been hashed, rehashed, covered, smothered and chunked. Running QBs versus quarterbacks who can run.

The evidence is pretty overwhelming that one is much more likely to have success, longevity, and chances to win Super Bowls (Elway, Wilson, et al). The other may change NFL defenses for half a season or so but more likely shortens careers and can be easily defensed (see Tebow, Tim - baseball player, amongst others) once diagnosed.
 

captain stone

Hall of Fame Poster
Then a QB who makes plays running is not acceptable (Russell Wilson)?
Another Jumpy Punk who loves him some Hero Ball...loses the only feckin game I wanted him to win...was hoping he would leave last night's game on a stretcher...Feck him too.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

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Reminds me a bit of Cam Newton, who's built like an absolute tank. The coaching staff in Carolina should have done more to protect Cam over the years. He's a pretty good pocket passer - not an exceptional one, but certainly hovering around top-10 in the NFL when healthy. But he was special because he could break from the pocket, and unlike Wilson, Cam invited and even sought contact because he was so big that he could bully most linebackers and defensive backs. The problem is this exposed his lower body to all sorts of injuries, which in turn has begun to limit his ability as a passer as he moves into his 30s. People dismiss running quarterbacks, but the issue is less with running quarterbacks' skills than with their longevity. It's one thing if you're playing 10 games a year for 3 years in college... when it's 16+ for a decade in the NFL, with bigger and faster guys coming at you, well...

For what it's worth, I think Jackson could make a successful transition to a Wilson-type. But I think the Ravens are going to have to alter their offense from what it is now to get him there. Otherwise they risk bottling a shooting star for a couple years but losing it down the road. Maybe there's something to that - riding a QB to death for their first rookie contract then discarding him for another new, shiny QB.

Most of this post is spot on, except everything I’ve seen from Jackson suggests he will not be able to transition into a Russell Wilson type. He lacks the accuracy...I don’t care what his completion pct is...it’s about the ability to consistently throw on a dime from the 5-20 air yard range. I agree, if Jackson can stay immaculately healthy, it’s worth it for the Ravens. His game works when he’s able to do it. I can’t imagine he’ll be the same QB a year from now. As you pointed out, Cam is a tank, and even he has succumbed to the deterioration at age 30 and is far more accurate than Jackson. Jackson is literally an ankle sprain away from being close to CFL level. That’s a razor thin margin and quite a gamble.
 

luuked

Hall of Fame Poster
Not going to lie.

I don't care if it's Cam, Jackson, Vick, Jimmy... I really want to see him ..
create w a different QB. Its selfish & Madden-like but Id love to see him work w a Murray or even Baker?

Makes you wonder how deep Baker has to sink for Cleveland to even consider taking any calls / moving on.
 

luuked

Hall of Fame Poster
Idle thoughts of my own... On Cam Newton, I think it's totally possible he's the Patriots starting QB in 2020 if Brady does retire or otherwise leave as rumored, because I think the Panthers are dumb enough to think Kyle Allen is good.

Since we are posting idle thoughts like that. I would be more curious to see Mariota in a McDaniels offense. Still relatively young, athletic to open up a completely new part of the playbook and seems to have the perfect attitude. Only question is if the Titans have ruined him already and you can get him to take fewer hits.

Not saying its an instant Brady replacement but there is none anyway.
 

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