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2021 Offensive Rookie of the Year

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BradytoMosstoGronk

In the Starting Line-Up
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
I agree. I think even if Mac throws a Burrow-esque 500 yards this weekend, Chase is the better bet. Chase is at an all-pro level.
That'd sure make it interesting for voters. With that said, how can we even be upset. Mac played beyond people's expectations (the realistic-non Ultra Homer ones), and put himself in a position to be recognized for a great rookie season.

He just happens to be competing with another kid that's playing at an all-pro level. Props to Chase, and we walk away knowing Mac had a helluva year with a good future ahead of him.
 

sb1

Hall of Fame Poster
It will probably be unanimous and maybe it should be.

Which isn't a knock on Mac. Best rookie QB, second best offensive rookie and helped us get to the playoffs. Nothing wrong with that. And Mac and the passing game is not the identity of the offense this season, we are a run heavy and defensive team first.

If he's for real I'm sure Mac will get his shot at other awards in the future.
 
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Boston Boxer

U.S. Air Force Retired
PatsFans.com Supporter
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
we are very fortunate to have Mac as our QB and he is by far the best rookie QB selected last draft. What Chase is doing at WR is unreal...runaway OROY
 

sb1

Hall of Fame Poster
The 3 pass game followed by a bye followed by 2 clunkers really hurt Mac in that race. That's an entire month with nothing to show.
Chase had some bad games too like a game with only 1 catch for 3 yards and a couple of tip INTs in another. Agree though...the 3 pass game I figured at the time didn't hurt Mac's chances but now I think it did - it showed on a national game that he is not the focus of the Patriots offense this year and they can and do win without anything from him.
 
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Brotherblues

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
Yeah. Chase had some bad games too - a game with only 1 catch for 3 yards and a couple of tip INTs in another. Agree though...the 3 pass game I figured at the time didn't hurt Mac's chances but now I think it did - it showed on a national game that he is not the focus of the Patriots offense this year and they can and do win without anything from him.
I also wonder if there was an after-effect from the 3 pass game. Like if passing wasn't the plan, how much did they practice routes and timing that week? Since it was followed by a bye, that's 2 full weeks with minimal pass game reps in practice. Mac did mention a bad week of practice after that, so perhaps it can be tied to the rust of not really practicing the passing game for 2 weeks.

I could be way off but it sort of makes sense in my head.
 

‘Mondre

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
seriously?

as a WR you can win basically with your athelticism and route running only, the more gifted you are the easier you will transfer from college to NFL, a QB not only has to know and understand what his entire O (all 11 of them) is supposed to do on the field BUT has to understand what the D (all of them not only one CB/FS) are throwing at him, he has to be able to call protections and change them, he has to process everything in milliseconds and make the right call while he is been chased down by 4-5 280lbs rushers, there is a huge difference between what O and D do in college and what the best few hundred players and coaches do in the NFL on both sides of the ball (same is valid for Receivers as well for sure but yet again only by your talent you can immedialty make an impact if you have a proper QB that can throw you the ball)

as QB you cannot accelarate as rookie only based on your athleticism and fast feet since it takes way more to be good at the QB position than as a WR

than of course the importance of the position is different, if your QB ****s his bad the team is ****ed up, if your WR out of 3-4 WR/TEs per play ****s his bad and runs the wrong route the team is not ****ed up that much because the QB can go to other options instantly

Chase is great I don't mind him winning OROY, I am also pretty sure that Mac would have even better numbers with such WRs Cincy has than what he's got in NE
Give me examples.

i watch first take and listen to podcasts too.

you’re repeating stuff you’ve heard on tv.

take a play or interview from a wr and qbs respective points of view… and tell me how their critical thinking differs. Tell me the level of analysis (and not just rote memorization) either has to employ for success? Which one doesn’t anticipate the types of coverage on different levels? Which one doesn’t know or anticipate audibles based on what’s seen? Sure the scope and responsibilities are higher for a qb, but a receiver has route trees and a level of freedom/creativity to employ. They must make decisions on the fly based on who is perceived to be where. That’s also where coaching comes in but an intelligent player has to be perceptive of that to an extent. “If so and so bites on or moves to this, do that.” The qb identifies the mike in order to warn teammates so that they can adjust accordingly. That requires critical thinking all around.

or give me first hand experiences.

wrs are not just dogs. The qb executes a great deal but that doesn’t necessarily require or indicate any level of relative intelligence

is qb play more impactful? Probably. But the variance is high and relative to other positions it’s highly overrated.

making one man the identity of the team is not only easy for the involvement of dumber fans who can’t be bothered with minutia, it’s also more profitable from a marketing standpoint. “BRADY v MAHHOMMES” gets more eyeballs on documentaries, espn shows, ticket ads, forum posts, merchandise, etc… than “WEST COAST OFFENSE v MAN”… or what have you.

its an important position. I promise you, we get it. But it’s overrated.

The move towards todays ref philosophy is as lame as the 3-pt trend in the nba, and it’s a microcosm of consumerist culture, and exploitative.

also ALSO… it’s fun as a kid to see yourself in the qbs shoes. There’s a bit of that too.

“fOoTbAlL iS tHe UlTiMaTe TeAm SpOrT”… ok… so why does every goddamn thing have to be about the qb?

christ.
 

patfanken

PatsFans.com Supporter
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You had Tom Brady for 20 years though. Let's see if Jones can make everyone around him better as a rookie is not fair to ask that from him, but if we can get him some studs without limiting the rest of the team, why not go for it.
Well Tom Brady's rookie year he was splitting time as the scout team's QB and I doubt 25% of the fans that year knew he was on the team, IIRC he threw 3 passes that year and completed one. So I'd say Mac's rookie year has been a bit more productive. The question no one knows the answer to to is how he'll develop as the seasons go on.

But I agree that it is NOT fair to ask hime to make others around him better. This year it's incumbent on the more experienced members of the team to make HIM better. But he's done a fine job. over 3500 passing yds and over 20 TD is a fine accomplishment. A case can be made that he's currently a top 10- 12 QB by most standards NOW. But as we found out with Brady, getting the full gauge of what you have is a LONG term project We didn't know just how good Brady was for about 5 years, and then he kept surprising us with continued growth for the next 15, and he is surprising us even now..
 

masterbouncer

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
NFL Picks Grand Champ!
Give me examples.

i watch first take and listen to podcasts too.

you’re repeating stuff you’ve heard on tv.

take a play or interview from a wr and qbs respective points of view… and tell me how their critical thinking differs. Tell me the level of analysis (and not just rote memorization) either has to employ for success? Which one doesn’t anticipate the types of coverage on different levels? Which one doesn’t know or anticipate audibles based on what’s seen? Sure the scope and responsibilities are higher for a qb, but a receiver has route trees and a level of freedom/creativity to employ. They must make decisions on the fly based on who is perceived to be where. That’s also where coaching comes in but an intelligent player has to be perceptive of that to an extent. “If so and so bites on or moves to this, do that.” The qb identifies the mike in order to warn teammates so that they can adjust accordingly. That requires critical thinking all around.

or give me first hand experiences.

wrs are not just dogs. The qb executes a great deal but that doesn’t necessarily require or indicate any level of relative intelligence

is qb play more impactful? Probably. But the variance is high and relative to other positions it’s highly overrated.

making one man the identity of the team is not only easy for the involvement of dumber fans who can’t be bothered with minutia, it’s also more profitable from a marketing standpoint. “BRADY v MAHHOMMES” gets more eyeballs on documentaries, espn shows, ticket ads, forum posts, merchandise, etc… than “WEST COAST OFFENSE v MAN”… or what have you.

its an important position. I promise you, we get it. But it’s overrated.

The move towards todays ref philosophy is as lame as the 3-pt trend in the nba, and it’s a microcosm of consumerist culture, and exploitative.

also ALSO… it’s fun as a kid to see yourself in the qbs shoes. There’s a bit of that too.

“fOoTbAlL iS tHe UlTiMaTe TeAm SpOrT”… ok… so why does every goddamn thing have to be about the qb?

christ.
ok I see you seem to be triggered heavily by QBs or in general have some anger on how the NFL sells its product while using Mahomes, Brady Rodgers etc as the franchise face they are

I was not making any QB the identitiy of the team, the question is not about the Brady vs Mahomes or QBs in general in the game, the question was how easy is it to transition from College to NFL based on playing QB position or WR, so if you don't get it that just by being an atheltic freak you can light things up as a WR already as rookie while its way more difficult to shine as QB first year because it takes more than just being an atheltic freak to shine than I am fine, its your opinion good you have one but we don't need to agree...

I don't mind Chase winning OROY and I actually don't care if Mac wins it, for me it does not give any added value or extra joy, nice to have a light up rookie but I want to see the Pats win SB rings not MVPs and such fan voted staff
 

‘Mondre

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
ok I see you seem to be triggered heavily by QBs or in general have some anger on how the NFL sells its product while using Mahomes, Brady Rodgers etc as the franchise face they are

I was not making any QB the identitiy of the team, the question is not about the Brady vs Mahomes or QBs in general in the game, the question was how easy is it to transition from College to NFL based on playing QB position or WR, so if you don't get it that just by being an atheltic freak you can light things up as a WR already as rookie while its way more difficult to shine as QB first year because it takes more than just being an atheltic freak to shine than I am fine, its your opinion good you have one but we don't need to agree...

I don't mind Chase winning OROY and I actually don't care if Mac wins it, for me it does not give any added value or extra joy, nice to have a light up rookie but I want to see the Pats win SB rings not MVPs and such fan voted
I am triggered by dumb takes. My uncle played guard and introduced me to the “remembering the qbs name and face is the entry point to being a fan” stuff. Nothing necessarily wrong with that. It is what it is. I’m a fan of Batman cause I like the costumes. A real deep comic guy would eat me alive that’s why I kinda stay in my lane with that.

but don’t take it personally either. You said what you said, I asked you to explain, you went on like skip bayless. I asked you to elaborate, now you are getting defensive.

it’s fine. you’ll feel how you feel, but 1. Qb most imp position on field 2. Still overrated.

Don’t take it personally and understand both can be true.
 
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masterbouncer

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
NFL Picks Grand Champ!
I am triggered by dumb takes. My uncle played guard and introduced me to the “remembering the qbs name and face is the entry point to being a fan” stuff. Nothing necessarily wrong with that. It is what it is. I’m a fan of Batman cause I like the costumes. A real deep comic guy would eat me alive that’s why I kinda stay in my lane with that.

but don’t take it personally either. You said what you said, I asked you to explain, you went on like skip bayless. I asked you to elaborate, now you are getting defensive.

it’s fine. you’ll feel how you feel, but 1. Qb most imp position on field 2. Still overrated.

Don’t take it personally and understand both can be true.
no worries I don't take it personal, just accept your different opinion, its fine
 

JMC00

Pro Bowl Player
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Go look at the year Prescott won ROTY and see what Elliot did, 2k combined yards and 16 TD. Prescott still got it.

Jones also has almost identical passing numbers as Kyler Murray did when he won ROTY


Chase's season is also downplayed by the fact that Justin Jefferson had a similair season last year and lost to Hebert. So while it's the best rookie season it's helped by the 17 games. Jefferson had 88 rec 1400 yards in 16 games. Chase in 16 games is at 79 rec 1429 yards and still has the 17th game to play.


It could go either way. Shouldn't be just based on stats. Chase has Burrow as QB (which they played together in college for 2 years.) and some good players around him. Mac is throwing to Bourne, Meyers and Agholor not exactly the best group of WRs. Lot more on Jones shoulders than Chase's. It probably won't be a factor here though simply because Mac is a Patriot and has them back in the playoffs which the media do not like and the bengals are becoming the darling.
 
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