Anyone got a pic of Seymour being held on the almost Eli sack in 4th?

Ootball said:

"O'Hara had a good grip on Seymour's facemask."

You keep saying this. The photo evidence contradicts your version.

It's very sad.

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GFY troll.

Grogan's neck roll said:

Dude, I'm begging you, you sound like a friggin 5 year old.

The Pats lost. The Giants BEAT them.

On Sunday February 3rd the Giants were the better team.

You really need to let this go, it's unbecoming to continue to whine about missed calls/no whistles/blah blah blah.

Asante could make a pic
Harrison could make a pic
Woods could man up and hold onto a ball in a pile that he had both arms around.
BB could send Gostkowski out for a field goal rather than going for it on 4th and 13.
Are these things Mike Carey's fault?

How about the GREAT call they made on the illegal bat? That's not an easy call to make in the heat of the battle, and that flag was RIGHT OUT. Otherwise the Giants have a first down.

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Puhlezzzzzz. No first down for the Giants as one can not advance the ball. Had they not made the call, the ball would of been moved back to where it was tapped. you can't advance a fumble . . so no first down for the Giants . . .

Regarding bad calls, if they exist they indeed DO change the game whether people want to admit is or not, i dont go for all this fake moncho crap about "be a man" "suck it up dont blame the refs", the refs are part of the game and they are human and can make mistakes, if their mistakes and the same are costly, they are C-O-S-T-L-Y, its not the responsibility of the offended team to have make extra plays to make up for the mistake by the refs . .

And yes mistake by the losing team can be deemed as "costing" the team the game but no more nor no less as damaging. They all count towards the loss . . . Now the teams can make up for bad plays by making good plays and that is part of the game and also goes to you winning on your own ability . . .

However, the one caveat with the refs is that they are neutral and if they make mistak they create an unfair advantage to one side which is not made up for.

The pats made plays to make up for thier mistakes, and if there are calls that tipped the scale to a loss, they ther were burnt as they would have won if the calls had been made . . .

Re: Why will no one say it? Patriots lost the game because

BradyToMoss said:

I'm not saying that at all. Whether it lead to points or not, it's called a change in field position. I think this was something like a 30 yard pass. It caused a major change in field position, which in a game that was this tightly contested, means alot.

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yes this is a big point, and also the woods recovery which was in the Giants end of the field, both calls change FP a great deal . . .

jp03 said:

Gotta blame it on something. There is no legitimate way the Gints could have won this game...It had to be the refs! What else can we pin this to?

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crap ass play by the pats... and the fans cant wrap their heads around it...

not that i blame them.

Years ago when I was in High School, I think I was a freshman, I lost a close match in which I had thrown a guy and thought I had earned a 2 point near fall, I only got points for the take down and lost by 1 point.

After the match at home I was complaining to my Dad about the call. He told me "Son when you go out on the mat to wrestle you have 2 people to beat, your opponent and the Ref, you have to expect there are going to be bad calls that go the other way and you need to beat your opponent net by a wide enough margin that these calls don"t matter".

Point is there are bad calls in every game, you can't be surprised when some go the other way, it's part of the game.

DCSkinsFan said:

crap ass play by the pats... and the fans cant wrap their heads around it...

not that i blame them.

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No idea why some people can't just move on. I accepted it on Sunday, the Pats lost, nothing I can do about it, just wait for the next season to roll around and hope for the best. People need to give the Giants credit for playing an incredible game, and I think to a certain extent there are some fans here who aren't giving the Giants their due. Bottom line to me is that Seymour and Eli both had an opportunity to make a play, and whether or not Seymour was supposedly held or not, Eli made a huge play and Seymour didn't. After the play was completed, the Pats still had a chance to stop the Giants and didn't. The patriots motto for this year was play for 60 minutes and they failed to do that, and there you have it, Giants win the SB.

Gunnails said:

Years ago when I was in High School, I think I was a freshman, I lost a close match in which I had thrown a guy and thought I had earned a 2 point near fall, I only got points for the take down and lost by 1 point.

After the match at home I was complaining to my Dad about the call. He told me "Son when you go out on the mat to wrestle you have 2 people to beat, your opponent and the Ref, you have to expect there are going to be bad calls that go the other way and you need to beat your opponent net by a wide enough margin that these calls don"t matter".

Point is there are bad calls in every game, you can't be surprised when some go the other way, it's part of the game.

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Is there any state where wrestling refs don't suck?

Siddiqi said:

Is there any state where wrestling refs don't suck?

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=================================-

LOL, I ended up becoming a wrestling referee for 6 years after high school.

Gunnails said:

=================================-

LOL, I ended up becoming a wrestling referee for 6 years after high school.

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I'm not saying all of them are bad, but the ones in Eastern NC are just horrible. I remember taking a guy down and I locked up around his waist and his back was facing the mat and all I had to do was just put some pressure on him to pin him. The ref forcibly broke my lock and i couldn't pin the guy. Having a pin taken away from you sucks.

Yehoodi said:

Puhlezzzzzz. No first down for the Giants as one can not advance the ball. Had they not made the call, the ball would of been moved back to where it was tapped. you can't advance a fumble . . so no first down for the Giants . . .
. .

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Have you ever officiated one football game in your life? "one can not advance the ball"? "you can't advance a fumble"? Show me where it says this in ANY football rulebook.

If they had not called it an illegal bat, they would have given the ball to the Giants at the spot of the recovery. The only time they go back to the spot of the fumble is when someone other than the fumbler recovers the ball ON 4TH DOWN.

The rest of your post is gibberish.

Yehoodi said:

The pats made plays to make up for thier mistakes, and if there are calls that tipped the scale to a loss, they ther were burnt as they would have won if the calls had been made . . .

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Just to highlight what I meant about the rest of your post, please tell me what the hell this is supposed to mean.

Ok and I suppose Seymour knocking down Rivers and Merriman being blatantly held on numerous occasions is fair? Sometimes you get the calls sometimes you don't. No need to complain about it its football. See ya in the AFC title game again next year hopefully at our house.

Re: Why will no one say it? Patriots lost the game because

doc21 said:

This is close you came to winning the game

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lol that's just wrong man.:bricks:

pheenix11 said:

O'Hara had him by the facemask. Watch the replay he jerks his head and Manning slips away as Seymour tries not to get his head ripped off. O'Hara had him in a choke hold right before this and right after he pushes Seymour away with his facemask.

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Do yourself a favor, save this pic to your desktop, than blow it up and take a GOOD look at it AFTER taking off the rose colored glasses. You will notice that O'Hara's hand is NOT in his facemask but under it on his shoulder. THis is not a face mask nor is it a hold.
On EVERY play in the NFL they can call holding, it if it is bl;atent than it is called, this did not lose the game for you

Really Pathetic.

In every game in NFL there are many holding calls that go uncalled. Also the picture or any video in that play is inconclusive on the hold at best. Also all that Refree (and others) are watching is how the play is developing or to call "In Grasp". Even by his own admission, the REF was very close to calling that and wanted to see how it develops and then Eli escapes and makes the magical throw.

Really Pathetic that you get hold of one play where it is at best marginal and complain that caused the loss.

The loss was mainly because of your vaunted offense could make only 2 TDs. 14 points and you expect to win???

p.s : I didn't want to post a reply being not a Pats fan, but looking at some of you grasping this play for the loss is pathetic.

COLT FAN said:

Really Pathetic.

In every game in NFL there are many holding calls that go uncalled. Also the picture or any video in that play is inconclusive on the hold at best. Also all that Refree (and others) are watching is how the play is developing or to call "In Grasp". Even by his own admission, the REF was very close to calling that and wanted to see how it develops and then Eli escapes and makes the magical throw.

Really Pathetic that you get hold of one play where it is at best marginal and complain that caused the loss.

The loss was mainly because of your vaunted offense could make only 2 TDs. 14 points and you expect to win???

p.s : I didn't want to post a reply being not a Pats fan, but looking at some of you grasping this play for the loss is pathetic.

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How about those of us who aren't, don't focus on the negative!

NoQuarter said:

Do yourself a favor, save this pic to your desktop, than blow it up and take a GOOD look at it AFTER taking off the rose colored glasses. You will notice that O'Hara's hand is NOT in his facemask but under it on his shoulder. THis is not a face mask nor is it a hold.
On EVERY play in the NFL they can call holding, it if it is bl;atent than it is called, this did not lose the game for you

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This is not the actual hold, this just shows where his hand is and I'll give you the possibility that its under the facemask and we see his white glove by looking through the facemask. The actual holding occurred before this point.

Right before this O'Hara had his arm around Seymour's neck and his hand either underneath his facemask near his mouth or on his collar and was holding him there. He pulled Seymour to his right as he tried to wrap up Manning. This picture is after he has turned Seymour around and Manning slipped out.

I'll give it to you that the facemask not definite, its hard to tell for sure. But it was definitely holding. Unless being behind someone and having them in a choke hold is not holding.

If you have it on DVR, watch it. Watch the replay from field level.

Grogan's neck roll said:

How about those of us who aren't, don't focus on the negative!

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Mine was only addressed to those that did. I hope they are in the minority. Comparatively this one was a well officiated game. That doesn't mean they didn't miss calls. But for SOME fans to point this play (which at best is a marginal hold ; I personallly don't see any) for the loss is really pathetic.

It is tough to take that loss after being 18-0. I understand that. but not this

Re: Why will no one say it? Patriots lost the game because

jp03 said:

Oh COME on...are you seriously going to whine about this? The Giant defensive line was being held ALL NIGHT by the would be offensive line of the Pats. It was comical. Oh but those calls don't matter. Pure sour grapes

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No, they weren't. But HOLDING isn't the real issue. The intentional FACEMASKS are the real issue. And 2 occurred on that play. It should have been blown dead and the Giants penalized 15 yards.

DCSkinsFan said:

exactly.. these people are drunk... he has his hand on the collar. perfectly legal.

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Look at that other site. It clearly shows Giant players committing a face mask penalty on two separate occasions on that play.