New media buzz word for BB: "Arrogant"

Maybe Tune has a point

Bill's Girl et al.

If your long term marriage broke up, wouldn't you be depressed? I know I would.

Tunescribe said:

Here is my theory on BB: I think the man struggles with moderate to low-grade depression. Depressed people are not naturally gregarious, often are socially withdrawn, and exhibit behavior that may be construed as "arrogant" but is actually just the opposite. A lot of what I've seen in BB's public behavior -- press conferences, TV appearances, etc. -- suggest a man who must put extra effort into personal interaction that does not come to him naturally. BB is just not that good with "people" in general, but it's probably not his fault. He seems to have become more aware of this and made strides with it since his Cleveland days, but my sense is that he still struggles with it. He's also going through a divorce, by the way.

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Actually, I think this opin is about right.

I can certainly understand the way that he comes off in the public. As I'm about the same way. I would say that he is a semi-introverted. I am also.

Introverts tend to be a lot better at communicating 1 on 1. When the media hounds plaster you with questions...this to me would suck. Mentally draining.

Not everyone likes to be in the limelight.

Some people are not cut out to do this.

It doesn't mean anything else.

Aloof? ...possibly. Who cares though?

He gets the job done very well if you ask me.

patpatriot said:

Bill's Girl et al.

If your long term marriage broke up, wouldn't you be depressed? I know I would.

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Of course, that goes without saying. But Tunescribe's point is that BB has been like this since his time in Cleveland.

MY point is that this is no one's business but BB's and it is bordering on libel, not to mention in bad taste, to suggest such a thing!

Bill's Girl said:

Of course, that goes without saying. But Tunescribe's point is that BB has been like this since his time in Cleveland.

MY point is that this is no one's business but BB's and it is bordering on libel, not to mention in bad taste, to suggest such a thing!

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In my non-expert opinion BB is not clinically depressed. He is a very sef-confident and unassuming person. That is neither arrogant or a sign of depression.

Generally, people who are depressed have trouble making tough decissions and have self doubt. BB has neither of these traits. He is not he extravert that, Parcells is, but that does not mean that he his depressed.

That is why I think that Tune's observation is way off the mark. He is entitiled to his opinon. But, once he has given that opinion, others are entitled to hammer him about it if they feel it is baseless and to the point of rumor mongering.

Defending BB

I recall Tom Curran saying that after his press conferences, BB spends quite a bit of time answering football questions for reporters, happily explaining the nuances of the game. He’ll even diagram plays for them – Curran had joked with him that he might put the diagram BB made on e-Bay.

Guys, you can’t judge the man’s mental state by the man we see at press conferences.

There is no doubt in my mind that he can be difficult, demanding and stubborn (I don’t know an executive who isn’t.) But he also seems to earn intense loyalty from his staff as well as his friends (many of whom he seems to have had for more than 30 years.) I think that’s because he listens to others ideas and opinions, gives credit where credit is do and gives the younger members of the staff opportunities they would never get elsewhere. If I worked for him, I’d bet there’d be days when I’d hated him but I also bet I’d work my ass off for him.

The media wants us to believe he’s personality-challenged. All you have to do is read a bit about him to know that isn’t true.

patpatriot said:

Bill's Girl et al.

If your long term marriage broke up, wouldn't you be depressed? I know I would.

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I would actually celebrate, but thats just me.

Oh man.....

PATSNUTme said:

In my non-expert opinion BB is not clinically depressed. He is a very sef-confident and unassuming person. That is neither arrogant or a sign of depression.

Generally, people who are depressed have trouble making tough decissions and have self doubt. BB has neither of these traits. He is not he extravert that, Parcells is, but that does not mean that he his depressed.

That is why I think that Tune's observation is way off the mark. He is entitiled to his opinon. But, once he has given that opinion, others are entitled to hammer him about it if they feel it is baseless and to the point of rumor mongering.

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Nut, please refer back to my response to fgssand. The world is full of brilliant and highly accomplished people who battle clinical depression. It's like having a back problem -- you can function with it but it does pose obstacles that manifest in various ways. Terry Bradshaw is one such example who has gone public on this highly misunderstood malady; there are many more. You and others suggesting my post equates to "rumor mongering," "slander" or "libel" misunderstand its intent in the ORIGINAL CONTEXT of this thread. Beyond that, you're flat-out wrong. It wasn't posed in a vacuum, and certainly is not malicious in any way, shape or form. It strikes me as quite ironic how thousands of other players/coaches/personalities discussed in this forum are considered fair game for some pretty outrageous statements and accusations, and no one complains. But say anything remotely provocative about BB, and it's Katie-bar-the-door. Certainly, he's the most accomplished coach in the game and the architect behind three Super Bowl titles, but he's also human, which makes things all the more interesting. So, hammer away if you want. An exchange of ideas is what this place is all about.

Pats67 said:

Its simple - he doesn't kiss the media's *ss. Period. And most of those pricks, who are among the most arrogant people on the planet, hate him for it. They don't get stuff spoonfed to them. Nick and Ron don't get favored nation status. They believe above everything that they, and what they think, is what's important in this city. And if somebody doesn't agree with that, they club them to death. Believe you me, if those jackoffs saw Tunescribe's post from earlier, they would be high fiving each other. Because that's exactly what they want. He doesn't make our jobs easy, so sic 'em. Blast him every chance we get. If you haven't seen countless examples of this occurring in Boston over your lifetime, then I don't know what the hell you've been watching.

Knowing what we know about the media (people like Mike, TE, and Chris excepted), don't you think being arrogant to them is a GREAT quality? Its one of the things I love the best about the guy.

As far as 'telling the fans what's going on', a friend said to me earlier today, you buy that season ticket, there's no guarantee of anything but a seat on Sunday. Hand holding and warm and fuzzies aren't part of the deal. You don't get to be part of a Fan Advisory Group or any other mastabatory horseh** that designed to make you 'feel' better. If you want that, then give up your tickets. Those seats won't be vacant for long. Because they win. Just in case you'd forgotten that.

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VERY good...I agree!! He cares about winning..bottom line..

Maybe it is as simple as Belichick 'doesn't suffer fools'. Wonder what he would think of Tune ?

arrellbee said:

Maybe it is as simple as Belichick 'doesn't suffer fools'. Wonder what he would think of Tune ?

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Well, I'd hope he would thank me for helping pay his salary.

Noticed this recent article:

http://www.PatriotsScoop.com/News/belichicksalary.htm

"There are reports that Bill Belichick has recently negotiated a very small decrease in his salary for 2006. No details are known at this time. When asked, Belichick said that he was not in the mood to comment."

Belichick doesnt like dealing with the stupid trivial BS and I dont blame him. Whats the point of speaking to the media at halftime during a game and answering those stupid questions?

Time is very valuable (we are only given so much on this earth) and he has a SB to win this season. His job depends on it and he takes that very seriously. If he doesnt get the job done the media will be all over him like Vultures.

arrellbee said:

Noticed this recent article:

http://www.PatriotsScoop.com/News/belichicksalary.htm

"There are reports that Bill Belichick has recently negotiated a very small decrease in his salary for 2006. No details are known at this time. When asked, Belichick said that he was not in the mood to comment."

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Link is broken

T-ShirtDynasty said:

Link is broken

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It was his idea of a joke -- a fake link.

As an attempt to clarify the matter once and for all

It's time to get technical. American Psychiatrists use a system called DSM-IV for diagnosing a range of mental health issues. The rest of the world uses ICD-IV. They are actually very similar, at least to my experienced but medically unqualified eye (eleven years working in the social care field, of which 8 have involved working directly with people using mental health services).To cut a long story short, you have to score, say, 3 out of 5 for a diagnosis to be correct.

http://www.allaboutdepression.com/dia_03.html

http://www.allaboutdepression.com/dia_12.html#1

Now, none of us is a Psychiatrist, to the best of my knowledge, but look at those criteria (which are accurate, IMHO, have been tested to death and fit hundreds of people with whom I have worked). Now tell me that BB is depressed.

Tunescribe, the one thing that you have not been able to answer is how he remains so motivated and able to engage with people when he is depressed. He doesn't need the money. He could retire tomorrow if he wanted. In fact, I would submit that a depressed person would do exactly that.

I also take issue with the description that he is introverted. He manages however many strong, opinionated characters, has regular face to face meetings with them and tells them EXACTLY how it is. He mixes with people every day, out of choice. He has friends like Jon Bon Jovi (no one's perfect ) and puts himself in the public eye. Private and introverted are not the same thing, IMHO. I also take issue with the "arrogant" label. He is confident and a perfectionist, but he is the first person to blame himself when things go wrong.

gomezcat said:

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I also take issue with the description that he is introverted. He manages however many strong, opinionated characters, has regular face to face meetings with them and tells them EXACTLY how it is. He mixes with people every day, out of choice. He has friends like Jon Bon Jovi (no one's perfect ) and puts himself in the public eye. Private and introverted are not the same thing, IMHO. I also take issue with the "arrogant" label. He is confident and a perfectionist, but he is the first person to blame himself when things go wrong.

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To clarify the Myers Briggs definition of "introverted." It does not mean someone is shy or can't mix with people or have friends. It's not labeling a person with a Ricky Williams-type social anxiety.

In the context of Myers Briggs, the terms introverted and extroverted refers to whether a person gets his energy from external or internal sources. I'd argue that BB's energy comes from analyzing and problem solving. Though he clearly enjoys teaching. So maybe he's an I with a high E.

Beating a dead horse

Here's the definition of the Introvert/Extrovert categories from a Phd. Below is a link to his page.

"Where does your ENERGY come from? Introvert or Extrovert This is not about being shy or outgoing. This is a very different definition of the terms Introvert and Extrovert; it's about your energy.

E Extraverts want to take a break by joining the party and interacting socially to get energized. E's can do solitary activity, but find it draining. They are drained by solitary situations (being at computer, hiking). E's energy is directed primarily outward, towards people and things outside of themselves. E's keep up many friendships. According to Jung, E's are "more influenced by their surroundings than by their own intentions" (302). They are energized by belonging to some crowd, society, being around people, and their sense perceptions. They will express their views out-loud to hear what they are thinking. Extroverts prefer relationships and the world of other people. Extraverts are the most resistant to burnout, while introverts are the most susceptible (Layman & Guyden, 1997).

I - Introverts take a break and head for the beach, watch TV, or read a book. They are drained by social situations, and keep a few close friends. I's can be life of party but find it draining. They like alone time, and thinking before they speak. I's energy is more directed inward (the world within), towards their own thoughts, ideas, perceptions, and reactions. Yet, according to Jung I's are more into the subjective experience, the world within (rather than the external world), and see the external world as somewhat threatening. Crowds to not energize them. They trust their own judgments and perceptions more than those of others, and will think an idea before expressing it. Isabel Briggs Myers (1995: 56) says Introverts are "more at home in the world of ideas than in the world of people and things." Introverts live in the inner world of thoughts and ideas. "


http://cbae.nmsu.edu/~dboje/teaching/490_psl/step_2.htm

gomezcat said:

Tunescribe, the one thing that you have not been able to answer is how he remains so motivated and able to engage with people when he is depressed. He doesn't need the money. He could retire tomorrow if he wanted. In fact, I would submit that a depressed person would do exactly that.

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As a worker in the field you should know that there are varying degrees of clinical depression that can be mitigated by behavioral changes, lifestyle changes, and/or drug therapy. It's not a "blanket" condition that's a matter of black or white, but varying shades of gray. As I noted earlier, it's a manageable problem that can manifest from one end of the spectrum to the other, and does not necessarily preclude motivation or success in one's chosen field. Terry Bradshaw has been clinically depressed his whole adult life, and look at what he has accomplished. Yet, by his own admission, the condition affected his relationships with fans, coaches and fellow players, and, he's on his third marriage. But at this point in the discussion I fear this whole issue has been blown way out of proportion and skewed in some unnecessary directions specifically in regard to the subject at hand (BB). Anything we say has beeen and will be speculative, and should be regarded as such in addressing this thread's original premise.

Tune, I cannot for the life of me imagine why your thoughts even turned to this in the first place or why you felt a compulsion to tell other people this notion of yours.

However, I can express my own judgment - what you are saying is idiotic to an extent that is almost unbelievable.

There are a couple symptom lists that are prevalent in doing an assessment of clinical depression. One is 9 items and there is a longer one of 18 items. For purposes of brevity, we'll list the 9 item one:

- Exhaustion on waking
- Disrupted sleep, sometimes through upsetting dreams
- Early morning waking and difficulty getting back to sleep
- Doing less of what they used to enjoy
- Difficulty concentrating during the day
- Improved energy as the day goes on
- Anxious worrying and intrusive upsetting thoughts
- Becoming emotional or upset for no particular reason
- Shortness of temper, or irritability

I really doubt that you have inside information on the first 3 items.
There isn't a person on this board, except I guess you, who can't see that there is NOTHING that has ever been observed or reported about Belichick on any of the last 6 items - in fact, a supposition on my part would be that, almost unanimously, folks would observe that Belichick shows up about as diametrically opposite to these items as a person can.

You are an unmitigated idiot.

p.s. The 18 item list can be found at:
http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?id=973&type=doc&cn=Depression%20(Unipolar)