Charlie Weis beating the "Patriots should draft Mac Jones" drum

KontradictioN said:

Why not? It’s unhealthy. If he wants to live longer and not succumb to congestive heart failure, he needs to lose weight. The man ate his way through Gastic Bypass FFS.

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Very judgmental. You don't have any idea what drives his weight problems. Could be any number of things. Physical, Stress whatever. You have no idea what he may or may not be doing about it.

d312 said:

Very judgmental. You don't have any idea what drives his weight problems. Could be any number of things. Physical, Stress whatever. You have no idea what he may or may not be doing about it.

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You are right, but people see weight as totally a choice, and the answer is not to eat. And there is real prejudice. I have never not hired someone due to sex or race, but I truly did not hire a nurse practitioner because he was significantly overweight.

We just watched 20 years of a supposedly athletically-challenged QB dominate the league like never before and we are worried about this canard?

If Jones is a poor athlete, so is Brady.









Mac Jones & Tom Brady are brought way too often. Its silly season it happens every year. There's no debate about it though.

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The thing about Tom Brady was that he had/has a RELENTLESS work ethic and drive to keep playing and winning. And that's something that's impossible to judge effectively from college tape. Maybe Mac Jones has it (I doubt it), but the physical similarities/limitations don't mean anything because those were never what made Brady who he is.

long distance said:

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Word

long distance said:

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This guy isn't doing himself any favors imo.

The whole "the game isn't or hasn't changed" has ended. Guys like him are fighting a losing battle pinning their argument on a 43 yo cyborg Brady winning the SB. The idea that you can watch a game. Look at the athletes, play calling/design, score ... The how/why of how things are getting done.

And think about it from this way. Nothing has changed in football but every other sport there's absolutely no debate. Basketball, hockey and baseball have all look a lot different. From the player you're looking for to the style.

I mean ...





And then he said this

BaconGrundleCandy said:

We just watched 20 years of a supposedly athletically-challenged QB dominate the league like never before and we are worried about this canard?

If Jones is a poor athlete, so is Brady.









Mac Jones & Tom Brady are brought way too often. Its silly season it happens every year. There's no debate about it though.

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This is a big insult to Brady.

BaconGrundleCandy said:

This guy isn't doing himself any favors imo.

The whole "the game isn't or hasn't changed" has ended. Guys like him are fighting a losing battle pinning their argument on a 43 yo cyborg Brady winning the SB. The idea that you can watch a game. Look at the athletes, play calling/design, score ... The how/why of how things are getting done.

And think about it from this way. Nothing has changed in football but every other sport there's absolutely no debate. Basketball, hockey and baseball have all look a lot different. From the player you're looking for to the style.

I mean ...
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And then he said this

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I posted for the whole thread sake not just the first part. He argues that mental aspect and processing is still ultimate. Nothing ive seen in the game changed that. The other argument was sustainability.

Mind is biggest asset of QB (others being important as well but not decisive if “good enough“). Film can lead you to only a part of mind. A lot is unknown, esp. long term. So outsiders debate on QB can mean only so much. Cam was saying similar: he was too far behind to be processing comfortably. I wouldn't mind an “upgrade“ but would be interested seeing him fully prepared from learning perspective (on my part).

Im at ease re potential Jones pick bc BB will have the best info re. mind. Will not hold my breath on Draft day - like i did not for Lamar
Jones is nobody's saviour, nor Lawrence, nor Brady coming out. These are kids with hope they will be put in a situation to succeed.

btw - never thought of Brady watching Jones play and even less so talk.

Sicilian said:

The thing about Tom Brady was that he had/has a RELENTLESS work ethic and drive to keep playing and winning. And that's something that's impossible to judge effectively from college tape. Maybe Mac Jones has it (I doubt it), but the physical similarities/limitations don't mean anything because those were never what made Brady who he is.

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long distance said:

I posted for the whole thread sake not just the first part. He argues that mental aspect and processing is still ultimate. Nothing ive seen in the game changed that. The other argument was sustainability.

Mind is biggest asset of QB (others being important as well but not decisive if “good enough“). Film can lead you to only a part of mind. A lot is unknown, esp. long term. So outsiders debate on QB can mean only so much. Cam was saying similar: he was too far behind to be processing comfortably. I wouldn't mind an “upgrade“ but would be interested seeing him fully prepared from learning perspective (on my part).

Im at ease re potential Jones pick bc BB will have the best info re. mind. Will not hold my breath on Draft day - like i did not for Lamar
Jones is nobody's saviour, nor Lawrence, nor Brady coming out. These are kids with the hope they will be put in a situation to succeed.

btw - never thought of Brady watching Jones play and even less so talk.

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No one is arguing a QB needs smarts, a strong work ethic and so on. That's a silly hill to stand on. I don't see anyone denying that LD. That said would anyone confuse Eli, Favre, Flacco or Big Ben as geniuses?

This guys is embarrassing himself though by saying "the guy isn't changing". I really don't understand the point of pretending it hasn't changed. Again every sport it's commonplace and accepted.

upstater1 said:

This is a big insult to Brady.

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You wouldn't think so reading this board. A lot of people had np with Brady leaving bc of the lack of talent on offense and now we have more than a few bringing up the GOAT when talking about Mac Jones.

The disrespect is exile worthy.

sb1 said:

We're already comparing Mac Jones to the GOAT? Yikes.

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You are a fool. Go ahead and schedule a workout with Mac and let's see how you compare to his poor athleticism. Go get your twinkie.

BaconGrundleCandy said:

You wouldn't think so reading this board. A lot of people had np with Brady leaving bc of the lack of talent on offense and now we have more than a few bringing up the GOAT when talking about Mac Jones.

The disrespect is exile worthy.

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I am lost. Saying Mac Jones last year at Alabama reminds someone on Brady's last year at Michigan is "exile worthy"?

Sicilian said:

The thing about Tom Brady was that he had/has a RELENTLESS work ethic and drive to keep playing and winning. And that's something that's impossible to judge effectively from college tape. Maybe Mac Jones has it (I doubt it), but the physical similarities/limitations don't mean anything because those were never what made Brady who he is.

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You can doubt it all you want, but his coaches and teammates don't.

One-If-By-Sea said:

I am lost. Saying Mac Jones last year at Alabama reminds someone on Brady's last year at Michigan is "exile worthy"?

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I haven't heard one person frame it like that though, let's be honest. It's all about how similar they are in terms of accuracy, being a cerebral QB, not the greatest athlete etc... I mean you don't have to look hard to see them mentioned and again I've yet to hear anyone frame like that.

Yea I think it's crazy. Mac Jones is Kirk Cousins. Would anyone, ever, in the history of the sport confuse Brady & Cousins? Cousins is accurate, cerebral & not doing any damage on the move.

To each their own but I think the comps are crazy.

BaconGrundleCandy said:

I haven't heard one person frame it like that though, let's be honest. It's all about how similar they are in terms of accuracy, being a cerebral QB, not the greatest athlete etc... I mean you don't have to look hard to see them mentioned and again I've yet to hear anyone frame like that.

Yea I think it's crazy. Mac Jones is Kirk Cousins. Would anyone, ever, in the history of the sport confuse Brady & Cousins? Cousins is accurate, cerebral & not doing any damage on the move.

To each their own but I think the comps are crazy.

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BGC loves him some fast athletic qb's that run all around, get hurt and have a difficult time throwing. I have been listening to the same line from talking heads for 25 years. Revolutionize the game, Brady and Breeze and Manning are dinosaurs, the next great thing. For some reason Brady and Mahomes are the one in the super bowl and your favorite Lamar has 1 playoff win, with a team completely structured around him.

In a perfect world, where qb's didn't get hurt, having Mac Jones be able to run like Jackson would be awesome. However, it never seems to work that way. It is almost like to be a great nfl qb you have to be able to pass, and if you are an amazing runner, you have been trained since you were young to run as soon as things start to fall apart. So you get to the NFL, have some success early, then either realize you have to stay in the pocket to pass, or you get crunched 1 to many times and you lose a step or two and still can't pass in the pocket as well as a qb that has been doing it his entire life.

That of course doesn't mean that Jones is the next Brady, that the Patriots should draft him, or that he will be any good at all. What it does mean is discounting a qb because he can't run is as foolish as saying all qb's that come from Alabama suck.

moosekill said:

BGC loves him some fast athletic qb's that run all around, get hurt and have a difficult time throwing.

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Not really but please go show me who's better at evaluating QB's. Plenty of resources and guys to look at. Kiper, Brugler, Miller. Go back to 2011 and show me who's better.

moosekill said:

I have been listening to the same line from talking heads for 25 years. Revolutionize the game, Brady and Breeze and Manning are dinosaurs, the next great thing. For some reason Brady and Mahomes are the one in the super bowl and your favorite Lamar has 1 playoff win, with a team completely structured around him.

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moosekill said:

In a perfect world, where qb's didn't get hurt, having Mac Jones be able to run like Jackson would be awesome. However, it never seems to work that way. It is almost like to be a great nfl qb you have to be able to pass, and if you are an amazing runner, you have been trained since you were young to run as soon as things start to fall apart. So you get to the NFL, have some success early, then either realize you have to stay in the pocket to pass, or you get crunched 1 to many times and you lose a step or two and still can't pass in the pocket as well as a qb that has been doing it his entire life.

That of course doesn't mean that Jones is the next Brady, that the Patriots should draft him, or that he will be any good at all. What it does mean is discounting a qb because he can't run is as foolish as saying all qb's that come from Alabama suck.

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I'm not reading any of this lol ^^^^
I hope you're ok, it'll get better. Or congrats. W/e is best suited.

Sliplady said:

You can doubt it all you want, but his coaches and teammates don't.

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I don't think it's controversial to not assume a player is going to be the next Tom Brady. And coaches and teammates ALWAYS talk up their own guys. Belichick and everyone you ask on the 2020 Patriots all loved Cam Newton too. Look, if the Pats believe in Jones and take him at 15, I'll be excited, because we haven't had a QB drafted as the definitive prospect since Drew Bledsoe, but I prefer to let his merits speak for themselves when they happen. It does the kid no favors to enter the league with half his Canton bust carved already.

Sliplady said:

You are a fool. Go ahead and schedule a workout with Mac and let's see how you compare to his poor athleticism. Go get your twinkie.

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I wasn’t the one that put Jones and the GOAT in the same sentence. Jones doesn’t belong there and almost certainly never will.

Love how fans think it will be so easy to find another Brady.

bormio said:

You are right, but people see weight as totally a choice, and the answer is not to eat. And there is real prejudice. I have never not hired someone due to sex or race, but I truly did not hire a nurse practitioner because he was significantly overweight.

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This is a discussion that there are no winners. There are various opinions. I'm no longer going to comment on it. I also want to apologize to the Board for getting off the true purpose of the Board; PATRIOTS FOOTBALL. Let's get back to it.