Belichick criticism mega-thread

Ring 6 said:

I know the fact is that Kraft asked him what it would take to keep him here. He said nothing, he’s gone.

You act as if the guy relying on fact and doubting rumors is on the shaky side of the discussion.

Curran has an agenda and Curran implies a bunch of things. That is rumor. But all of those rumors are meaningless to me when I know with certainty that before he was left Brady was asked to request whatever he wanted and he said nothing, I’m gone. If the rumors were true, he never would have said that.

By the way when did I ever say I know the inside scoop. I am literally saying you can’t argue from an “inside scoop” because it’s just rumor.
Dismissing rumor is not replacing it with your own belief, it’s dismissing rumor and looking at facts.
The facts make the rumor wrong.

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Where is your FACT?

upstater1 said:

Where is your FACT?

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Don't you know? Andy knows everything.

Boomer B said:

Instead of continuously acting obtuse just listen to people in the know who have connections to Tom. In both these interviews Curran says Tom wanted the 2 yr Brees deal. If you think Curran is lying then so be it, but I’ll believe someone connected like Curran before I’ll believe someone who’s not even remotely close to the situation like you.

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The bizarre thing about this is that Brady was clearly on the outs the prior year when he was offered only a 1 year contract. Anyone who acts like this all went down in March of 2020 is not taking into account the rupture of the prior year. Coming off a Super Bowl victory, there is no way that Brady was looking to move on to a team like Tampa. He clearly wanted a commitment from the Patriots that he didn't get, and when that happened, he put his home on the market. When they didn't commit to him again in March of 2020, it was time for him to move on. Clearly.

I don't know why it is so hard for some people to admit that Bill screwed up. He should have signed him to an extension as soon as he traded Jimmy. Bill bungled the end of Brady's Patriot career. Plain and simple.

Ring 6 said:

Curran has been telling his story. His bias in the matter is clear.
If all Brady wanted was 2 years and 50 mill who didn’t he say that when Kraft asked him what it would take for him to stay? Before he had any offer? Why didn’t he give any contract demand? Why did he say No there is nothing you can do I am leaving?

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Probably because having been there 19 years he already knew:
1. Bill was the GM and made those decisions;
2. If he already spoke with Bill, then Kraft already knew and supported what Bill offered, 1-yr @ $22M;
3. He had just finished going thru this the previous summer when they only offered 1-yr with incentives and he knew they wouldn't guarantee any money to a 43 yo which was confirmed by the phone call (business as usual).

Most people on this forum agreed with Bill and the Pats that offering a multi-year contract to a 43 yo wasn't smart or to guarantee money. Most people were all in on Bill's "rather year early than year late" motto, in Bill we trust. Except for the few of us that thought that shouldn't apply to the GOAT, that he wasn't done.

Separation or divorce was inevitable given the way Bill operates. It's telling though that Bill was supposedly surprised that Brady walked.

Brady found a team that wanted him, offered him a multi-year guaranteed contract and as we witnessed it worked out for them.

Bill got what he wanted, the freedom to move on w/o Brady. Now let's see what he can do with that. Time will tell.

Ring 6 said:

Brady came to krafts house before free agency began and told Kraft he was leaving. Kraft asked if they could do anything to keep him and he said no.
It’s not a narrative, it’s the fact of what happened.

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I think the important thing is Tom is happy now. At this point in his career (and life), he is only interested in winning Super Bowls, as he has said repeatedly over the last year. Losing AB, despite Antonio's whacked behavior, if it was Kraft's decision or whatever, sealed the deal. Tom was already motivated here for twenty years; being dragged into court and suspended for four games only made that determination greater. Brady has always responded to adversity and setbacks with renewed commitment and drive. He was very unhappy in 2019. Belichick never has nor ever will change who he is or how he operates. I know it's a different atmosphere and environment in Foxborough, but I want the players on the Patriots to be happy too. They're driven, focused, appreciative of all the positive things about this team and I consider their focus and mental toughness to be the best in football and that's a huge advantage. If we succeed in winning another title soon, whatever backhanded, backtracking grudging compliments head Belichick's way will as always fall way short of making up for the criticism just as nothing will make up for the fake scandals, and won't matter to him or me anyway.

Nikolai said:

From the same people who brought you Defamegate...it's the "**** on BB" hour.

I've had a fairly balanced view and it's still the same; BB was in cap hell, and couldn't keep Brady, win, and start the process of rebuilding from a combo of going all in on the SB years and poor drafting. Keeping Brady in 2020 still might not have made the Pats a playoff team, and if it did, it would have been a first round exit and draft purgatory.

Never mind...wasted on most of you anyway...I mean, if you're siding with Max Kellerman, you're pretty lost...

EDIT - And of course Brady is more important. He's a PLAYER. And a QB at that. BB is still the GOAT coach and mouth breathers want to run him out of town and replace him with.....who? Bill O'Brien? Jeff Fisher? Who?

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Every criticism of BB doesn't mean he should be fired. He could learn something from this mistake though, and letting Brady walk was a huge mistake.

The blame for Brady leaving isn't just his mistake either. Kraft is as much at fault as Bill, maybe more. He's the freaking owner. But he's letting Bill take the fall now, just as he did with crygate, and he let Tom take the heat for defamegate. He fought tooth and nail for himself though.

robertweathers said:

You are the sports fanboy version of Maxine Waters

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Since you want to infect this board with your politics there's a more accurate description.

Tottie said:

AND YOU ACT AS THOUGH NOTHING THAT HAPPENED BEFORE THAT MATTERS! If I take you out back take a **** on you and then ask you what I need to do to make you happy you will go elsewhere if possible. STFU.

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No need to be so emotional and triggered.
I can see that you like making assumptions and everything is about feelings.
If you are saying Tom Brady’s feelings were hurt and he pouted his way out of town then maybe the facts line up, but they do not line up with him wanting to stay and the team didn’t want him.

upstater1 said:

Where is your FACT?

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Brady went to krafts house before free agency started and told him he was leaving. Kraft asked him if they could do anything to get him to stay and he says no.

SVN said:

Thats seals it. I always thought it was BB until Emmanuel Acho flipped. Bow down to Emmanuel Acho . He was the last straw for me.

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That guy is so annoying, although that appears to be the business model for these shows now

Just put some guys on that love to hear themselves talk, and scream their opinions loudly so that you know they're right (/sarcasm)

Its exhausting, and saddens me that this is the culture our society eats up

1960Pats said:

Since you want to infect this board with your politics there's a more accurate description.

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Maxine Waters....LMAO. Epic.

Deus Irae said:

BTW, I just want to point out that I still consider BB to be one of the greatest coaches of all time. Sure he had Brady, but it was BB who was able to take advantage of that gift for 20 years. It's much the same way as I think people should look at Walsh in SF. Walsh was an offensive genius who was able to take advantage of the current rules and the Elitest of elite QBs to put together a (basically) 15 year run of brilliance. BB is a defensive genius, who was able to take advantage of the current rules and the Elitest of elite QBs to put together a (basically) 20 year run of brilliance.

Neither coach would have accomplished anything near that without those QBs, but both coaches were able to take good advantage, and that's a greatness in itself.

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I'm pretty sure that's how a vast majority of Pats fans feel, but for some reason a few are too defensive about any criticism of Bill. He's not perfect.

Meanwhile Kraft, the person who calls the shots, is letting Bill take the heat instead of speaking up in his defense.

venecol said:

Probably because having been there 19 years he already knew:
1. Bill was the GM and made those decisions;
2. If he already spoke with Bill, then Kraft already knew and supported what Bill offered, 1-yr @ $22M;
3. He had just finished going thru this the previous summer when they only offered 1-yr with incentives and he knew they wouldn't guarantee any money to a 43 yo which was confirmed by the phone call (business as usual).

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Those are all rumors and if they were true and Brady wanted to stay he would have said ok Bob give me 2 years 50 mill and I stay.
You are throwing a whole lot of guess work into argue Brady was incapable of answering the question. If all those things were true Kraft wouldn’t have asked. Kraft owns the team.

venecol said:

Most people on this forum agreed with Bill and the Pats that offering a multi-year contract to a 43 yo wasn't smart or to guarantee money. Most people were all in on Bill's "rather year early than year late" motto, in Bill we trust. Except for the few of us that thought that shouldn't apply to the GOAT, that he wasn't done.

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I couldn’t give 2 turds what “people around the forum” said. I understand not reaching far for a 43 year old who just completed a truly terrible 2nd half of the season with an injury. The team was going into a season where it had no resources to really improve, and in fact was sure to have more subtraction than addition.
I could support both arguments of
1) it’s Brady so you always have a shot, keep him until he falls apart, although that is more emotional than logical or
2) the end come soon, bending over backward for a 43 year old going into a season that will be a struggle and having him at 44 when we can upgrade half the team means we upgrade and wait for him
to fall apart around that team whenever that day comes and with a 43 yo it could be tomorrow but it certainly isn’t far away

venecol said:

Separation or divorce was inevitable given the way Bill operates. It's telling though that Bill was supposedly surprised that Brady walked.

Brady found a team that wanted him, offered him a multi-year guaranteed contract and as we witnessed it worked out for them.

Bill got what he wanted, the freedom to move on w/o Brady. Now let's see what he can do with that. Time will tell.

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I largely agree with this.

Ring 6 said:

No need to be so emotional and triggered.
I can see that you like making assumptions and everything is about feelings.
If you are saying Tom Brady’s feelings were hurt and he pouted his way out of town then maybe the facts line up, but they do not line up with him wanting to stay and the team didn’t want him.

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Nothing to do with emotions, or how Tom feels or your feelings on the matter. 100% has to do with people who are absolutely ruining threads with complete garbage takes. I don't care if you like he's gone, if you don't, or if you agree with Bill that an old QB is not worth the risk... ANY of that. Those at least are reasonable opinions. What you are doing is not that. You are talking out of your ass and ruining threads. It is KNOWN that the Brady contract has been an issue for YEARS. YEARS. You go around and ignore what we actually know and write post after post after post after post after post of GARBAGE based off things that are completely out of context. You use the word 'fact' when you wouldn't know what one looked like if I swung it at your face.

Joker said:

Nick "Wrong" Wright is a sub-mongoloid in a meat suit...and I don't give a **** if you don't like my language or not. I'm not here to bow down to any social justice morons

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If not for the posters bringing his crap here I wouldn't know him if I was looking at him. And I certainly don't listen to him, here or anywhere else. If I want sports opinions and analysis I can get better ones right here with our own posters.

Ring 6 said:

Those are all rumors and if they were true and Brady wanted to stay he would have said ok Bob give me 2 years 50 mill and I stay.
You are throwing a whole lot of guess work into argue Brady was incapable of answering the question. If all those things were true Kraft wouldn’t have asked. Kraft owns the team.

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No guesswork. We had just finished witnessing this same thing the previous summer. Brady wanted a multi-year contract, the year after winning a 6th SB. Bill and Kraft only offered a 1-yr incentive laden deal.

We know this because Brady himself talked about it to reporters and he didn't look happy: "it is what it is." That was the first of many shocking and uncharacteristic things Brady said that season.

If Bill & Kraft offered that "after just winning a SB," you think they were going to give him a multi-year deal after going 1 and done and being a year older?

You're saying: "if Brady wanted to stay, why didn't he beg." Because he already knew the answer and has pride. It worked out better for him.

1960Pats said:

If not for the posters bringing his crap here I wouldn't know him if I was looking at him. And I certainly don't listen to him, here or anywhere else. If I want sports opinions and analysis I can get better ones right here with our own posters.

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Never ceases to amaze me that Patriots fans pay attention to him, Kellerman and those types. They have made a brand off of pissing off Patriots fans but our fanbase is so dumb as a whole that they keep engaging with the nonsense these clowns spew keeping them relevant (and highly paid).

203Pat said:

Never ceases to amaze me that Patriots fans pay attention to him, Kellerman and those types. They have made a brand off of pissing off Patriots fans but our fanbase is so dumb as a whole that they keep engaging with the nonsense these clowns spew keeping them relevant (and highly paid).

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I think the problem is that in order to get good analysis you have to pay for it. That leaves the free airspace to the clowns. I stopped watching and listening many years ago and I don't miss any of it. Once in a blue moon I'll put on Pardon the Interruption, which used to be my favorite, but I don't last long.

203Pat said:

I don't know why it is so hard for some people to admit that Bill screwed up. He should have signed him to an extension as soon as he traded Jimmy. Bill bungled the end of Brady's Patriot career. Plain and simple.

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I’m not convinced he did screw up, football-wise.
We weren’t winning a SB in 2020. We are overhauling this team in 2021 likely upgrading half of the roster spots (starters and depth).
While “Brady is Brady” is certainly an argument is entering that era with a 44 year old QB the best plan?

If you are talking about the emotional attachment to Brady only playing for one team and a great kumbaya among the herores of the dynasty, sure he botched that but that has no value to me.