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2021 Cap Space


Are you honestly saying that you would have recommended pushing Gilmore money into 2021? Why? How much?

And you are saying belichick CHOOSE TO NOT COMPETE. You are saying he chose to not make the playoffs knowing he could and all it would have taken was trading for a few jags?

Can you provide a list of these players that got traded that we should have outbid for, so that they guaranteed us at least 4 wins?

Did you happen to watch the qb this year?
1) Yes. I believe that the number was about $7M. Pushing money forward has been SOP for decades.

2) Your nitpicking is correct Belichick certainly wanted to win. There were no guarantees that if he improve the team with 3 additional players that we would have been in the playoffs.

He CHOSE to be much less competitive by not spending taking normal opportunities to improve the 2020 team. He chose a much different approach. He chose to accept a poorer team, and push $20M into 2021. I understand that many supported this approach, and in fact would have pushed even more by getting rid of a veteran ort two.

ZERO trades guarantee positive results, never mind four guaranteed wins. Do YOU think that using the cap money wouldn 't have helped the team and make it more competitive and more likely to be in the playoffs?
 
Did you happen to watch the qb this year?
Yes, I watched the QB. What is your point? Is it that if we had not franchised Thuney, we could have signed any number of quarterbacks early, and possibly had a much better season?
 
1) Yes. I believe that the number was about $7M. Pushing money forward has been SOP for decades.
[/QUOTE]
Pushing forward every player, or the same player 3 years in a row is not.
So your plan would be to save 7 mill you put Gilmore into 20 mill of dead money next year. What would you do with 7 mill in 2020 that makes up for ensuring your best player is gone and costs you 20 mill in 2021.
I don’t think you understand “SOP”. It does not mean something you do in certain cases is to be done in all cases.
2) Your nitpicking is correct Belichick certainly wanted to win. There were no guarantees that if he improve the team with 3 additional players that we would have been in the playoffs.
His is quoting your words “nitpicking”. If 3 players for a total of 7 million would decide at least 4 games, despite an albatross qb around the neck, then our 60 mill in cap space should have us undefeated for the next 5 years.
He CHOSE to be much less competitive by not spending taking normal opportunities to improve the 2020 team. He chose a much different approach. He chose to accept a poorer team, and push $20M into 2021. I understand that many supported this approach, and in fact would have pushed even more by getting rid of a veteran ort two.
Which is it. Did he choose to not compete as you said or are we splitting hairs?
He did everything he normally does. Show me a player in Gilmore’s situation that he extended 3 years in a row to make the dead money 3 times the salary in the final year. You can’t because he has never come close to doing that.
Show me all these great players that were traded that he missed out on. Show me more than 1 game changing in season traded every 5-10 years to prove he “normally” does that.
ZERO trades guarantee positive results, never mind four guaranteed wins. Do YOU think that using the cap money wouldn 't have helped the team and make it more competitive and more likely to be in the playoffs?
So show me all these traded players he missed on. Or was he supposed to kidnap them?
No. The position this team was in left it no cap money at the time it was needed. Making stupid moves to say you made moves doesn’t magically put you in the playoffs with 4 additional wins.
Your argument seems to be that the difference between Tom Brady and Cam Newton is a couple if minor signings in addition to losing Hightower, cannon, Chung, van noy, Collins, Harmon, karras et al.
There was not enough cap room or resources to keep the team equal to last year even if Brady was still here. You are in a dream world if you think adding a couple of mid level players to this team after free agency was over would make them better after all those defections with cam Newton than they were with Tom Brady, not to mention the tougher schedule.
 
Yes, I watched the QB. What is your point? Is it that if we had not franchised Thuney, we could have signed any number of quarterbacks early, and possibly had a much better season?
What QB? Please tell me who was there to sign, and how losing out best offensive lineman to do it and then have no room to add players would have helped.

And my point was no team in nfl history was going to the playoffs with that level of QB play in today’s NFL.
 
Could someone just clarify something for me please. I believe that we are carrying over $20 million in money from 2020 into 2021 does this get added to the $60 million in cap space or is it something entirely different .....thanks
 
Could someone just clarify something for me please. I believe that we are carrying over $20 million in money from 2020 into 2021 does this get added to the $60 million in cap space or is it something entirely different .....thanks

That is already included in the estimated number of 60M.
 
The Pats should use the post June 1 label and cut both McCourty and Chung, that saves 10 million in cap space.
 
Gonna be a wild off-season unlike any another we have had the last 2 decades.

We could create even more cap space if we cut and release some players.

I am happy that we now have free agency before the draft...makes perfect sense...sign key guys...then draft...then sign low priced veterans to fill spots after the draft.

I believe we will see about 10-15 free agents to go along with 10 draft picks. I think the roster will have a 40% turnover at minimum (20+ different players)....and possibly a turnover of as many as 10-11 starters. (1 QB, 2 OL-men, 2 WR's, 1 TE, 2 DL-men, 1 LB, 1 CB, 1 K, and a ST Ace or two...)
 
Gonna be a wild off-season unlike any another we have had the last 2 decades.

We could create even more cap space if we cut and release some players.

I am happy that we now have free agency before the draft...makes perfect sense...sign key guys...then draft...then sign low priced veterans to fill spots after the draft.

I believe we will see about 10-15 free agents to go along with 10 draft picks. I think the roster will have a 40% turnover at minimum (20+ different players)....and possibly a turnover of as many as 10-11 starters. (1 QB, 2 OL-men, 2 WR's, 1 TE, 2 DL-men, 1 LB, 1 CB, 1 K, and a ST Ace or two...)
First, we will see how many of our own free agents are signed before the free agency starts.

At first, there will be no need to cut players un der contract to create cap room; that can wait.
 
Gonna be a wild off-season unlike any another we have had the last 2 decades.

We could create even more cap space if we cut and release some players.

I am happy that we now have free agency before the draft...makes perfect sense...sign key guys...then draft...then sign low priced veterans to fill spots after the draft.

I believe we will see about 10-15 free agents to go along with 10 draft picks. I think the roster will have a 40% turnover at minimum (20+ different players)....and possibly a turnover of as many as 10-11 starters. (1 QB, 2 OL-men, 2 WR's, 1 TE, 2 DL-men, 1 LB, 1 CB, 1 K, and a ST Ace or two...)
with regard to the DL, I suspect that Belichick has a higher opinion of them than do many posters. We do need a backup NT to compete with Allen.

Simon, Wise, Guy, Butler, Allen, Winovich, Cowart, Spence
===========
We will likely add a LB, but again Belichick may be more satisfied with them than posters.

Hightower, Uche, Jennings, Bentley, Calhoun, Hall
===========
So, sure, we should will have and should have upgrades, and camp insurance in case of injury, but the front seven is NOT a huge weakness.
 
with regard to the DL, I suspect that Belichick has a higher opinion of them than do many posters. We do need a backup NT to compete with Allen.

Simon, Wise, Guy, Butler, Allen, Winovich, Cowart, Spence
===========
We will likely add a LB, but again Belichick may be more satisfied with them than posters.

Hightower, Uche, Jennings, Bentley, Calhoun, Hall
===========
So, sure, we should will have and should have upgrades, and camp insurance in case of injury, but the front seven is NOT a huge weakness.
first and foremost BB has to cut Allen, what a waste of money he is, get a real NT/DT, extend Guy and draft one early and you are set up
 
The Pats should use the post June 1 label and cut both McCourty and Chung, that saves 10 million in cap space.
Whichever way of ridding ourselves of Chung's contract saves us the most money, then so be it...

I would be more - much more - reluctant to rid ourselves of McCourty's, however...He's still playing a a high level, and besides we don't have anybody in the building worthy of replacing him.


p.s.: I ass-ume you mean Devin.
 
with regard to the DL, I suspect that Belichick has a higher opinion of them than do many posters. We do need a backup NT to compete with Allen.

Simon, Wise, Guy, Butler, Allen, Winovich, Cowart, Spence
===========
We will likely add a LB, but again Belichick may be more satisfied with them than posters.

Hightower, Uche, Jennings, Bentley, Calhoun, Hall
===========
So, sure, we should will have and should have upgrades, and camp insurance in case of injury, but the front seven is NOT a huge weakness.
After typing all of those names, how can you possibly think that our front-7 is NOT a huge weakness?
 
with regard to the DL, I suspect that Belichick has a higher opinion of them than do many posters. We do need a backup NT to compete with Allen.

Simon, Wise, Guy, Butler, Allen, Winovich, Cowart, Spence
===========
We will likely add a LB, but again Belichick may be more satisfied with them than posters.

Hightower, Uche, Jennings, Bentley, Calhoun, Hall
===========
So, sure, we should will have and should have upgrades, and camp insurance in case of injury, but the front seven is NOT a huge weakness.

I disagree....at LB...OK...we might have Hightower back....but Uche is really a pass rusher, IMO...and that leaves us with Jennings and Bentley inside. We used a lot of safety-in-the-box looks last year...and we cannot sustain that in 2021. Up front...we have a lot of free agents...Allen is the only one under contract I think... Wise, Butler, and Guy are all FA's. Our run D won't magically get better when Hightower and Chung come back....and Simon wasn't holding down the edge as good last year.

That coupled with us likely moving on from Gilmore and DMac getting longer in the tooth....we need a better front 7 to win on first down...and to get off the field on 3rd downs.
 
Whichever way of ridding ourselves of Chung's contract saves us the most money, then so be it...

I would be more - much more - reluctant to rid ourselves of McCourty's, however...He's still playing a a high level, and besides we don't have anybody in the building worthy of replacing him.


p.s.: I ass-ume you mean Devin.
Duggers and Phillips need to see 80%+ of the snaps every game.

Love Chung but it's time to move on or make him a reserve.
 
After typing all of those names, how can you possibly think that our front-7 is NOT a huge weakness?
We've never seen Allen play. I have agreed that we need another NT, two if Allen goes.

So, you believe that Belichick doesn't like Butler and Guy? OK. I disagree.

No one is arguing that we don't need to add a couple front seven folks. I just don't think that this weakness keeps Bill up at night.
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The passing game on the other hand is an unqualified disaster. Our offense COULD be even worse if we lose a couple of OL's.
================
FOR ME
Bill will try to keep who he can before free agency formally starts. I don't think that there will be any panic over the defense as long as we keep Butler and Guy. Obviously, Bill expect Allen to start or he will get a $5M-$8M replacement. And I expect us to use a top draft choice for a front seven player. We all agree that there will be help brought in.

Some folks want to replace everyone and start over. I don't think that is what we should do on defense. And I would be shocked if that is Bill's posiiton.
 
Duggers and Phillips need to see 80%+ of the snaps every game.

Love Chung but it's time to move on or make him a reserve.
Is your position is that these two are more valuable on the field than DMac?
 
Our run D won't magically get better when Hightower and Chung come back....and Simon wasn't holding down the edge as good last year.
Our run might indeed get better with Hightower coming back and with a couple of NFL NT's on the roster. Bill has seen Allen play. We have not. He will be kept or replaced. And his backup will be secured. And yes, this does presume that we keep Guy. To lose Guy would be mean that we would need to spend a lot and hope that we replace his production.
 
Is your position is that these two are more valuable on the field than DMac?
No. Where is that coming from?

NEP is in nickel/sub D 80% of the time.
 
No. Where is that coming from?

NEP is in nickel/sub D 80% of the time.
I apologize. I didn't realize that Dugger had been moved to nickel back. I prefer Jones in that role.

Dugger is our #3 safety, who plays a lot in a LB role.

Do you really consider Dugger a nickel back, when DMac, Jackson and Jones are out there (75% of the time)?
 


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