OT: Official 2020 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

lancerman said:

I’ll say once again, Peyton Manning went to Denver and struggled for 5 weeks before adjusting and once he did his team was the most dangerous in the league. He did not have an all star coach. It’s very premature to declare a victory when Tampa player a top NFC team in game 1 led by one of the all time best passers in history and we beat a mediocre Dolphin team.

By the end of next week it could be us getting stomped in Seattle and the Bucs beating Carolina and the narrative is flipped.

In fact the Bucs should be viewed as favorites in their next 4 games until GB

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There is no narrative or declaring victory one way or the other.

This entire concept of there being some competition is just invented by dumbasses. For anyone who doesn't watch the Bucs because they are a Patriots fan I say good for you there is no obligation to follow any ex-player. For others -- like me -- that are in the fortunate situation to enjoy rooting for two teams this year it is also a great time.

Anyone that wishes either Brady or BB ill just because of some tired narrative about "who is more important" -- which can't be proven one way or the other anyway -- is just too prideful to get out of an argument that has no value at its very core level. Because quite honestly what it all boils down to is.. who gives a ****.

IllegalContact said:

meh.......that dude is gone and he ain't comin' back.........I can't give a crap any more cuz it's Cam Newton time....I like the banners though....and the memories

I just think the hubris that prevented him from just walking away on top after beating the rams is so trashy looking

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Yes because he owes it to you of all people to stop doing what he loves because you don't like it.

sb1 said:

Didn't seem to be a problem for Cam yesterday. (shrug)

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Trying to compare the 2 is futile

2 completely different teams, systems and circumstances

Also, New Orleans is one of the top teams in the NFL... Miami is not.

1 game means nothing, you would think that Pats fans would have learned that by now. I still remember the 0-31 start against the Bills after cutting Milloy, I believe they went on to win the SB that year if memory serves me correctly

I just dont understand the pleasure people take in dumping on Brady, the guy gave us his blood, sweat and tears for 20 years and brought us unprecedented levels of success and joy... and then he moves on and people turn on him in a heartbeat, and appear to take joy in his shortcomings

makes no sense at all to me. perfect example for athletes to always chase the money and never show team loyalty, because even the fans don't show it to the greatest QB in NFL history who gave us 2 decades of elite play and often took less money on team friendly deals to help the team.

Bill Lee said:

That's an interesting narrative, but we now know Mr and Mrs Brady were already heading for the exits after the 2017 season:

Soon after, Benedict writes, Kraft summoned Brady and his wife Gisele Bündchen to his home for a discussion. Bündchen took up for Brady. After pointing out how much Brady had done for the organization:

She also pointed out how ridiculous it was that after all these years, Belichick still treated Brady like "f****** Johnny Foxboro." It was bad enough to never voice approval. It was ******** to still be dressing down the most accomplished quarterback in league history during team meetings and treating his personal trainer and best friend like some kind of outcast.

When the conversation shifted to the future, Brady and Bündchen indicated it was time for them to make some changes that were in the best interest of their family. Among other things, they were contemplating a change of scenery.

Kraft wasn't surprised by their feelings toward Belichick. He hadn't, however, expected to hear that Brady and Bündchen wanted to leave New England.

So, Tom was first to say he wanted to leave, presumably triggered because Alex G was forced out of the locker room and the plane, plus Mrs Brady was not liking the way BB was addressing her man.

The relationship didn't mend itself magically after that. The incentive-laden contract bump Brady was given later in the summer prior to the year was another source of irritation. A source told me that summer that the contract was akin to refusing to take the thorn out of a lion's paw.

But by the time the season started, Belichick and Brady pocketed their grievances and got along better than they had in years, sources told me at the time.

Everything wasn't fixed forever - the two men were at cross-purposes in that Belichick wanted to build for the future and a 40-plus quarterback didn't fit that bill - but they got along well enough to go 11-5 in 2018, and then rampage through the playoffs to another Super Bowl.

So they patched things up somewhat, and carried on for a while, but to say Brady was "shoved out" is way off target.

Ref: New book reveals how close Tom Brady came to leaving Patriots after Super Bowl loss to Eagles

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If the Patriots had offered Brady what the Bucs did there is a 0.0% chance he is not a New England Patriot. There are always going to be bumps in the road in a 20 year relationship. Bill and Brady hit a bump in the road in 2017 then patched it up. Then Brady wanted to play to 45 and Bill didn't want him playing to 45 with the Patriots and Tom left. Pretty simple.

IllegalContact said:

you're right about the first part.........as for what's stupid, that's subjective......I think 'playing until I suck' is pathetic

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I think turning down 50 million dollars to do something I love is stupid but I guess we cant all be as enlightened as you.

condon84 said:

He's not gonna F you bro. No matter how hard you try i think he likes women

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Ooooh you got me bro! You're so edgy!

203Pat said:

If the Patriots had offered Brady what the Bucs did there is a 0.0% chance he is not a New England Patriot. There are always going to be bumps in the road in a 20 year relationship. Bill and Brady hit a bump in the road in 2017 then patched it up. Then Brady wanted to play to 45 and Bill didn't want him playing to 45 with the Patriots and Tom left. Pretty simple.

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And then the Patriots can enjoy an 8-8 record with a very old, expensive and disgruntled QB that probably would have a passer rating in the 80's again.

Hcelizondo said:

Not sure why this thread is not on the Tampa bay forum...

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because people are naturally going to talk about the QB that played here 20 years and brought unprecedented success that will likely never be replicated ever again?

luuked said:

There is no narrative or declaring victory one way or the other.

This entire concept of there being some competition is just invented by dumbasses. For anyone who doesn't watch the Bucs because they are a Patriots fan I say good for you there is no obligation to follow any ex-player. For others -- like me -- that are in the fortunate situation to enjoy rooting for two teams this year it is also a great time.

Anyone that wishes either Brady or BB ill just because of some tired narrative about "who is more important" -- which can't be proven one way or the other anyway -- is just too prideful to get out of an argument that has no value at its very core level. Because quite honestly what it all boils down to is.. who gives a ****.

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I can’t believe Patriots fans are buying into this media created Shaq/Kobe type of feud between them.

203Pat said:

If the Patriots had offered Brady what the Bucs did there is a 0.0% chance he is not a New England Patriot. There are always going to be bumps in the road in a 20 year relationship. Bill and Brady hit a bump in the road in 2017 then patched it up. Then Brady wanted to play to 45 and Bill didn't want him playing to 45 with the Patriots and Tom left. Pretty simple.

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Disagreeing about market value is quite different than being shoved out.

BB used what he paid TB to set the line for others on the team.

BB wouldn't pay Revis more than $14M for one season because that's what TB made ( ref: Darrelle Revis shares great Bill Belichick story from Patriots contract talks ) and I'm sure he used that line a lot.

BB didn't care what age TB was, he cared that he was showing signs of decline and didn't want to pay $25M over two seasons for that.

It would have made other players want more and the whole team building strategy would have unwound.

Kdo5 said:

I feel the same way. Granted I’m starting to dislike the Bucs team, particularly the coach so I’m feeling more conflicted.

By the way, how far back did you have to dig and how much time did you need to waste to locate that post? You’ve got too much time on your hands, sir. Might want to get a hobby.

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Took a minute. Searched 'Tampa Bay', looked for the thread that discussed his signing (it was on the first page), and your post was on the second page

Bradyites wanted this team to be 1-15 so badly without Brady lol.

Bill Lee said:

Disagreeing about market value is quite different than being shoved out.

BB used what he paid TB to set the line for others on the team.

BB wouldn't pay Revis more than $14M for one season because that's what TB made ( ref: Darrelle Revis shares great Bill Belichick story from Patriots contract talks ) and I'm sure he used that line a lot.

BB didn't care what age TB was, he cared that he was showing signs of decline and didn't want to pay $25M over two seasons for that.

It would have made other players want more and the whole team building strategy would have unwound.

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Obviously I am speculating here but I think he would've taken a little less than what the Bucs offered. I just think Bill was ready to move on and basically didn't offer him anything.

Ice_Ice_Brady said:

I can’t believe Patriots fans are buying into this media created Shaq/Kobe type of feud between them.

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Feud is too strong, we're talking about a long term relationship with some tension in it, and the end was a bit messy.

203Pat said:

I just think Bill was ready to move on and basically didn't offer him anything.

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If that were true, BB wouldn't have even attempted to sign the powder keg that was AB.

But he did, and for one brief flash of a game, everyone was happy, then it all went up in a fireball.

My honest assessment is that BB was not actively pushing Brady out or actively trying to keep him, BB just did what he does with every other player that he has ever dealt with- assigned them a value threshold which he refused to exceed.

My feeling is that the wheels really started to come off after the AB fiasco and Brady was once again stuck with mediocre receivers.

PatsWickedPissah said:

Completely on point.
I'm in the root for Brady camp, but I felt that his his pre-season remarks "Football is fun again!" would come back on him. I just didn't realize how much so, and in the very first game.

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I think people are taking that comment out of context, he was responding directly to Gronk coming out of retirement to Tampa. I took it as him saying Gronk is a fun, energetic guy that loves football and makes practice fun, i didn't take it as a slight at NE

Kasmir said:

I don't have any problem with the thread being here, I get that there is a ton of interest in past and present Pats fans in TB. But you shouldn't be surprised that fans with contrary views post here given that it's in our faces every day.

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they arent forced to participate in the thread, in fact cant you even ignore the thread completely, then its not in your face every day?

JMC00 said:

Well I can tell you right now any fan that is anti-Bill the GM does. They want Brady to win the SB to so they can say Bill the GM and Bill the coach were the same person being carried by Brady.

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Really? Wow--have not come across that.

IllegalContact said:

meh.......that dude is gone and he ain't comin' back.........I can't give a crap any more cuz it's Cam Newton time....I like the banners though....and the memories

I just think the hubris that prevented him from just walking away on top after beating the rams is so trashy looking

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The very hubris that gave him the edge to win 6 in the first place.

And of all the QBs, the guy that spends 20 years never once complaining publicly, or embarrass the franchise, or raping anyone, or taking the MAX contract, is the guy who apparently has character flaws.

Not the other QBs.

203Pat said:

Obviously I am speculating here but I think he would've taken a little less than what the Bucs offered. I just think Bill was ready to move on and basically didn't offer him anything.

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I think both were ready to move on.

Brady made his displeasure known at the end of 2017 yet came around and accepted the terms and conditions and played well in the 2018 season.

For 2019 he took similar wages but asked for the right to not be franchised so he could walk if he wanted to, and this was granted.

Then he put his house on the market which was about as clear a sign he could give that he was ready to move on.

I'm sure something was on the table for 2020 but I'm also sure Tampa put a lot more on the table and it was TB's ticket out of here.

Now Giselle can stop complaining about how BB treats him, and can hold her head high about his salary and about living in an even bigger mansion in Tampa Bay, and Alex has unlimited access.

Too bad for him that Bruce Arians is a big step down from BB in terms of being able to lead an organization.