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Interesting comp for N'Keal Harry


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completely futile exercise


Well if we can't compare atheletes based on their physical measurables, historic production, and rate statistics than we're just going by the eye-test and how firm their handshake is, which does seem flutile [sic].
 
Well if we can't compare atheletes based on their physical measurables, historic production, and rate statistics than we're just going by the eye-test and how firm their handshake is, which does seem flutile [sic].

Oh I'm for actual production. And Harry had terrible production last year and forget the injury, of the games he played, his catch% last year was very bad for a first round pick.

.
 
I'm fine with the aspirational comparison to Williams as a guy who was similarly considered a rookie disappointment due to missing most of camp and the first half of his rookie year because of injury, with the hope that Harry follows a similar (or, preferably, better) path. It's just proof of the idea that a WR can be disappointing as a rookie and emerge as a second-year player. DeVante Parker was also considered a disappointment, as was DJ Chark.

I find the comparison of the players themselves to be specious. Other than physically, they don't really have much in common. Williams is a vertical threat who plays like a faster Plaxico Burress (incidentally, another guy who was disappointing as a rookie) while Harry's a big strong YAC guy like an Anquan Boldin or Keyshawn Johnson. Of course, comparisons are aspirational for both players at the moment.
It was a pleasure watching Key & Boldin work across the middle. KJ gets a lot of hate but he was one of the best ever going across the mof. Knowing he's going to get hit and still make a play. Not his fault NYJ made the mistake taking him #1 and creating stupid expectations. Actually wasn't bad first 5-6 years.

Those two took a beating though.


Amani Toomer is another one that took some time to develop before breaking out. Roddy White kinda took a few years to really get going.
 
Mike Williams is a meh player.

Not worthy of a 1st round pick. I pray that Harry is not like him.
 
Somehow drafted this guy over far more collegiate productive WRs with higher ceilings (fast twich explosiveness/speed)

Here's to hoping a far better year 2. Hopefully he becomes strong and aggressive enough to pull down tightly contested balls, because he has zero chance at separating with his wheels.

someone who know more about football than everyone here......combined
 
:thumbsup::oops::thumbsup:
Somehow drafted this guy over far more collegiate productive WRs with higher ceilings (fast twich explosiveness/speed)

Here's to hoping a far better year 2. Hopefully he becomes strong and aggressive enough to pull down tightly contested balls, because he has zero chance at separating with his wheels.
His last 2 years in college as a sophomore and junior his produced 155-2230-17. Please show me all these guys that were “far more productive” and had higher upside. :thumbsup:
 
Wrongo...a better comparison is Donald Hayes...anyone remember him? VERY SIMILAR rookie stats, particularly games played, catch %...Hayes went on to a mediocre AT BEST NFL career....and that's being generous. Harry is headed for Hart Lee Dykes + Donald Hayes = NKeal Harry
 
Wrongo...a better comparison is Donald Hayes...anyone remember him? VERY SIMILAR rookie stats, particularly games played, catch %...Hayes went on to a mediocre AT BEST NFL career....and that's being generous. Harry is headed for Hart Lee Dykes + Donald Hayes = NKeal Harry

you just like ragging on names with an H
 
Is it me or has the duchebaggery in here gotten worse recently? Why can't people just make a point without being a giant @$$hole?
 
Are we pretending Mike Williams is a high-end NFL WR?

You can watch N'Keal Harry play, and he simply looks helplessly slow. It doesn't ever appear he has the slightest chance of beating his defender.
 
:thumbsup::oops::thumbsup:
His last 2 years in college as a sophomore and junior his produced 155-2230-17. Please show me all these guys that were “far more productive” and had higher upside. :thumbsup:

The scouting reports regarding Harry are unfortunately coming true.

"Team sources call Harry not real twitchy or explosive. They worry about how he is not fast in and out of breaks and don't see suddenness. Some sources said that Harry reminded them of Ole Miss wideout Laquon Treadwell, who is currently headed toward bust status for the Vikings. Some other sources say they are grading Harry on the second day of the 2019 NFL Draft. One team source said they originally planned on grading Harry in Round 2, but were lowering him to the third round."


In comparison read Deebo Samuels scouting report


"As a receiver, Samuel is impressive. His speed and play-making skills with the ball in his hands eclipse that he is a really talented wideout. He runs good routes and consistently uses his speed to achieve separation. Samuel is very dangerous on quick slants and running go routes down the sideline. Samuel is very adept at tracking the ball in the air and plays it well. He high points the ball and times his hands nicely to make catches over defensive backs. Samuel has soft hands and catches the ball with his hands naturally. He is also an aggressive receiver who isn't afraid of contact.

What really sets Samuel apart is how dangerous he is with the ball in his hands. He has excellent vision to weave around defenders and can use his speed to rip off yards in chunks. He has quick feet along with the cutting ability to stop-start or stutter step, and a strong frame to run through arm tackles. When the ball hits Samuel on the run, he is a big problem for defenders because he is tough to grab in the open field with his shifty moves. Samuel has enough speed to run away from defenders and take a catch the distance. Samuel is superb on screens and jet sweeps to race through the defense.

Samuel looks very versatile for the NFL. He could line up as an outside receiver and play the X - split end - to challenge teams vertically. Samuel also is dangerous out of the slot and could be a tough receiver to defend on underneath routes. With his size and speed, Samuel also could take some carries out of the backfield. On top of his offensive skills, Samuel is a dynamic returner who should contribute on special teams. In the 2019 NFL Draft, Samuel has a slim chance of being picked in the back half of the first round and probably will not get out of the second round if he makes it to Friday night."


Also AJ Browns scouting report


“Slot bully with rare combination of brawn and quickness that allows him to separate with both power and foot quickness. Brown has the size and demeanor to take on a relatively heavy workload as a safety blanket for a young quarterback in a ball-control passing attack. He'll see an upgrade in athlete across from him, but he has the feet and body control to uncover and create windows as a premium route-runner.”

Seems like a much better option for both Brady and a young QB like Stidham. Brown also out produced Harry numbers wise against much stiffer competition


If they wanted to draft a project, should have gone with DK Metcalf. Bigger, faster with more upside than Harry. We even took Jojuan Williams over Metcalf.
 
The scouting reports regarding Harry are unfortunately coming true.

"Team sources call Harry not real twitchy or explosive. They worry about how he is not fast in and out of breaks and don't see suddenness. Some sources said that Harry reminded them of Ole Miss wideout Laquon Treadwell, who is currently headed toward bust status for the Vikings. Some other sources say they are grading Harry on the second day of the 2019 NFL Draft. One team source said they originally planned on grading Harry in Round 2, but were lowering him to the third round."


In comparison read Deebo Samuels scouting report


"As a receiver, Samuel is impressive. His speed and play-making skills with the ball in his hands eclipse that he is a really talented wideout. He runs good routes and consistently uses his speed to achieve separation. Samuel is very dangerous on quick slants and running go routes down the sideline. Samuel is very adept at tracking the ball in the air and plays it well. He high points the ball and times his hands nicely to make catches over defensive backs. Samuel has soft hands and catches the ball with his hands naturally. He is also an aggressive receiver who isn't afraid of contact.

What really sets Samuel apart is how dangerous he is with the ball in his hands. He has excellent vision to weave around defenders and can use his speed to rip off yards in chunks. He has quick feet along with the cutting ability to stop-start or stutter step, and a strong frame to run through arm tackles. When the ball hits Samuel on the run, he is a big problem for defenders because he is tough to grab in the open field with his shifty moves. Samuel has enough speed to run away from defenders and take a catch the distance. Samuel is superb on screens and jet sweeps to race through the defense.

Samuel looks very versatile for the NFL. He could line up as an outside receiver and play the X - split end - to challenge teams vertically. Samuel also is dangerous out of the slot and could be a tough receiver to defend on underneath routes. With his size and speed, Samuel also could take some carries out of the backfield. On top of his offensive skills, Samuel is a dynamic returner who should contribute on special teams. In the 2019 NFL Draft, Samuel has a slim chance of being picked in the back half of the first round and probably will not get out of the second round if he makes it to Friday night."


Also AJ Browns scouting report


“Slot bully with rare combination of brawn and quickness that allows him to separate with both power and foot quickness. Brown has the size and demeanor to take on a relatively heavy workload as a safety blanket for a young quarterback in a ball-control passing attack. He'll see an upgrade in athlete across from him, but he has the feet and body control to uncover and create windows as a premium route-runner.”

Seems like a much better option for both Brady and a young QB like Stidham. Brown also out produced Harry numbers wise against much stiffer competition


If they wanted to draft a project, should have gone with DK Metcalf. Bigger, faster with more upside than Harry. We even took Jojuan Williams over Metcalf.
You said they drafted him over far more productive college receivers.
Your answer to being proven wrong about that is to post scouting report negatives about him and positives about the others?
Does the lack of intellectual integrity bother you at all?
 
You said they drafted him over far more productive college receivers.
Your answer to being proven wrong about that is to post scouting report negatives about him and positives about the others?
Does the lack of intellectual integrity bother you at all?

apparently you didn’t read my post. I brought up AJ Brown and said “Brown outproduced Harry in college against much stiffer competition”. That answers that.

I also said “less upside than those other WRs”. I think the scouting reports regarding Samuel, Metcalf, and Brown clearly show they have higher upside than Harry. That scouting report I posted of Harry is backed up by almost every major scouting website

try again thee wise one
 
Looking back, there is zero justification for drafting Harry over AJ Brown. Brown outproduced him against stiffer competition, was more pro ready, was less of a risk, AND has the higher upside. Brown had no major red flags while Harry had one big one..lack of ability to separate. Metcalf was a project and big risk with monster upside, and Samuel produced about the same but had higher upside than Harry. I can understand Harry selected over those two but not AJ Brown.
 
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I was a big fan of Deebo Samuel going into the draft. He had a great rookie season with 800 yards and 3 TDs. And he's only going to get better.

Pats just FAIL at drafting WRs. Whoever is in charge of that department needs to be fired and replaced with a competent personnel guy/scout.

I just have ZERO trust in the Pats ability to draft WRs. We've only hit success twice in 20 years. Edelman and Branch.

The scouting reports regarding Harry are unfortunately coming true.

In comparison read Deebo Samuels scouting report


"As a receiver, Samuel is impressive. His speed and play-making skills with the ball in his hands eclipse that he is a really talented wideout. He runs good routes and consistently uses his speed to achieve separation. Samuel is very dangerous on quick slants and running go routes down the sideline. Samuel is very adept at tracking the ball in the air and plays it well. He high points the ball and times his hands nicely to make catches over defensive backs. Samuel has soft hands and catches the ball with his hands naturally. He is also an aggressive receiver who isn't afraid of contact.

What really sets Samuel apart is how dangerous he is with the ball in his hands. He has excellent vision to weave around defenders and can use his speed to rip off yards in chunks. He has quick feet along with the cutting ability to stop-start or stutter step, and a strong frame to run through arm tackles. When the ball hits Samuel on the run, he is a big problem for defenders because he is tough to grab in the open field with his shifty moves. Samuel has enough speed to run away from defenders and take a catch the distance. Samuel is superb on screens and jet sweeps to race through the defense.

Samuel looks very versatile for the NFL. He could line up as an outside receiver and play the X - split end - to challenge teams vertically. Samuel also is dangerous out of the slot and could be a tough receiver to defend on underneath routes. With his size and speed, Samuel also could take some carries out of the backfield. On top of his offensive skills, Samuel is a dynamic returner who should contribute on special teams. In the 2019 NFL Draft, Samuel has a slim chance of being picked in the back half of the first round and probably will not get out of the second round if he makes it to Friday night."
 
Pointed this out in another thread but SF, apparently has made no secret they really liked Harry. They most likely had Harry WR1 & Deebo WR2.
I actually had Harry WR2, Deebo WR3 & Brown WR4 .
Anyway it's extremely likely they (SF) take him if we took Deebo or he was gone by that pick.

And let's not forget about context ...
Harry was dealing with injuries as rookie WR, on the NEP, in Brady's last year. Deebo went to work with Jimmy, Kyle & co. And guess what? They played to his strengths perfectly. Keeping most of his recs close to the los.

Harry is a lot better than what we saw last year and I'd argue he's looked at very different if that KC TD had been called the right way.

He needs work and by all accounts has worked very hard.
If anyone remembers, even before he was drafted here. I talked about him working on his release game. He can't get cute. He has to be efficient & decisive at the line. He cleans that up. It goes a long way. I have to believe he's working on the top of his route as well. No reason to give up hope.







 
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I wonder how the nitwits who have already given up on a 1st rounder after he missed half a season and a good chunk of preseason would have handled Troy Brown.
 
Is it me or has the duchebaggery in here gotten worse recently? Why can't people just make a point without being a giant @$$hole?

Losing the greatest QB of all time + six weeks of being stuck in your house = crazy, angry Pats fans.


Could react worse...E4DC5B9E-1279-438F-A559-302C47811F5D.png
 
Player A:
6'4" 220lbs
40-time: 4.49s
Rec/Targets: 11/23
Yards/Rec: 8.6
(College: 21 TD/2727 Yds)

Player B:
6'4" 225lbs
40-time: 4.53s
Rec/Targets: 12/24
Yards/Rec: 8.8
(College: 22 TD/2889 Yds)

Player A is Mike Williams in 2017 (drafted #7 overall), Player B is Harry in 2019. Williams went on to be a mid-tier WR, catching 10 TDs in 2018 and going for over 1000 yards in 2019.

I'm as strong a believer in N'Keal's potential as anyone here, but I have to say that there is big difference between 4.49s and 4.53s in the 40. N'Keal is not slow at 4.53s -- he's average for an NFL WR -- and in fact he's (sadly) faster than any of the Pats receivers returning from last year, and slightly faster than any of our RB's as well. And he's bigger than all of them except the TE's.

But if Mike William's 40 time really was 4.49s, that would be much faster than N'Keal. However, unlike N'Keal, Williams time was not from the combine but rather from his pro day, and there was as usual a lot of variability as measured by different scouts, with some having him as slow as 4.6s, and most at 4.5s like N'Keal.
 
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I have to say that there is big difference between 4.49s and 4.53s in the 40.

Can you explain this ?

We are talking about 0.04 seconds here. How does this turn into a big difference especially because both are essentially the same size while Harry seems to be heavier according to the posted numbers.

The difference is close to a rounding error.
 
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