Brady named to NFL 100 All-Time team

sean10mm said:

Every position so far on the all-time team has had a very strong bias towards the past. Some positions excluded the 21st century entirely. Peyton was the league figurehead for so long I expect him to make it, but don't be surprised if every other QB who played significant time in the 21st century is snubbed.

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Just to use your italicized portion as a jumping off point:

No 21st century RB made the list. If people really want to consider that a problem, they should re-check every RB on the list that they think wasn't worthy, and then re-check EVERY other RB, not just the 21st century RBs.

No-brainer level choices who are not the "old-school" guys from well before the Super Bowl era:

Brown
Campbell
Smith
Sanders
****erson
Payton
Sayers
Simpson


So that leaves only 3 slots where you're even going to have the argument of "not a lock" or "from too far back":

Lenny Moore
Earl Clark
Marion Motley


But, even if you take all 3 off the list, you still don't just automatically jump to 21st century RBs. There are still all time greats like Marcus Allen, Tony Dorsett, Thurman Thomas and others (Walker, Czonka, Harris, ...) who'd have to be looked at. Hell, depending upon how you were weighting your criteria, you could easily argue for Bo Jackson.

So, sure, there are at least 3 21st century RBs who could be, and likely were, looked at seriously (Faulk, Tomlinson, Peterson). But I don't think that they are clear "mistakes" who'd absolutely and positively have gotten in if only the evaluators hadn't had some theoretical bias against the most modern RBs.

And that's just the RBs. I think one thing we've got going (and understandably so) is people with recency bias claiming that those without it are biased, while ignoring their own.

Ring 6 said:

Brady
Montana
Unitas
Graham
Baugh
Elway
Marino
Young
Manning
Starr

Off top of my head May have let someone off

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Staubach

I will never understand how Elway remains so overrated to this day. Just in his era I'd put him behind Montana, Marino, Favre and Young off the top of my head.

0x All-Pro 1x MVP (only because Montana and Rice split the vote), and his signature moments consist of a) squeak out wins against the Browns, b) choke in the Super Bowl over and over, and then c) hand Terrell Davis the ball over and over.

sean10mm said:

I will never understand how Elway remains so overrated to this day. Just in his era I'd put him behind Montana, Marino, Favre and Young off the top of my head.

0x All-Pro 1x MVP (only because Montana and Rice split the vote), and his signature moments consist of a) squeak out wins against the Browns, b) choke in the Super Bowl over and over, and then c) hand Terrell Davis the ball over and over.

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The Elway supporters like myself will say the offensive talent around him and system he was forced to play in under Dan Reeves was a horrible fit but yet still took that team to 3 SBs. Once Shanny came and they landed Smith, Sharpe, TD, McCaffery his numbers started to align with his talent. Couple with that his knack for consistently making big plays when they needed to be made.

Tony2046 said:

Staubach

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Yup

h0c2000 said:

I think the only reason Rodgers is in the discussion is that he's most likely going to be 2nd team all decade QB for 2010s. Neither will make it, so it doesn't really matter.

Brees is like Marino with a Super Bowl Ring.

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Fixed it for you

Joey007 said:

Fixed it for you

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Either way, neither should be selected.

Ring 6 said:

Yup

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Who would you cut from your list for Staubach? Young?

sean10mm said:

OK, here's my guess for the list:

Tom Brady
Joe Montana
Peyton Manning
Warren Moon
Dan Marino
Roger Staubach
Bart Starr
Johnny Unitas
Otto Graham
Sammy Baugh

Everything so far tells me this list is going to skew old as heck.

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Tom Brady (6-3)
Joe Montana (4-0)
Peyton Manning (2-2)
Warren Moon (none)
Dan Marino (0-1)
Roger Staubach (2-2)
Bart Starr (2-0)
Johnny Unitas (1-0)
Otto Graham (pre)
Sammy Baugh (pre)

Where is Terry Bradshaw who is only other QB with a 4-0 SB record.

Brewskies said:

You're a kid.

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Yup...and when God said " Let there be Light" you flipped the switch..

Tony2046 said:

Who would you cut from your list for Staubach? Young?

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Off my list Marino. Off a prediction theirs probably young.

venecol said:

Tom Brady (6-3)
Joe Montana (4-0)
Peyton Manning (2-2)
Warren Moon (none)
Dan Marino (0-1)
Roger Staubach (2-2)
Bart Starr (2-0)
Johnny Unitas (1-0)
Otto Graham (pre)
Sammy Baugh (pre)

Where is Terry Bradshaw who is only other QB with a 4-0 SB record.

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Moon shouldn’t sniff this list

The QB list should be a very enlightening look into the overall approach taken by the evaluators. I think it's fair to say that a lot of QBs from earlier generations, even as recently as the 90's, would struggle in today's game. Elway, who was like Bledsoe in that he was playing during the transitory era where the deep pass and rocket arm was being replaced by the short-middle game and precision passing, couldn't make it in today's game. But I don't think that there's any question that some of today's best QBs would struggle playing in the days of bigger and "dirtier" hits, hands-on cornerbacks, and the like. Hell, we saw Peyton Manning struggling with just the CB part of that enough so his GM got the rules changed.

I think most of these QBs should be easy selections, and I've given my sure seven often. But I look forward to seeing how the selectors approached it, and any differences that may come about as a result.

Ring 6 said:

Moon shouldn’t sniff this list

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Agree, that was his list, I just added the SB records.

Bill on shooting the episode with Tom:

“All of that was a great experience for me. I really appreciate the opportunity and was honored to do it, and spending time with Tom on the set was awesome. We’ve been through so many great moments together, both on and off the field, in terms of the actual football game itself, but all the preparation that leads up to it and the competition that’s involved there with other coaches, players, teams, and so forth. Yeah, it was great to talk about those and think back and reflect on some of the great moments that we’ve shared together and how much hard work and the other part of the experiences that went into those moments – not just the result of the play, or a game, or even a season, but all of the things that you think about.

"I mean, those things don’t just happen. There’s miles and miles and miles that are covered before you actually get that final yard, or few yards, or whatever it is that determines games, and ultimately seasons. So, yeah, it was tremendous. It was great. It was great to be with Tom. It was great to be with the other studio guests, as well, because it’s a very, very special group and they all have something in their own personal great history to share that we can all – and I can – learn from."

This is one the most honest and open-hearted assessments Bill has done on his relationship and history with Tom. It’s obvious that the culture of the team has always been that no one is bigger than the unit and Brady has been the perfect embodiment of that but in moments like this when he’s simply Bill the human being and not Bill the coach you can see his true sentiment and thoughts about Brady. “There’s no other QB i’d rather have than Tom Brady” aren’t just empty words.

sean10mm said:

I will never understand how Elway remains so overrated to this day. Just in his era I'd put him behind Montana, Marino, Favre and Young off the top of my head.

0x All-Pro 1x MVP (only because Montana and Rice split the vote), and his signature moments consist of a) squeak out wins against the Browns, b) choke in the Super Bowl over and over, and then c) hand Terrell Davis the ball over and over.

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He didn’t choke. No way. They gave up 55 to Denver and gave up 35 in a quarter to Washington.

Elway took teams that belonged nowhere near the super bowl, to the Super Bowl.

fightingirish595 said:

Elway took teams that belonged nowhere near the super bowl, to the Super Bowl.

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That's the myth, sure.

sean10mm said:

That's the myth, sure.

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Watching people take the cheese on the AFCE = Trash, while ignoring the weakness of the AFC, as a whole, for decades with regards to Elway's Broncos and Kelly's Bills, is always interesting.

sean10mm said:

That's the myth, sure.

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hows it a myth. His teams got destroyed. They gave up 39,42, and 55 in their losses with him

Deus Irae said:

Watching people take the cheese on the AFCE = Trash, while ignoring the weakness of the AFC, as a whole, for decades with regards to Elway's Broncos and Kelly's Bills, is always interesting.

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that’s sort of the point. Denver got there in part because the best teams were in the NFC.

fightingirish595 said:

hows it a myth. His teams got destroyed. They gave up 39,42, and 55 in their losses with him



that’s sort of the point. Denver got there in part because the best teams were in the NFC.

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But that doesn't mean that Elway's teams didn't belong in the Super Bowl and/or weren't legitimately in the SB. Being the best in a weaker conference doesn't mean you didn't belong in the title game. Elway's SB trips were with teams that went:

11-5 (2nd best record in the conference)
10-4-1 (best record in the conference)
11-5 (best record in the conference)
12-4 (2nd best record in the conference)
14-2 (best record in the conference)