Penalties being considered for the Pats - UPDATED 1/1/2020

I've said it before and I KNOW it's not his responsibility but the advance scout knew he was being featured that day he should of made sure the crew knew what they couldn't of filmed. After that the people in the press box should of helped the kid when it was obvious it wasn't some malicious cheating plot mounting a tripod in the front row. The league could protect their own and that includes NE, a franchise that has made all these owners alot of money over the last 20 leagues. Love or hate them, they draw the biggest games.

shmessy said:

Pretty funny - - have you tried reading THIS ONE?

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This thread should be critical of Kraft. He's the owner of Kraft Productions isn't he? Instead we have to listen to more Belicheat bs that further tarnishes his and Brady's legacy.

Now a question. Do you think Kraft bears any responsibility for the team's success being incorrectly labelled as cheating? I do. He's a great owner but he's not prefect.

robertweathers said:

They received permission from the Browns. They did not receive permission from the Bungles who were the visiting team.

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No, I mean Cincy was filming NE in the box to show what NE was doing, with the idea that "they caught" NE doing something nefarious. That's what the 8 mins of tape is.

My point is, did CIncy get permission to roll tape from the press box via their own team personnel, because we've been told that is illegal.

This is how stupid this is. Again, it's almost like teams are trained like a Pavlov dog to just look ofor anything they can use to bring to Goodell to sell him on some scandal tied to NE to steal picks.

Sidebar:

It's like when Woody Johnson or Mike Tannenboob said 'we caught them redhanded' after the Spygate game, Week 1 of 2007.

Caught them redhanded in broad daylight doing what exactly? Doing what all teams do, including the Jets? That's the problem is these cheating teams trying to get out in front of the narrative to the point Goodell is prodded to act.

The home team is supposed to give the video coordinator a specified location. It's in the rulebook. The Jets did not, BB said F U and put Estrella on the sideline to mess with the Jets AFTER Manboobs illegally tried to use TWO cameramen from locations in Foxborough in January of 2007. We only learned of this well after the fact.

It was only AFTER that incident in Foxbrough were the Jets were CAUGHT RED HANDED violating rules. Yet, Goodell did nothing.

You can't have multiple video scouting coordinators throughout a stadium. Each team employs one and uses one at a game.

The reason why you have to give the road team a spot is to make it fair, so the it wouldn't seem like the home team has better scouting on you over the other. This is why the location has always been in the books and why they wanted it followed, too; they don't want a coach with decision making power to lean over and ask to see something, which makes sense. BUt, you can't tell Mike Tomlin's 100K fine is worth less than BB having his video guy in an unapproved location in broad daylight. This is how the NFL works. It's how the ball thing started too, in 2009 I think it was? QBs lobbied for traveling with their own footballs so the slick/stiff footballs out fo the box wouldn't be a disadvantage for the road QB.

robertweathers said:

Agree with your logic but I'm not sure we are playing at such a high level where we can sit JE.

We need wins.

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C'mon they got this week.

They know EVERYTHING about the opposing sideline.

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Tottie said:

I've said it before and I KNOW it's not his responsibility but the advance scout knew he was being featured that day he should of made sure the crew knew what they couldn't of filmed. After that the people in the press box should of helped the kid when it was obvious it wasn't some malicious cheating plot mounting a tripod in the front row. The league could protect their own and that includes NE, a franchise that has made all these owners alot of money over the last 20 leagues. Love or hate them, they draw the biggest games.

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Systematic failure of internal and external communication, process and awareness. Nothing more.

Antdawg said:

Patriots will get a large fine and lose a draft pick. It would have been a lot worse if it had been done in secrecy, like the Jets videotaping. This was done in open view and is a case of incompetence/negligence. But because it's a 2nd offense and anyone with any ties to the Patriots should have known better, we're losing a pick and getting fined.

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They also informed and got credentialed by the Browns organization.

Kraft will pay a hefty fine, but it was not football ops - - there will be no draft pick penalty.

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shmessy said:

They also informed and got credentialed by the Browns organization.

Kraft will pay a hefty fine, but it was not football ops - - there will be no draft pick penalty.

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God I hope not we already set a Second on fire by trading for Sanu

@PatsDynastyX2 all that makes too much sense. They did however come down way too hard on Sean Payton also. I don't know how it goes down in locker rooms but everyone tries to hit everyone hard. Beyond ridiculous to suspend him 1 year. If you win they will destroy you. Everyone hates the commissioner but the problem is the owners - including our own who let Tom Brady out to dry. Tom ****ing Brady - one of the actual good guys in the league that makes them all millions.

1960Pats said:

This thread should be critical of Kraft. He's the owner of Kraft Productions isn't he? Instead we have to listen to more Belicheat bs that further tarnishes his and Brady's legacy.

Now a question. Do you think Kraft bears any responsibility for the team's success being incorrectly labelled as cheating? I do. He's a great owner but he's not prefect.

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Absolutely. Nobody is perfect. He's screwed up countless times over 25 years.

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Tottie said:

@PatsDynastyX2 all that makes too much sense. They did however come down way too hard on Sean Payton also. I don't know how it goes down in locker rooms but everyone tries to hit everyone hard. Beyond ridiculous to suspend him 1 year. If you win they will destroy you. Everyone hates the commissioner but the problem is the owners - including our own who let Tom Brady out to dry. Tom ****ing Brady - one of the actual good guys in the league that makes them all millions.

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The New Orleans thing was 100% football ops perpetrated by a DC who worked directly for Sean Payton. I would try a different analogy to employ here.

This thing with the Patriots is as if your wedding videographer, whom your parents chose and paid for, grabbed a guest's derriere at the reception.



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Roger Goodell Promises 'Thorough' Review Of Patriots, Creating Some Unease With Investigation

I'm not entirely sure we are going to get a ruling during the 2019 season...

shmessy said:

The New Orleans thing was 100% football ops.

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Yes but I"m referring to the penalty not fitting the crime. All teams try to 'hurt' or hit players. The punishments are ridiculous it's like jay walking and getting 20 years in a jail.

PatsDynastyX2 said:

No, I mean Cincy was filming NE in the box to show what NE was doing, with the idea that "they caught" NE doing something nefarious. That's what the 8 mins of tape is.

My point is, did CIncy get permission to roll tape from the press box via their own team personnel, because we've been told that is illegal.

This is how stupid this is. Again, it's almost like teams are trained like a Pavlov dog to just look ofor anything they can use to bring to Goodell to sell him on some scandal tied to NE to steal picks.

Sidebar:

It's like when Woody Johnson or Mike Tannenboob said 'we caught them redhanded' after the Spygate game, Week 1 of 2007.

Caught them redhanded in broad daylight doing what exactly? Doing what all teams do, including the Jets? That's the problem is these cheating teams trying to get out in front of the narrative to the point Goodell is prodded to act.

The home team is supposed to give the video coordinator a specified location. It's in the rulebook. The Jets did not, BB said F U and put Estrella on the sideline to mess with the Jets AFTER Manboobs illegally tried to use TWO cameramen from locations in Foxborough in January of 2007. We only learned of this well after the fact.

It was only AFTER that incident in Foxbrough were the Jets were CAUGHT RED HANDED violating rules. Yet, Goodell did nothing.

You can't have multiple video scouting coordinators throughout a stadium. Each team employs one and uses one at a game.

The reason why you have to give the road team a spot is to make it fair, so the it wouldn't seem like the home team has better scouting on you over the other. This is why the location has always been in the books and why they wanted it followed, too; they don't want a coach with decision making power to lean over and ask to see something, which makes sense. BUt, you can't tell Mike Tomlin's 100K fine is worth less than BB having his video guy in an unapproved location in broad daylight. This is how the NFL works. It's how the ball thing started too, in 2009 I think it was? QBs lobbied for traveling with their own footballs so the slick/stiff footballs out fo the box wouldn't be a disadvantage for the road QB.

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It's an interesting dynamic.

At a high-level, they are business partners with the singular focus of making money, expanding their addressable market and growing interest in the sport but also are intense, cutthroat, back-stabbing competitors. No quarter given or taken.

robertweathers said:

You think they did what exactly?

They received permission from the Browns. They did not receive permission from the Bungles who were the visiting team.

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It's been reported the 8 min tape is Cincy rolling tape showing what NE was producing with Kraft Productions.

It's not NE's 8 mins on tape, it's Cincy's.

So, this means Cincy personnel rolled tape from the press box quite possibly without proper permission or it even being legal.

This also means, they automatically thought the worst, are paranoid, and quite frankly, should be embarrassed how stupid they look thinking NE would be trying to openly film a sideline with their football operations with 2 dozen people in a press box.

robertweathers said:

It's an interesting dynamic.

At a high-level, they are business partners with the singular focus of making money, expanding their addressable market and growing interest in the sport but also are intense, cutthroat, back-stabbing competitors. No quarter given or taken.

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That's fine, except this is like Coke or Pepsi lying about one another, going back and forth, and neither thinking it's slanderous.

I get what you guys are saying they are competitors but they are also partners. The league protected the Jets for the real Spygate2 and the steelers/giants for deflategate2 to the point where only hardcore fans know they happened. The league controls the media so why are they allowing this to go on. There is a different standard and surely owners should know that unless they dock draft picks this won't give anyone a competitive advantage against us, it will do the opposite. All this does is create ratings for big games, people will want to tune in to see the big bad cheating Patriots lose to whoever. They should of killed this one right away it's garbage to use the pats to create news in this way.

PatsDynastyX2 said:

It's been reported the 8 min tape is Cincy rolling tape showing what NE was producing with Kraft Productions.

It's not NE's 8 mins on tape, it's Cincy's.

So, this means Cincy personnel rolled tape from the press box quite possibly without proper permission or it even being legal.

This also means, they automatically thought the worst, are paranoid, and quite frankly, should be embarrassed how stupid they look thinking NE would be trying to openly film a sideline with their football operations with 2 dozen people in a press box.

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Yep. Total and complete losers

PatsDynastyX2 said:

That's fine, except this is like Coke or Pepsi lying about one another, going back and forth, and neither thinking it's slanderous.

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Coke and Pepsi aren't in business together. NFL teams are.

robertweathers said:

Coke and Pepsi aren't in business together. NFL teams are.

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Exactly.

This to me shows how weak the NY office is. They should of told the other owners to pipe down their faux outrage on this one. This is just petty by the owners.

robertweathers said:

Coke and Pepsi aren't in business together. NFL teams are.

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Right, but they are in the same industry and use the same ingredients, so they wouldn't want to lose margin with how they produce their products. So, it's like competing, but you also don't want to come off unprofessional or lie either.