The defense in perspective

Tony2046 said:

I think APF was quoting BB during his interview with WEEI. They asked him what he said to the defense during the game. It was pretty funny. If I can find the link I'll post it.

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Here you go, Tony:

Here’s What Bill Belichick Told Patriots’ Defense In Sideline Huddles Vs. Jets

Clonamery said:

Here you go, Tony:

Here’s What Bill Belichick Told Patriots’ Defense In Sideline Huddles Vs. Jets

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You should put that in it's own thread. That's a great Sunday morning watch. Thanks

Tony2046 said:

You should put that in it's own thread. That's a great Sunday morning watch. Thanks

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Yeah, great stuff.

Wanted to give a quick update and some additional perspective. Some of it more for our...uh...um fans from out town, say places like Baltimore.

*Scroll to the bottom for the cliff notes*

This season after 8 games, our opponents average 19.2 ppg when not playing us. We now allow 5 ppg a 14.2 ppg differential. Not to shabby.

We have played the following scoring ranked offenses, 19,23,25,26,30,31,31,32 and have allowed 40 points. Seems to lend credence to the detractors argument, yes? Not so fast my friends, and I'll get to that shortly.

Currently our remaining opponents offenses rank 4,10,13,6,2,29,25,32 in scoring.

So for the season that (based on current rankings) projects out to:

5 games vs top 10 offenses
2 games vs 11-20
10 games vs 21-32
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Now, here is the not so fast my friend moment referenced above
2000 Ravens, we all agree was a disgusting defense, many argue the best ever:

Offensive Scoring rankings through the first 8 games: 17,8,16,30,31,8,24,13

82 points allowed or 10.2 ppg.
2 games vs Top 10 offenses allowed 46 points
3 games vs 11-20 offenses allowed 26 points
3 games vs 21-31 offenses allowed 10 points

For the first half of the season their opponents averaged 22.4PPG (regular season) vs teams not from Baltimore, Baltimore allowed 10.2 PPG (regular season) for a point differential of 12.2 ppg for the first half of the season.
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2 games vs Top 10 offenses allowed 46 points (Both vs Jax who was ranked 8th)
6 games vs 11-20 offenses allowed 71 points
8 games vs 21-31 offenses (5 games vs bottom 3 offenses) allowed 34 points

Their opponents averaged 17.5 ppg (regular season) vs teams not from Baltimore, they allowed 9.4 ppg (regular season) for a point differential of 8.1 ppg for the season.
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We can allow 111 points over the next 8 games and match their defensive points allowed mark or 13.9 ppg.

If we are a product of who we played then what are the 200o Ravens? Being Ravens week, I got curious and I'm glad I did.

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Cliff Notes:

Through the first 8 games:
Baltimore: 17,8,16,30,31,8,24,13
New England: 19,23,25,26,30,31,31,32

Points Allowed:
Baltimore: 82 points or 10.2ppg.
New England: 40 points or 5ppg

Games vs Top 10 offenses
Baltimore: 2, allowed 46 points
New England: 0
Games vs 11-20 offenses
Baltimore: 3, allowed 26 points
New England: 1, allowed 7 points
Games vs 21-31 offenses
Baltimore: 3, allowed 10 points
New England: 7, allowed 33 points

Those are some very similar numbers, so if we are overrated then what does that make the 2000 Ravens?

There are two teams playing lights out defense this year. The Patriots and the 49ers. The Patriots season begins Monday (my opinion) as they will face some tough opposition on the road. The 49ers don't get any stiff competition till the end of November. Will be interesting which team has the statistically best defense by years end.

Triumph said:

What if?

The Pats do make it to Miami in February and they choose to don the throwbacks as a big FU to the league and Goodell. What could the NFL do if NE rolled out of the locker room wearing the old red and white? Nothing. Cant stop the show at that point.

The game goes as we hope and the curse of the old uniform is dispelled. BB pays homage to Patriots of yesteryear.

How sweet on so many levels.

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Dear Robert Kraft:

Here is your guide on how to dress your team at Miami in February:



NAME=EDELMAN

Another thread that's aged well, I see...

Our defense is very soft versus the run. Once teams start running for chunks of yardage, we bring up the safeties and the passing game opens up for the opposition.

Shelton needs to have a big game against the eagles, but he is hurt.

hard for Brady to score when the eagles own time of possession and the defense can’t still the run.

Actual Pats Fan said:

Dear Robert Kraft:

Here is your guide on how to dress your team at Miami in February:

NAME=EDELMAN

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Lots of challenges to be conquered prior to any talk of early February football. Either way, you’re not getting these uniforms, so you’re going to have to continue carrying that grudge. Yikes.

captain stone said:

Another thread that's aged well, I see...

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It actually has. One of the best defenses in history in terms of DVOA, points allowed and what not. Pretty much shut down everyone in 8 out of 9 games.

If your expectation is to absolutely dominate every game and every snap then there is not a single defense in history that lives up to that expectations. The 1985 Bears, 2000 Ravens and also 2013 Seahawks each had their own 30 burger game to deal with.

Dismiss it all you want but so far this has been a championship worthy defense overall.

"8-0"

That was Then.


0-1 (soon to be 0-2)

This is Now.

captain stone said:

"8-0"

That was Then.


0-1 (soon to be 0-2)

This is Now.

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Soon to be 0-2? You are absolutely baffling and don't appear to derive much pleasure from this franchise.

captain stone said:

0-1 (soon to be 0-2)

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Obviously it's a championship level defense.

Question remains is it an all time historic defense

Your implication seems to be that the great defensive teams of the past may have problems with any of the teams we played in the first half. And no I wouldn't compare us to great defenses of the steelers and the 1985 bears.

An alternative inference is that, somehow, the stats in the first are indicative oh w the team will play against much, much more difficult opposition.
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Don't get me wrong. I think that we have a top 5 defense, and one that is plenty good enough to take us deep into the playoffs, and have us competitive in the AFC championship game and the Super Bowl.

luuked said:

It actually has. One of the best defenses in history in terms of DVOA, points allowed and what not. Pretty much shut down everyone in 8 out of 9 games.

If your expectation is to absolutely dominate every game and every snap then there is not a single defense in history that lives up to that expectations. The 1985 Bears, 2000 Ravens and also 2013 Seahawks each had their own 30 burger game to deal with.

Dismiss it all you want but so far this has been a championship worthy defense overall.

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86 Bears defense was actually a bit better than 85.

If this defense can give up under 200 points, that would be in the historic category IMO

Perhaps. Stats are great, but the level of competition has to matter a little. The rest of our division is the worst in the AFC. The NFC East is about the same. And the AFC North is likely to have one team over .500.

Viper652 said:

86 Bears defense was actually a bit better than 85.

If this defense can give up under 200 points, that would be in the historic category IMO

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The 85 Bears gave up 411 passing yards to a 7-9 Vikings team.

411 passing yards in 1985 is like 550 passing yards now

Yards don't count much. How many were in the 4th quarter, after the game was well in hand? Losing teams often have a lot of passing yards. I believe that Kramer's QB rating was under 75 in that game, as befits a QB who is losing. He also was sacked 4 times.

Viper652 said:

The 85 Bears gave up 411 passing yards to a 7-9 Vikings team.

411 passing yards in 1985 is like 550 passing yards now

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Yes, but they also gave up quite a few yards well over 300 yards total offense.

That surprised me a bit.

They really just flicked a switch in the playoffs