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To Win is to Fail?


School me please. Is the draftee obligated to sign with the team that selected him? Can he avoid the draft and sign with the team of his choice?

I didn't follow the dealings of the NFL years ago, just the game itself. But I am familiar with the deal that Rivers pulled and have a little idea about Elway as well. What prevents others from pulling these stunts? I mean if the teams can suck for luck, can the player as well? Can someone like Tua say, "I want to play for the Patriots only!" and refuse to join the draft?

It wasn't Rivers who pulled that stunt it was the holy family of the Mannings that forced that trade. Eli refused to play for the Chargers.

Edit: see that it had already been responded to.
 
It’s relevant because the Patriots have rebuilt a couple times during this run without going in the toilet.

You don’t need to tank to win. In fact most teams who do just continue to suck.

Not really siding with anyone here, but just want to point out rebuilding with Tom Brady as your QB is in a completely different universe than say rebuilding with Fitzpatrick or any other career backup/journeyman.
 
I’d easily take Burrow over Tua. Tua has a small frame and has not even been able to stay healthy at the collegiate level. Burrow is extremely accurate and has been able to stay healthy. But yeah, regarding the thread, they’re ****ing up. What good is winning doing at this point?
The worst thing for Miami and winning games: They aren’t even doing it with a QB they see a future with. It’d be okay if Rosen was the one winning these games.
 
I always thought that Marvin Lewis was the greatest mediocre coach in NFL history.

Think he is a tad lower than mediocre, in 16 seasons the Bengals were 131 & 122, and the truly remarkable 0 & 7 in the playoffs.. he sucked.
 
All I know is that Miami fans are going to enjoy April a lot more than I will. ;)

Maybe they have have draft parties all over South Florida?? For many fans winning the draft is about as good as it will get..

FYI their draft picks for the next two years..

Dolphins 14 2020 draft picks:
1st: Own, Texans, Pittsburgh
2nd: Own, Saints
3rd: Own, projected compensatory pick
4th: Own, Titans
5th: Projected compensatory pick
6th: Own, Cowboys
7th: Own, Chiefs

In 2021 they have both their 1st & 2nd round picks + the 1st & 2nd of Houston..

That is a lot of "draft capital" so they can be major players is they really want the #1 pick..
 
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Early draft picks never are a sure thing.

Draft picks period are never a sure thing, nor should the tanking to get "better ones" dominate the team building process to such a degree that it will contaminate the very culture you accurately refer to as paramount to long term winning.

A balanced approach mixing in free agents, a steady stream of UDFAs and all year visits/tryouts to continuously try to improve, concentrating on the middle class and balance across all three phases of the game, and veteran role players that can still contribute solid but unspectacular stats at lower price points are staples to how the Patriots approach the NFL.

If Flores only took that away from his time here, he may well be successful.

Look at all the crap Gruden took last year for doing the same thing as Flores did early this year and now the Raiders are trending up, not down.
 
Tua Tilapia will be a bust.

Look, hes on Alabama. A proverbial NCAA football dream team. How many more times are Bama QBs going to be so hyped up like cant misses only to 5hit the bed?
 
With the first pick in the 2020 nfl draft Cincinnati selects .......Marvin Lewis.

Kiper: great pick. Impact coach. Maybe the best coach. He can be the driving force to a playoff birth. My early choice for coach of the year.

Wow, I didn't know that's how that happened. o_O :D
 
Tua Tilapia will be a bust.

Look, hes on Alabama. A proverbial NCAA football dream team. How many more times are Bama QBs going to be so hyped up like cant misses only to 5hit the bed?

When has this ever happened? I can't recall a single Alabama QB in the last two decades who was hyped as a meaningful NFL prospect. The closest you get is AJ McCarron, who was a 5th round pick. Greg McElroy was a 7th rounder. I don't think any of the others were even drafted.
 
Think injury stuff is overrated generally, football injuries are largely just random.

I do think Burrow will get taken over Tua though, as teams will talk themselves into him.

Burrow looks phenomenal but his fast rise worries me a little bit. Kontra, you love the late riser but look at your boy Baker, he's having an absolutely miserable season (even after the Browns went and got him a special wide receiver).

As for winning, I think it matters to both coach and players. Tanking is always much harder than it looks.
Thing is, neither Mayfield nor Burrow would qualify as late risers. They were both solid starters the year prior to their perceived “break out” years and Burrow was highly recruited out of high school and transferred because of the logjam at QB at OSU. Mayfield definitely stinks this season, though. No two ways around that. I noted yesterday that you never see him talking to OBJ and Landry on the sidelines. They’re always together while he’s by himself. That said, the reasons I’m starting to shy away from Tua are possibly reasons for Mayfield taking a step back - mostly revolving around his size. Burrow has prototypical size, is laser accurate, plays in a pro system, and prefers to do his damage from inside the pocket. No brainer for me.
 
That's a good question actually, even though I think you meant as being rhetorical.

If there is ONE thing that we know for certain if you have being paying attention to what is going on here for the last 20 years. CULTURE beats talent. Whenever the Dolphins draft, they are going to get a player of immense talent. But that won't help them if Flores hasn't developed a belief in his methods and coaching ability. Is Bill charismatic, or a leader who players follow because he gives a great pregame speech. No! They follow him because over his tenure his players have come to believe that he will make them better football players and his game plans give them a chance to win each and every week. What makes Bellichick so great is his CREDIBILITY.

So when the league had Miami going winless this season, Flores needed to make those who remained and those who will come into the future BELIEVE that he can given them that chance to win. IF they can execute them, his plans can win.

So while their wins may drop them a slot or two in next years draft, the CREDIBILITY that he is building up will go MUCH further to bring the Phins back to respectability than whether they get the first QB to go or the 2nd, or 3rd for that matter.

All I know is that Miami fans are going to enjoy April a lot more than I will. ;)
Flores has already established his culture there by trimming the fat. Winning is useless at this point. That’s especially true if you really believe BB’s philosophy that every year is different and unique. Winning at this point isn’t putting you in the playoffs and each win only takes away names that would either be at or near the top of your draft board. In other words - this isn’t the time to win anymore. That would have been at the start of the season. They clearly committed to tanking, and they can’t even do that right anymore. It’ll be hilarious if they end up missing out on either of the top two prospects. But at least they’ll have a few completely meaningless wins to look back on in 2019 and appreciate as they’re preaching to treat the 2020 season as if 2019 didn’t happen and that it is a new year, new team, and with new challenges.
 
He dropped because nobody bought the BS you idiot.

He was hyped up as a worldbeater, but is just another another crappy Bama QB The 2014 NFL Draft Could Be One Of The Best Quarterback Drafts Ever

He appears on a list with other hugely "hyped" NFL QB prospects like Aaron Murray (6th round), Brett Hundley (5th round), Braxton Miller (drafted as a wide receiver), Tajh Boyd (undrafted), and Zach Mettenberger (7th round). Given that Tua is going to be a top-10 pick and possible first overall, and has been the subject of rumored tanks by teams, we must have very different beliefs on what makes a "hyped" prospect.

One might suspect by the Bleacher Report and Business Insider articles, both of which are largely content mills, that you realize you made a stupid post and rather than admit it are googling frantically to find proof that AJ McCarron, of all people, was ever considered a top-flight NFL prospect. (Hint: He was not. No team was ever tanking for AJ.)
 
He appears on a list with other hugely "hyped" NFL QB prospects like Aaron Murray (6th round), Brett Hundley (5th round), Braxton Miller (drafted as a wide receiver), Tajh Boyd (undrafted), and Zach Mettenberger (7th round). Given that Tua is going to be a top-10 pick and possible first overall, and has been the subject of rumored tanks by teams, we must have very different beliefs on what makes a "hyped" prospect.

One might suspect by the Bleacher Report and Business Insider articles, both of which are largely content mills, that you realize you made a stupid post and rather than admit it are googling frantically to find proof that AJ McCarron, of all people, was ever considered a top-flight NFL prospect. (Hint: He was not. No team was ever tanking for AJ.)

Mcarron was talked up by NFL execs and not mouth breathing Bama fans.

Never has a school garnered more press over their QBs than Alabama. Stupid people buy the Tua hype.
 
Flores has already established his culture there by trimming the fat. Winning is useless at this point. That’s especially true if you really believe BB’s philosophy that every year is different and unique. Winning at this point isn’t putting you in the playoffs and each win only takes away names that would either be at or near the top of your draft board. In other words - this isn’t the time to win anymore. That would have been at the start of the season. They clearly committed to tanking, and they can’t even do that right anymore. It’ll be hilarious if they end up missing out on either of the top two prospects. But at least they’ll have a few completely meaningless wins to look back on in 2019 and appreciate as they’re preaching to treat the 2020 season as if 2019 didn’t happen and that it is a new year, new team, and with new challenges.

If you didn't know, now you know.

Management is tanking. But the coaches and players were not, are not and will not tank.
 
Think he is a tad lower than mediocre, in 16 seasons the Bengals were 131 & 122, and the truly remarkable 0 & 7 in the playoffs.. he sucked.
My comment was intended to be humorous, but there was some truth to it. Of coaches with over 130 wins, only two others approach Lewis in truly awesome mediocrity, Jeff Fisher and Weeb Eubank. Fisher's career record was 178-171 and Eubanks was 134-130. However, both Fisher and Eubanks won playoff games and Eubanks, memorably, a Super Bowl. Lewis's total career record of 131-129 is a true monument to mediocrity and may never be approached by any future coach, as few owners will ever keep around, for so many seasons, someone who never wins a playoff game. But I grant you that he sucked in the playoffs.
 
Burrow has prototypical size, is laser accurate, plays in a pro system, and prefers to do his damage from inside the pocket. No brainer for me.

All those things should be looked at plus how he performs in big games - as well as how clutch is he in close moments - and similar "intangibles" are what separates the measurables "as hyped" for most 1st round picks and the more important utilization of those measurables in such a way to impact winning versus stat padding. Not saying Burrow IS those things, just those are what needs to be examined.

That's the main difference between a Phillip Rivers who has all the measurables anyone could want but just doesn't do things well under pressure and a Russell Wilson or Drew Brees who don't have every measurable but sure do good things in pressure situations

(well, one goal throw aside.....)
 
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