Antonio Brown

MainePatsFan26 said:

In the past few days, here are the number of pages for a few select threads:

Brown Lawsuit - 115 pages
Patriots Sign Brown - 87 pages
Post Game Thread - 18 pages

I'm wondering if others feel maybe the Antonio Brown situation is getting to be too much of a distraction to bother. We just demolished Pittsburgh, a key rival, and all anyone can talk about is a guy who may or may not have ejaculated on a woman who ranges from saintly (she was reading religious texts) to a gold digging loose woman (Brown calls her a "hoe" in a text). And that guy had nothing to do with that victory, in case anyone needed reminding.

Is anyone else ready to cut him and be done with it?

ps. Randy Moss was a strange guy at times, but fun. I'm not sure it's fair to him to be included in the same conversation as Antonio Brown. Now, Big Ben and Brown? Those two seem like they might have some stuff in common (if not sexual assault, at least a degree of narcissism enough for a few small moons to orbit them).

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I totally agree. To be honest - I would sacrifice winning a Super Bowl rather than going through AB distraction every week. We have had enough distractions every season - this was totally not needed. I was enjoying watching the AB show from the outside. Now he is one of us (( As was pointed out - we won big without him. Team looked in sync and deadly.

Even if he is not guilty - doesn’t matter. He is a circus no matter what. Who knows what he might do next week and post a video of Brady saying something not intended for the public. You don’t want someone like him on your team - no matter the talent. To me - the whole social media addiction of his is more troubling than the current allegations - from the point of view of team chemistry. Who knows how many more women will come out. Pats are not a rehab organization for the problem childs if the NFL.

This is all publicity we do not need. Pats have prided themselves with locker room unity - this guy is a loose cannon. Dillon and Moss might have been trouble childs - but this guy is at another level. Just let him go and move on.

Brick27 said:

Not sure what PatsFans.com thread page counts have to do with whether or not the actual Pats organization views it as a distraction. Let’s wait and see.

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The Patsfans count directly has nothing to do with Belichick choosing whether to move on. I'm suggesting we're spending virtually all of our energy foaming at the mouth over a guy who is proving to be a major distraction. And the circus around him will have an impact on the team. This isn't one of "our guys" who we are defending from a media hit piece. Rather, this is a hired gun who is bathed in trouble.

More than half of people this past weekend wanted to have nothing to do with Brown before we signed him. Suddenly, everyone is defending him even though it could drag the team down.

denverpatsfan said:

Did I just read somewhere that this woman is getting married this weekend??!! Wouldn't you wait till afterwards before unleashing this media **** storm? This keeps getting weirder and weirder?

I heard a caller on talk radio equate Bob Kraft to Bill Cosby today. Host did not argue. The hate runs deep for our beloved team. This is off the charts.

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One of the things that troubles me about these sexual allegations with high profile defendants is the timing.

The crazy woman from Kavanaugh hearings is the most obvious example.

A cynical person would have trouble believing that there is not some agenda in play when these women suddenly "remember" or decide to pursue their case just when the potential defendant is in the public spotlight.

No.

Brick27 said:

Not sure what PatsFans.com thread page counts have to do with whether or not the actual Pats organization views it as a distraction. Let’s wait and see.

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Holy crap, how was this response not totally self-evident to the OP?

Ice_Ice_Brady said:

Holy crap, how was this response not totally self-evident to the OP?

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I understand people took this to mean that Belichick is somehow looking at this forum to make decisions. That wasn't my intention. Rather, I'm pointing out the storm around Brown that is consuming everything. No one is talking about Miami. It is all about Brown on here and, if the team as fellow humans are anything like us reading the press around Brown, that makes me worried we might have a trap game on our hands.

Well a few mediots claimed the Pats are a boring team that just rack up wins! I tell you what this 2019 - 2020 team is lit AF right now!

AndyJohnson said:

The nfl has free agency.

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Yes, the NFL has free agency. I'm talking more about the control that NBA star players have over their fates, to force trades before free agency.

NENGFAN said:

I totally agree. To be honest - I would sacrifice winning a Super Bowl rather than going through AB distraction every week.

Even if he is not guilty - doesn’t matter.

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If Brown works out in the long run, I hope you won’t feel like you deserved to be a fan of a championship team in any way. Your reaction to adversity is embarrassing. That’s essentially a Roger Goodell way of looking at things in not caring about whether or not he’s actually guilty because you don’t like the image it carries with it, even if he’s being railroaded.

How can you be a fan through Spygate, Deflategate, and constant fake or exaggerated stories about the Patriots and come to these conclusions? Your take on Brown’s social media stuff is somewhat legit, except that he hasn’t been given any chance yet with the Patriots, who have very different rules, standards, and culture than the two circus organizations where he played previously.

MainePatsFan26 said:

I understand people took this to mean that Belichick is somehow looking at this forum to make decisions. That wasn't my intention. Rather, I'm pointing out the storm around Brown that is consuming everything. No one is talking about Miami. It is all about Brown on here and, if the team as fellow humans are anything like us reading the press around Brown, that makes me worried we might have a trap game on our hands.

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And I actually don’t want to defend this guy. Defending BB, Brady, Kraft, even Chung...is something organic as they are Patriots. This guy is not a Patriot and all his prior history is now becoming our history. If he was still with the Raiders and all this assault news broke, we would be deriding AB and thanking our stars we didn’t sign him. I feel this was all BB - he wanted AB so badly.

Ice_Ice_Brady said:

If Brown works out in the long run, I hope you won’t feel like you deserved to be a fan of a championship team in any way. Your reaction to adversity is embarrassing. That’s essentially a Roger Goodell way of looking at things in not caring about whether or not he’s actually guilty because you don’t like the image it carries with it, even if he’s being railroaded.

How can you be a fan through Spygate, Deflategate, and constant fake or exaggerated stories about the Patriots and come to these conclusions? Your take on Brown’s social media stuff is somewhat legit, except that he hasn’t been given any chance yet with the Patriots, who have very different rules, standards, and culture than the two circus organizations where he played previously.

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He sure has started great after signing with the Pats....

MainePatsFan26 said:

I understand people took this to mean that Belichick is somehow looking at this forum to make decisions. That wasn't my intention. Rather, I'm pointing out the storm around Brown that is consuming everything. No one is talking about Miami. It is all about Brown on here and, if the team as fellow humans are anything like us reading the press around Brown, that makes me worried we might have a trap game on our hands.

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But that’s exactly what you’re saying...AGAIN! So you’ll be back here on Monday to acknowledge how foolish you were to use the phrase “trap game” when you have absolutely no clue about how the actual team is effected, despite an encyclopedia of historical examples of these things not effecting their on-field performance.

You could always just choose to ignore the AB threads. Presto, distraction gone.

I'm not saying that flippantly to be a jackass, I really do recommend using the feature if it's bothering you.

supafly said:

I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to rain on your parade.

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Just checking, this is sarcasm, right?

No I'm not gonna cut the man loose for the crime of being accused of stuff. That's simply not how justice works.

Cards on the table here: IMHO if this had teeth to it it would be centered around a criminal case rather than a lawsuit. Especially because criminal proceedings don't preclude going the civil route later on. This tells me that someone's either in a hurry, or someone's chain of evidence isn't very strong and they're hoping they can bluff their way to a settlement.

AB isn't gonna do himself any favors here because he IS going to open his mouth and say dumb things, that's just what he is, but being stupid and illterate in public isn't a crime.

If they can prove it to a grand jury and get him indicted I'll take it seriously. Until then... unscrupulous lawyers take stuff to civil court because you know they can't make criminal charges stick and just want a payoff to make the controversy go away. It's a tried and true legal strategy.

I'm not saying that's definitely what happened, and I'm even willing to entertain the possibility that AB actually raped her, that's certainly on the table pending evidence to the contrary. but until the accusations pass some kind of barrier of proof I refuse to take these accusations as more than exactly that -- accusations.

If Belichick hasn't cut AB yet, then I'm fine with AB on the team. Trust in the coaching staff and the organization. They are not morally bankrupt (they did cut Aaron Hernandez immediately after the news broke). and I am 100% behind whatever they choose to do.

MainePatsFan26 said:

The Patsfans count directly has nothing to do with Belichick choosing whether to move on. I'm suggesting we're spending virtually all of our energy foaming at the mouth over a guy who is proving to be a major distraction. And the circus around him will have an impact on the team. This isn't one of "our guys" who we are defending from a media hit piece. Rather, this is a hired gun who is bathed in trouble.

More than half of people this past weekend wanted to have nothing to do with Brown before we signed him. Suddenly, everyone is defending him even though it could drag the team down.

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Here's the thing. What else would we even be talking about right now if it wasn't for AB?

I mean-- we just shellacked our big conference rivals 33-3, the team's humming like a well oiled machine without AB, no major roster controversies and we've finally got Brady a young understudy, but the dude's years away from being ready for prime time.

There is nothing. Else. To talk. About. Thank GOD for the AB controversy.

Now if the noise starts getting in the players' heads that's another thing, but that's not happening to this franchise, BB will be the media lightning rod like always. so far this is just something for us to flap our wings and cluck over.

A distraction to the fans is not a "distraction" in any meaningful sense of the word. AB hasn't actually done anything wrong yet. If that changes, AB is gone, as in right then, but so far this hasn't happened

Ice_Ice_Brady said:

As I understand it, the victim has/had a few options.

1. File a criminal suit, whereby she would be not be identified by name in the media, nor would she be allowed to be badgered about her sex life on the witness stand. Rape Shield Laws apply.

2. File a civil suit seeking a payment, whereby she is not afforded those protections.

3. File a criminal suit first, and if it doesn’t go anywhere due to the time lapse, then file a civil suit, whereby she can claim she tried to pursue justice but the bar was higher.

4. File a criminal suit first, and if it does turn into a conviction, follow-up with a civil suit.

So SMY’s rather idiotic ravings about the victim having no options, while we should presume she is truthful while Brown is a liar and rapist, are totally egregious. That’s before we even get into the actual facts which show she followed him around after each incident and then asked him for 1.5M, and total oddity that she would file this immediately before her wedding and then expect there won’t be a ****storm.

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1) There’s no such thing as a “criminal suit”. She doesn’t get to file anything - that’s up to the government, specifically the state or federal prosecutors. That’s why criminal cases are “The People v. X” or “The State v. X”. She can press charges, but that doesn’t bind the prosecution in any way. They can choose not to prosecute if she does and they can choose to prosecute if she doesn’t. Though of course many times there will be no prosecution if the complainant won’t cooperate because it makes getting a conviction much tougher. Criminal trials, like civil ones, are open to the public except in very limited cases (and this wouldn’t be one of them). Also, there’s nothing preventing the media from identifying her. They may choose not to, but that’s their decision — they are not forced. And there’s also nothing preventing anyone who happens to know or discover her name from putting it on the internet, etc. As for “rape shield” laws, they constrain what the defense can ask about her sexual history. But they will still be able to ask tons of stuff about her sexual relationship with Brown, since the specific nature of that relationship is the very thing Brown would be on trial for.

Elijah said:

I'm not really sure how this isn't logically equivalent to saying "rape can't be a problem because there are laws against it." Enforcement is left to humans and nobody is stopping the person with confidential information from being sloppy even without malicious intent. Then you have to consider the material corruption in the police force making it even less likely things move directly toward justice. The existence of protective laws is better than the absence, but they only go as far as any law. There are many reasons not to feel comfortable trusting the justice system.

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Sometimes things don’t need deep philosophical explanations and can be explained by the simplest explanation: crimes weren’t reported because they didn’t happen. And that explanation fits into the entire timeframe of events here where her own actions in fact point to a consensual relationship. Is it so bad to post this explanation and posit it as the most likely scenario? All other interpretations of the events require you to swallow a decent sized glass of WTF juice and accept a very bizarre tale of an incredibly persistent and often vulnerable multiple-incident sexual assault victim.

The idea that Brown admitted to sexually assaulting her (which she claims is contained in his text message) is a huge stretch as well. I read the text messages as well. At no time did he admit that he did anything that wasn’t consensual, but he did blast her about twenty times for being a disgraceful liar who is making everything up. So the strongest evidence in her complaint is if you take an out of context sentence from Brown’s angry response, whereby he fails to clarify something was consensual, but ignores the other two pages of his response where he proclaims his innocence again and again. That’s pathetic.