Edelman & D. Thomas back at practice; Gordon in warmups

PatsFan2 said:

The sad thing in all of this is that we are potentially fielding a good Defense that should be able to force some punts. But as of right now we don't have a Good Young Punt Returner. Knowing how valuable Edelman is to our Offense none of us would like to see him taking any unnecessary hits on ST's he's not young anymore. Trading for a Return specialist shouldn't be out of the question for our Patriots that's now a NEED!

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Crazy talk. Edelman is just as valuable on his punt returns as he is on any singular reception, and he's no more likely to get hurt on them than he is taking a head shot on a route over the middle. Name the last player we had just to be the PR?

patchick said:

Fun factoids:

Braxton Berrios returned 47 punts in college for a 10.4 yard average
Gunner Olszewski returned 69 punts in college for 13.4 yard average

Braxton Berrios preseason PR average: 9.2 yards
Gunner Olszewski preseason PR average: 12.0 yards

(and no, I'm not suggesting that Olszewski will make the roster)

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Yeah, it’s pretty hard to make the case that Berrios has done anything to warrant using a (this year, with these players, a very valuable) roster spot on him. Perfect candidate for the practice squad.

Sicilian said:

Crazy talk. Edelman is just as valuable on his punt returns as he is on any singular reception, and he's no more likely to get hurt on them than he is taking a head shot on a route over the middle. Name the last player we had just to be the PR?

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I am not saying I would be against Edelman back their in a critical or key situation. I just wouldn't like that to be his exclusive job I am sure many would agree. We Drafted CB Cyruss Jones for that very duty not long ago sadly he didn't work out. Minus the older Edelman we have zero dept at the position.

PatsFan2 said:

We Drafted CB Cyruss Jones

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We drafted Cyrus Jones to be a CB, and his PR ability was a bonus. Sadly, he didn't work out at either one, but if he never proved any value at CB he wouldn't have stuck around just to return punts, even without the fumbles.

PatsFan2 said:

I am not saying I would be against Edelman back their in a critical or key situation. I just wouldn't like that to be his exclusive job I am sure many would agree. We Drafted CB Cyruss Jones for that very duty not long ago sadly he didn't work out. Minus the older Edelman we have zero dept at the position.

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The Patriots drafted Cyrus Jones to play corner. They had him return punts to try to keep him on the team.

TommyD4207 said:

The Patriots drafted Cyrus Jones to play corner. They had him return punts to try to keep him on the team.

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Jones was a really good Return man at Bama or did you forget??

203Pat said:

At this point I just will assume Slater is a lock every year until he’s not.

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Yep. The irony is that there really is a case for questioning Slater's job this year--I just don't think that the WR depth has anything to do with it.
If I were to make the case against Slater, it would go more like this:

"Racing down the field like a bat out of hell to slam into anything that moves is a young man's game. Slater is about to turn 34 and he's missed a lot of games to injury over the past few years. The end of the line is near, and may well be here."

If I had to make a guess, I'd say that he makes the roster this year, but it's his last.

patchick said:

Yep. The irony is that there really is a case for questioning Slater's job this year--I just don't think that the WR depth has anything to do with it.
If I were to make the case against Slater, it would go more like this:

"Racing down the field like a bat out of hell to slam into anything that moves is a young man's game. Slater is about to turn 34 and he's missed a lot of games to injury over the past few years. The end of the line is near, and may well be here."

If I had to make a guess, I'd say that he makes the roster this year, but it's his last.

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I feel like there were rumblings that he was going to retire prior to last year, simply because of his injuries. That might have been just noise, but I agree. There's only so long he can do what he's been doing at his level, before someone younger will need to take over. But I trust the team to make the decision on when that is, and I honestly think Slater will recognize it at the same time. I see this being a Bruschi like scenario, where he'll retire during training camp (whichever year it happens) because it's pretty clear he's just not keeping up anymore. And I think BB will have a similar amount of respect for him when that happens.

patchick said:

Yep. The irony is that there really is a case for questioning Slater's job this year--I just don't think that the WR depth has anything to do with it.
If I were to make the case against Slater, it would go more like this:

"Racing down the field like a bat out of hell to slam into anything that moves is a young man's game. Slater is about to turn 34 and he's missed a lot of games to injury over the past few years. The end of the line is near, and may well be here."

If I had to make a guess, I'd say that he makes the roster this year, but it's his last.

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How valuable is his locker room presence?
If it was me I would cut or trade Dorsett Bolden and Slater.
Possibly Harmon as well

I prefer Olszewski to Berrios. I suspect that they are both headed for the Practice Squad.

patchick said:

Fun factoids:

Braxton Berrios returned 47 punts in college for a 10.4 yard average
Gunner Olszewski returned 69 punts in college for 13.4 yard average

Braxton Berrios preseason PR average: 9.2 yards
Gunner Olszewski preseason PR average: 12.0 yards

(and no, I'm not suggesting that Olszewski will make the roster)

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ChrisR2223 said:

How valuable is his locker room presence?
If it was me I would cut or trade Dorsett Bolden and Slater.
Possibly Harmon as well

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I'm so confused about the many calls to cut Harmon. He's only 28, he played over 60% of the defensive snaps last season, and they didn't sign or draft anybody who looks likely to take his place. What am I missing?

patchick said:

I'm so confused about the many calls to cut Harmon. He's only 28, he played over 60% of the defensive snaps last season, and they didn't sign or draft anybody who looks likely to take his place. What am I missing?

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I think I prefer Obi
My preference would be to keep Harmon and Obi over special teams only guys like King.
I think Bill will stay with King though unfortunately.

patchick said:

What am I missing?

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Nothing. It's what others are missing.

ChrisR2223 said:

How valuable is his locker room presence?
If it was me I would cut or trade Dorsett Bolden and Slater.
Possibly Harmon as well

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Glad it's not your call.

Ebner is a gunner.

Patriots roster breakdown: SS Nate Ebner

I don't that we are overloaded at ST.

I think that we have had Slater and Bolden for together many years. I know that we tried ti replace Bolden for one year.

With regard to defense, Ebner and King have been part of the corp for years.

Brooks replaces Obi as the 4th safety and Ster. I don't fine this to be an overload.

SO WHERE ARE WE?
I believe that we often keep a couple of more front seven (six) players as special teamers. The last DL is usually a special teamer (the hated Grissom recently and others). Last year, we had LB's Grigsby, McClellan and Humber.

For me, we need a couple of MORE STer's, rather than being overloaded. I believe that Calhoun is one (the DL). I don't recall how much special teams Bentley played, but we need another LB/STer.

patchick said:

AFAIK know Bolden and Slater don't play the same ST positions, and I'm not convinced that giving 29-year-old Bolden $2 million in guarantees is a move to get younger and cheaper on special teams.

That said, the roster currently is overloaded with veteran ST specialists, and something's likely to give among this group:

Brandon Bolden
Terrence Brooks
Nate Ebner
Brandon King
Matthew Slater

(Slater is the only gunner among them, I believe?)

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ChrisR2223 said:

I think I prefer Obi
My preference would be to keep Harmon and Obi over special teams only guys like King.
I think Bill will stay with King though unfortunately.

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You can't be serious about Obi > Harmon

Whole lotta stupid in this thread

Elijah said:

You can't be serious about Obi > Harmon

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You heard what Stafford said it was like a d lineman stalking the secondary.

ChrisR2223 said:

I think I prefer Obi
My preference would be to keep Harmon and Obi over special teams only guys like King.
I think Bill will stay with King though unfortunately.

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Based on pure physical potential, you may have an argument. But Obi has been really disappointing this camp, and hasn't done anything to even beat out guys like Brooks or Ebner (when healthy), never mind a guy who plays starter-level snaps like Harmon.

203Pat said:

I don’t blame any of these guys for getting a little “aggressive” in their rehab.

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Agreed. It should honestly be legal considering what these guys' bodies go through, maybe in standardized amounts across the league? Still, not going to stop me from taking that jab at Manning whenever possible