FA part 2

luuked said:

What of the two would make for a bigger impact in terms of value ? Spending on a TE like Rudolph or a DT like McCoy ?

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Hmmm. Overall they'll be fine either way.

I think the D as-is is pretty damn good. Dr McCoy bring it to elite status IMO.

I know the feeling is the NEP is "phasing" out the heavy reliance of a TE in the offense but I just don't buy it. If Gronk as still "Gronk" he'd still be seeing 100 targets thrown his way. A reliable pass catching threat will only help Tom and the offense be more consistent converting short/mid distances - which is Tom's strength and will only enhance the play action.

I'd go with Rudolph but McCoy is clearly the more talented player.

McCoy. I studied him some and noticed he isn't as consistent in creating pressure anymore but he actually improved as a run stuffer and is very good at this. Pennel, Guy, Shelton and McCoy would make life very difficult for opposing RBs

Keyser Söze said:

Best defense in the league? Come on now, have we lost all semblance of objectivity on here.

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Obviously not. We had just 1 Pro Bowler on defense last year but I think we can have a similar defense we had in 2014 or 2016. Top 10-12 defense and top 5 scoring defense.

luuked said:

What of the two would make for a bigger impact in terms of value ? Spending on a TE like Rudolph or a DT like McCoy ?

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I gotta go with McCoy here.

The two players are not at the same talent level. I like Rudolph and think he would be a valuable addition, but McCoy is another level of talent. With the linebacking and secondary the Pats have, adding an absolute stud in the middle of that line would make that defense among the very best in the league, without doubt.

Adding Rudolph would improve the offense, but I'm not sure how much of an upgrade he'd be over Watson/someone else. He's a good player, but McCoy would fundamentally change the structure of the Pats' DL for the better.

That's also why I don't think the Pats will get him. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

SBLIII said:

Obviously not. We had just 1 Pro Bowler on defense last year but I think we can have a similar defense we had in 2014 or 2016. Top 10-12 defense and top 5 scoring defense.

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Who cares how many ProBowlers we had? 2014 D only had one PBer and the 2016 team had two.

supafly said:

While Miguel lays out a great hypothetical plan of attack the same way that he does for many potential free agents, I would be surprised if he thought that this was a good deal for Bill Belichick and the NEP.

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It is not. Did that based on McCoy's perspective. Numbers would be way lower if I was going to do it the other way.

robertweathers said:

Who cares how many ProBowlers we had? 2014 D only had one PBer and the 2016 team had two.

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Yep and the 2014 defense was ranked 12 adjusted and 16 ranked 16th.

UptownPatsFan said:

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Maybe McCoy is already spoken for.
I think it will be tough to beat the Browns for him my god I can't believe I just typed that.

ChrisR2223 said:

Maybe McCoy is already spoken for.
I think it will be tough to beat the Browns for him my god I can't believe I just typed that.

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Hope not.

ChrisR2223 said:

Maybe McCoy is already spoken for.
I think it will be tough to beat the Browns for him my god I can't believe I just typed that.

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I know he said he wanted to go a contender but he can't possibly believe in the Browns but we'll see.

Bradyking12 said:

I know he said he wanted to go a contender but he can't possibly believe in the Browns but we'll see.

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Cleveland is big time boom or bust but if they pay him good money it is a contender for now. Couldn't blame him.

50-yard-line said:

I gotta go with McCoy here.

The two players are not at the same talent level. I like Rudolph and think he would be a valuable addition, but McCoy is another level of talent. With the linebacking and secondary the Pats have, adding an absolute stud in the middle of that line would make that defense among the very best in the league, without doubt.

Adding Rudolph would improve the offense, but I'm not sure how much of an upgrade he'd be over Watson/someone else. He's a good player, but McCoy would fundamentally change the structure of the Pats' DL for the better.

That's also why I don't think the Pats will get him. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

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This x1000000. I can't even begin to see the point of view in which you take Rudolph over McCoy with all else equal. One is a solid starter. The other is a generational talent.

ChrisR2223 said:

Maybe McCoy is already spoken for.
I think it will be tough to beat the Browns for him my god I can't believe I just typed that.

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Usually news leaks quickly from the Cleveland front office. Look at the OBJ trade - ex players and members of the press were tweeting about that a week or two before the trade was completed, they just were not naming the player. As long as Schefty and Josina Anderson are quiet, I’m not giving up hope.

I read that Tampa had allowed his agent to negotiate with other teams, in hopes of making a deal. This likely means that McCoy knows exactly what teams are willing to offer him. That’s why I expect this to be resolved fairly quickly.

From my perspective, no news today is good news and the longer that continues, the better we should feel about the patriots being involved. At least that is my wishful thinking.

Patsgofor4 said:

Usually news leaks quickly from the Cleveland front office. Look at the OBJ trade - ex players and members of the press were tweeting about that a week or two before the trade was completed, they just were not naming the player. As long as Schefty and Josina Anderson are quiet, I’m not giving up hope.

I read that Tampa had allowed his agent to negotiate with other teams, in hopes of making a deal. This likely means that McCoy knows exactly what teams are willing to offer him. That’s why I expect this to be resolved fairly quickly.

From my perspective, no news today is good news and the longer that continues, the better we should feel about the patriots being involved. At least that is my wishful thinking.

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agreed I think it will be the Patriots.

Elijah said:

This x1000000. I can't even begin to see the point of view in which you take Rudolph over McCoy with all else equal. One is a solid starter. The other is a generational talent.

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The point of the question was not to compare Rudolph and McCoy with everything else being equal.

The point was asking whether the return you get from investing whatever money is necessary into McCoy would have a bigger impact on the overall team given that the defense is pretty stacked as it is compared to investing into an offense that is more of a question mark.

In other words who of the two would return a bigger ROI given the current state of both the offense and defense.

luuked said:

The point of the question was not to compare Rudolph and McCoy with everything else being equal.

The point was asking whether the return you get from investing whatever money is necessary into McCoy would have a bigger impact on the overall team given that the defense is pretty stacked as it is compared to investing into an offense that is more of a question mark.

In other words who of the two would return a bigger ROI given the current state of both the offense and defense.

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At that point, it becomes about numbers we can't know. Rudolph said not to a pay cut and is making 7.6m this year.

Do you get McCoy for 10m? I take McCoy.

3/20 for Rudolph, 3/33 for McCoy? I take McCoy.

5m for Rudolph, 14m for McCoy...probably Rudolph at that point.

Sign both of them!

50-yard-line said:

At that point, it becomes about numbers we can't know. Rudolph said not to a pay cut and is making 7.6m this year.

Do you get McCoy for 10m? I take McCoy.

3/20 for Rudolph, 3/33 for McCoy? I take McCoy.

5m for Rudolph, 14m for McCoy...probably Rudolph at that point.

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At those numbers I'd probably take Rudolph. I'm not convinced he'll play for $5m.

SBLIII said:

Yep and the 2014 defense was ranked 12 adjusted and 16 ranked 16th.

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Over the last 8 games the 2014 defense was as good as any in the league.