Hannable: Pats poor drafting at S is costing $20m+ in cap space

n6249c said:

Don’t agree that high proportion of veteran contracts implies poor drafting. Could be that proven veteran at a good price is less risky than a rookie on a learning curve.

Think about it this way: who would have the advantage in a head to head competition for a roster slot in training camp, a rookie with lots to learn or a veteran pro of equal ability who has several years of learning behind him?

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...and it's not like the deals for these players are exorbitant.

Hannable needed something to write. Plain and simple

???? What the F does it mean the Pats have a poor cap space? The Pats are going to have something close to 100 million of cap space next year.

If the Pats need any cap space, they can easily create some? Remember the Pats offered Humphries 10m per?

robertweathers said:

...and it's not like the deals for these players are exorbitant.

Hannable needed something to write. Plain and simple

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By “something “ you mean stupid?

BobDigital said:

The Pats have had issues drafting a number of positions. It isn't helpful that they often are forced to pick at the end of every round of course.

It is a fact most teams that win the super bowl do so because they have underpaid talent on rookie deals. Look at the past 5 non-Patriot super bowl winners.

The vast majority had tons of talent on the cheap.

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Fixed an otherwise good post.

Joker said:

Moron is a prerequisite for today's N.E. sports reporter

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By “moron” you mean someone with no skills?

Help me out. What am I missing here? The Pats drafted Chung, McCourty, Harmon and Richards in the last nine years. Only Richards was a bust and the other three are still productive players on the team.

JMC00 said:

In addition, if the Patriots could find a safety via the draft, they wouldn’t have over $20 million against the cap devoted to that position in 2019.

Hannable: Patriots’ current cap space problems can be traced back to poor drafting in recent seasons

Chung- Drafted by the Pats
McCourty- Drafted by the Pats
Harmon- Drafted by the Pats

So if the Pats pay guys they get dumped on and if they dont pay guys they get dumped on

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A quibble: Chung was signed from PHI, where he went after finishing his rookie deal with NE, making him a free agent acquisition this time around.

However, they have so many other drafted players anyways Super Bowl 2019: How the New England Patriots were built through the NFL Draft that it’s ludicrous to call them out for poor drafting. That article didn’t even run through Brady, Gronk, Gost, and Cardona because they’ve hit on so many picks there wasn’t room.

I know it’s boring, but can’t we just appreciate excellence?

We just did this in another thread, there's eight guys who've been to five (!) super bowls with the team, and about four others who've been to four super bowls (!). F*** cap space or drafting or whatever with those guys.

And don't pick on the safeties they kept. Go pick on Cyrus Jones or Jordan Richards.

The last draft year that has made it to Free Agency was 2015 and that was a complete home run for the Pats.

Malcolm Brown - slight disappointment for a 1st round pick but he started most games and just signed a 2nd contract

Flowers and Mason - exceptional talents and near highest paid players at their positions - instrumental in several Super Bowls

Cardona - solid ST player

Andrews - Great UFA pickup and solid starter/team captain

Roberts - lost due to log jam in secondary but just signed a nice contract with Jets

The much maligned Richards is still in the league and started 12 games for Falcons this year

AJ Derby - moved for a pick and still hanging on the fringes of a roster

My gut tells me that last years draft is going to end up very solid as well. Michel looks like a keeper, Wynn has every chance to win the starting LT role, Bentley looked good early - too early to tell with Dawson, Berrios and Sam but it seems likely 1 of the 3 with be a contributer this year.

2017 yielded Wise who is a keeper. Rivers needs to take a big step forward.

2016 is Thuney who never misses a snap and a couple fringe players

The Pats overall draft/UFA pickups are likely better than league average

Am I in an alternate dimension? Pats did win the Super Bowl right? 2 out of the last 3 no less.

The think the point, which is valid, is that the Patriots have sucked at drafting the last few years and this has led them to paying money for special teamers and for backups, when those players should be on rookie deals.

ahhh yes.....the failure of winning super bowls

as those on WEEI were saying yesterday..........people are actually beginning to listen to Felger

What about the UFA? Aren't they as good as a draft choice in this equation?

And the draft is fine considering their position and other moves.

2018 - Up in the air because of injuries, (Wynn, Dawson, Bentley, Berrios, Izzo, Sam), but they still got Sony & Crossen and added UFA JC Jackson. This looks like a good draft.

2017 - They only had 4 picks. Wise is ok and the jury is still out on Rivers. Garcia was bad luck, but they also added UFA Butler. The Pats did fine for what they were working with.

2016. Second round was their first pick because of the scandal that shall remain nameless. OK they missed with Cyrus Jones. It happens. Otherwise they turned Brissett into Dorsett, drafted Roberts, Karras in later rounds, and added Jonathan Jones as an UFA. In addition Malcolm Mitchell was a risk worth taking. Not an A+ year, but still reasonable considering their first pick was at #60

2015 - M. Brown, Trey Flowers, Shaq, Joe Cardona, added UFA Brandon King and David Andrews

Also remember they reluctantly cut draft choices NFL players like Kamu Grugier-Hill, Darryl Roberts, Cre'von Lablanc because they were so stacked.

Clonamery said:

By “something “ you mean stupid?

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He wrote something last week that was passable. I've since forgotten what it was so it couldn't have been that enlightening.

skspikex2 said:

Am I in an alternate dimension? Pats did win the Super Bowl right? 2 out of the last 3 no less.

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Silly, sports reporters in Boston are in an alternate dimension. You know its funny. I get more positive Patriots takes from WFAN than from EEI or 98 and the Globe. The New York guys are always referencing the Pats as the model team the rest of the league needs to emulate in all phases. Instead here we get Bozos who'd rather nitpick salary cap and free agent picks and losses.

Doctor DDS said:

The last draft year that has made it to Free Agency was 2015 and that was a complete home run for the Pats.

Malcolm Brown - slight disappointment for a 1st round pick but he started most games and just signed a 2nd contract

Flowers and Mason - exceptional talents and near highest paid players at their positions - instrumental in several Super Bowls

Cardona - solid ST player

Andrews - Great UFA pickup and solid starter/team captain

Roberts - lost due to log jam in secondary but just signed a nice contract with Jets

The much maligned Richards is still in the league and started 12 games for Falcons this year

AJ Derby - moved for a pick and still hanging on the fringes of a roster

My gut tells me that last years draft is going to end up very solid as well. Michel looks like a keeper, Wynn has every chance to win the starting LT role, Bentley looked good early - too early to tell with Dawson, Berrios and Sam but it seems likely 1 of the 3 with be a contributer this year.

2017 yielded Wise who is a keeper. Rivers needs to take a big step forward.

2016 is Thuney who never misses a snap and a couple fringe players

The Pats overall draft/UFA pickups are likely better than league average

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I agree. Sometimes it feels that a miss like Richards got amplified so much more because he has that "second round" label on him while absolute home runs like Mason, Flowers or Andrews get under appreciated (all in the same draft and later).

The two positions people want upgrades on (TE, WR) are "conincidentally" the ones where we have not picked anybody higher than round 4 (except Dobson in 2013) since 2011 (or maybe even beyond). Guess why there is this reputation of the Pats having difficulties drafting WR.. because they don't do it. And when they do it is usually a day 3 selection or UDFAs.

Ugh.

Doctor DDS said:

The last draft year that has made it to Free Agency was 2015 and that was a complete home run for the Pats.

Malcolm Brown - slight disappointment for a 1st round pick but he started most games and just signed a 2nd contract

Flowers and Mason - exceptional talents and near highest paid players at their positions - instrumental in several Super Bowls

Cardona - solid ST player

Andrews - Great UFA pickup and solid starter/team captain

Roberts - lost due to log jam in secondary but just signed a nice contract with Jets

The much maligned Richards is still in the league and started 12 games for Falcons this year

AJ Derby - moved for a pick and still hanging on the fringes of a roster

My gut tells me that last years draft is going to end up very solid as well. Michel looks like a keeper, Wynn has every chance to win the starting LT role, Bentley looked good early - too early to tell with Dawson, Berrios and Sam but it seems likely 1 of the 3 with be a contributer this year.

2017 yielded Wise who is a keeper. Rivers needs to take a big step forward.

2016 is Thuney who never misses a snap and a couple fringe players

The Pats overall draft/UFA pickups are likely better than league average

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Sorry for the double post. Didn't see yours when I began mine.

Usually I laugh off mediot stupidity as ignorance, but McCourty & Harmon bashing is up there.

The pass defense was the best man coverage unit in the NFL the 2nd half the season. They held three playoff opponents to 50% completion percentage...in 2019. You know, the year that defense supposedly got abolished in the NFL.

McCourty & Harmon played close to 2,000 snaps. Gee, maybe they play a role in the elite pass defense holding the 9th highest scoring offense of all time to 3 points.

It’s the equivalent of blaming a NT on an elite run defense for not making enough plays. Dumb.

patsinthesnow said:

The pass defense was the best man coverage unit in the NFL the 2nd half the season. They held three playoff opponents to 50% completion percentage...in 2019. You know, the year that defense supposedly got abolished in the NFL.

McCourty & Harmon played close to 2,000 snaps. Gee, maybe they play a role in the elite pass defense holding the 9th highest scoring offense of all time to 3 points.

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It was a remarkable performance, the Chiefs, Rams and Chargers were ranked 1st, 2nd and 7th in points scored. And they were ranked 1,2,3 in offensive DVOA (1st, 5th, 2nd passing DVOA).

The sad reality is that most of the writers aren't good. I like Bedard but his idea of cutting Hightower is nuts - High has some flaws now but still makes a ton of big plays. Lazar is on the upward trend but he has a long way to go, he's good with his game film but that's about it (general analysis often flawed but not self confident enough to admit it - nothing worse than someone who's wrong and insists he's right). I still like Howe and Kyed the best.

The article is all around stupid, but there's one point especially that I think these people forget about: The more successful you are, the more value every player that has played for you becomes. We've been to the super bowl for three straight years, winning two of them. It's impossible for any team to keep all their players at market value, never mind if that market has them rated an extra 10-20% higher because they've performed on the biggest stage.

Poor drafting happens to every team. No one hits on high percentage of their picks consistently over the course of two decades. But to act like draft misses are the sole reason we're right up against the cap is ignoring a lot of factors to purposefully reach a predetermined conclusion.