Post Game Thread Pats @ Jets

KDPpatsfan said:

I really feel like the front 7 is a bigger problem than then the backend. NO ONE can cover for 6-plus seconds every damn play. Gotta find some pass rush

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Come talk to me when you understand wtf a pass rush is. 12 years on this board and you still don't understand it.

supafly said:

I think you raise some fair concerns. The defense certainly has a way to go. The good news is that they've made some improvements and look to have gotten back to the bend but don't break philosophy, as opposed to a lot of the bend AND break tendencies that were seen in the first month.

So far, month two at least seems to be an improvement.

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No doubt it is.

But the loss to Carolina showed that our defense needed drastic improvement and quickly. They are not close to where they need to be for us to have a real chance of contending.

I thought today they took a step back against a putrid offense after a solid week in TB. It was pretty alarming.

I know it was said a lot last season but in this case I feel it is definitely true that those 17 points don't tell the story of today's game for the defense.

102 Pat said:

Damn, this is one of the under appreciated rivalries in sports, Pats/Jets is always a great game to watch...pitchers and catchers Mike!!!

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Not the same since Rex got fired.

They had some competitive years, but even when they sucked the bad blood was always there.

BTW, I love how no one mentions the ASJ "catch" in the first quarter that should have been ruled incomplete. ASJ's knee bounced off the ground before he caught the ball. One knee in bounds doesn't cut it..

JMC00 said:

Yep. There was the Gronk face guarding that was blatant. Brady's INT Skrine touched Dorsett's arm before the ball was there

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Face guarding isn't a penalty. However, Gronk was interfered with physically by contact on that play..

This team needs quicker starts to these games. Can't afford a slow start nex week.

Bartmac36 said:

AT WORST, thats an incomplete pass call. The fact that the pats got possession of the ball is just an utter embarrassment. Having said that, its an officiating issue, not a patriots issue

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How would it be an incomplete pass? ASJ had already taken several steps by the time the ball was punched out.. He had control of the ball prior to the action. He LOST control of the ball as he dove toward the pylon. He didn't get control back until after he was out of bounds..

Kdo5 said:

They are not close to where they need to be for us to have a real chance of contending.

I thought today they took a step back against a putrid offense after a solid week in TB. Concerning.

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They may not be close after week 6, but they've shown improvement in the past two games and have a 4-2 record, so that in and of itself should be considered "contending." After all, you need to win enough games to secure the division, possible bye, etc. The victories have to come from somewhere. Hopefully, month two will prove to be better than month one, and month three will be better than month two. I think we tend to see that with Belichick coached defenses, or many NFL defenses for that matter.

I share your same concerns. Believe me when I say that. I don't really see the step back that you do from the TB game, because I saw many concerning aspects of that game too, but the bottom line is that they've gotten back to limiting the points like in years past, and have made improvements in the rush defense. Still a long way to go, but at least it's gotten better in some areas.

DaBruinz said:

BTW, I love how no one mentions the ASJ "catch" in the first quarter that should have been ruled incomplete. ASJ's knee bounced off the ground before he caught the ball. One knee in bounds doesn't cut it..

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I had doubts about that play, too. Are you sure that getting one knee down doesn't cut it, though?

Bartmac36 said:

Literally everyone outside of delusional pats nation thinks the tuck rule was a terrible call.. theres a reason they got rid of that rule

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First of all, the "TUCK" rule was put in place LONG before that game. It was put in place because of Steve Young.

Secondly, only dumb asses who don't understand the rules think it was a terrible call. It had been called several times that year prior to the game against the Raiders. Had Gruden actually watched tape of the Pats/Jets game he would have see it called in the Jets' favor. So he only has himself to blame for not knowing the rule.

They didn't "get rid" of the Tuck rule. They changed it. And it took them 6-7 years before the change happened.

supafly said:

I had doubts about that play, too. Are you sure that getting one knee down doesn't cut it, though?

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My understanding is 2 points of contact other than a player's hands. So a knee and foot on the same leg would count, but ASF's feet were in the air..


ARTICLE 3. COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is
complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands

Now, the Any part of his body may indicate that you only need one, but we've seen catches called back for just one body part before.

Creative Username said:

Does anyone have any insight as to why Bademosi got the start at CB over Jones? I figured because Jones has more experience in the system and actually played a bit at nickel corner last year that he'd be the second CB behind Butler. From the eye test, that wasn't the case today although I suppose we'll know more when the snap counts come out. Just thought it was interesting.

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Because Bademosi is 6' with speed and has played at Outside Corner before while Jonathan Jones is a Slot Corner..

VegasGuy said:

They did put some decent pressure on McCown at the end.

Need that kind of effort all game.

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They put pressure on him all game long. They put MORE pressure on him later in the game with the Corner blitzes, though they got burned on the Butler CB blitz since it was Butler's man who was then wide open for the 40+ yard reception..

PatriotsNumero1Fan said:

This team needs quicker starts to these games. Can't afford a slow start nex week.

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lol why?

This defense still can still turn the corner there is plenty of time as long as they can get W's no matter how ugly come playoffs if the D can settle down we can be in a good position to walk into the Superbowl.

Jangles said:

Not really, no

And I don't think I'm trolling.

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Of course you are trolling.

You came at him pretty hot and heavy for having differing opinions. I also don't understand how you could think his description of the intention of the forum is wrong in the first place.

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Think what you want.

Imagine if there was a rule implemented that there will be no speculation or comments based on your perception of the team.

All posting would stop instantly.

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No the quality posting would still be here.

Just admit you're wrong here

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Still trolling huh?

PF_SU said:

These were as puzzling (especially since CBS showed no replays) as the defensive holding against Chung on the Panthers' game-winning drive. I don't really get the concept of defensive holdings on running plays by defensive linemen. How the heck does that even work?

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There are two rules that could apply: Rule 8, Section 4, Article 6 and Rule 12, Section 1, Article 6. Please note that I included Rule 12, Section 1, Article 5 because it specifically is referenced by Article 6.

RULE 8, SECTION 4, ARTICLE 6. DEFENSIVE HOLDING. It is defensive holding if a player grasps an eligible offensive player (or his jersey) with
his hands, or extends an arm or arms to cut off or encircle him.


RULE 12, SECTION 1 ARTICLE 5. LEGAL USE OF HANDS OR ARMS BY DEFENSE. A defensive player may use his hands, arms, or body to
push, pull, or ward off offensive players:
(a) when he is defending himself against an obstructing opponent while attempting to reach the runner
(b) when an opponent is obviously attempting to block him
(c) in a personal attempt to reach a loose ball that has touched the ground during a backward pass, fumble, or kick
(d) during a forward pass that has crossed the neutral zone and has been touched by any player
Exceptions:
(1) An eligible receiver is considered to be an obstructing opponent only to a point five yards beyond the line of
scrimmage unless the player who receives the snap demonstrates no further intention to pass the ball (including
handing off the ball, pitching the ball, or moving out of the pocket). See 8-4-2–3 for rules applicable to Illegal Contact
with an eligible receiver.
(2) See 8-4-5 for rules applicable for an Illegal Cut Block against an eligible receiver.
RULE 12, SECTION 1 ARTICLE 6. DEFENSIVE HOLDING. It is a foul for defensive holding if:
(a) a defensive player tackles or holds any opponent other than a runner, except as permitted in Article 5

(b) during a punt, field goal attempt, or Try-kick attempt, B1 grabs and pulls an offensive player out of the way, allowing B2 to
shoot the gap (pull-and-shoot) in an attempt to block the kick, except if B1 is advancing toward the kicker

DaBruinz said:

My understanding is 2 points of contact other than a player's hands. So a knee and foot on the same leg would count, but ASF's feet were in the air..


ARTICLE 3. COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is
complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands

Now, the Any part of his body may indicate that you only need one, but we've seen catches called back for just one body part before.

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It sure looked like he completed the catch after the knee came back off the ground.

DaBruinz said:

My understanding is 2 points of contact other than a player's hands. So a knee and foot on the same leg would count, but ASF's feet were in the air..


ARTICLE 3. COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is
complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands

Now, the Any part of his body may indicate that you only need one, but we've seen catches called back for just one body part before.

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It's one.
As John madden used to say one knee equals 2 feet.

Tony2046 said:

I don't think it matters if he regained control before touching the ground because in order to reestablish control he would have to touch the ground. It would go back to the "make a football move" stuff. He landed out of bounds before making a football move.

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Control had to be re-established while in the field of play.. It's not a reception where as long as he has control after he lands, it's good.