Should we go all in for the next 2 years?

patsfaninpa · Feb 12, 2017

12Brady said:
All in huh? How about we just stay with whats worked for the last 16 years. Works so why change?

Because the reason we won the last two is only going to play 2-3 more years.

mgteich · Feb 12, 2017

patsbrasilpatriotas said:
They let Hicks walk and he got 5m per. They would (IMO) NEVER pay that much for Branch. Hicks walked and Vince got less than that. IMO it's gonna be a 3m + incentives deal. If they let Sheard and Bennett hit FA. They can pay Ryan as a #2CB i would offer him the same deal Rodgers- Cromartie got 7M + you can add a bunch of NLBTE incentives such as Pro Bowls. Butler Tender is 3.6-4M. And why would you tag HT for 14.5 if you can give him 13m and that's the top-paid deal for a LB. Why would he decline this deal?

So, you're in favor of letting all our free agents go, and try find bargains among the free agents of others. After all, we shouldn't pay too much for players who are more valuable to us than to anyone else.

AzPatsFan · Feb 12, 2017

patsfaninpa said:
I want to make all of the moves you mentioned. But, I want Butler on a longer deal because I don't want him to walk after 2017. I think there's enough money to do that and also keep Bennett and Harmon. We will improve by getting Gronk healthy and signing M. Floyd too. One yr prove it deal because of looming suspension. Trading Jimmy G should give us the flexibility to have an outstanding draft too. As I said, I don't need to go crazy on UFA's from other teams. Just keeping all of our own. I just can't see us winning once TB12 leaves for a while.

The Pats showed they could win 3 out of 4, .750, without Brady. Maybe not a Superbowl favorite without an effective Brady, but still close.

To me the ultimate insult to the League, and discouragement to their opponents, would be winning the Super Bowl the year AFTER Brady retired, to home or the reserve bench. It would also confirm BB's place in the heirarchy of winners.

QuantumMechanic · Feb 12, 2017

Ivan said:
Huh?

They didn't let Curtis Martin walk Parcells put a poison pill in the contract that prevented the Patriots from being able to match it, the practice was then outlawed.

True.
However, they played hardball with Martin after it was clear he was vastly outplaying his rookie contract. Renegotiate and the theft never happens.

Ivan · Feb 12, 2017

QuantumMechanic said:
True.
However, they played hardball with Martin after it was clear he was vastly outplaying his rookie contract. Renegotiate and the theft never happens.

I agree, Patcells did however put a poison pill in the deal that they couldn't match because it gave Martin the option to leave the following year at s huge price.

QuantumMechanic · Feb 12, 2017

Ivan said:
I agree, Patcells did however put a poison pill in the deal that they couldn't match because it gave Martin the option to leave the following year at s huge price.

Oh, I agree. Once that contract offer from the Jets came there was no way NE could match so no blame for not matching.

However, Martin was a generational talent that they should have been willing to renegotiate his chincy rookie deal for. Then the Jets never have the chance to make that offer.

patsbrasilpatriotas · Feb 12, 2017

mgteich said:
So, you're in favor of letting all our free agents go, and try find bargains among the free agents of others. After all, we shouldn't pay too much for players who are more valuable to us than to anyone else.

No. I stated a fact: Hicks got 5m per and they let him walk. Hicks is younger and was productive for us. Why would you pay Branch 20% more, and almost 2x what he got last year?

I have my priorities:

HT - 13m
Butler - 12.5m
Branch - 4m
Ryan - 6.5m
Harmon - 4.5m

And the reason that i let Bennett and Sheard out of that list is because Bennett said that he wanted to be overpaid. I would never pay more then 8m for Bennett. Reason 1 is that he won't get many touches because Gronk is our main target after Edelman. Reason 2 is that this year draft is loaded. TE; CB and RB we can double-dip ( not CB). Same reasons for Sheard. Plus he was not very productive. 5 sacks is a very pedestrian stat. And we will get to com picks for them.

mgteich · Feb 12, 2017

patsbrasilpatriotas said:
No. I stated a fact: Hicks got 5m per and they let him walk. Hicks is younger and was productive for us. Why would you pay Branch 20% more, and almost 2x what he got last year?

I have my priorities:

HT - 13m
Butler - 12.5m
Branch - 4m
Ryan - 6.5m
Harmon - 4.5m

And the reason that i let Bennett and Sheard out of that list is because Bennett said that he wanted to be overpaid. I would never pay more then 8m for Bennett. Reason 1 is that he won't get many touches because Gronk is our main target after Edelman. Reason 2 is that this year draft is loaded. TE; CB and RB we can double-dip ( not CB). Same reasons for Sheard. Plus he was not very productive. 5 sacks is a very pedestrian stat. And we will get to com picks for them.

mgteich · Feb 12, 2017

Why would I pay Branch more than Hicks? After all, that's not fair!

I think that compensation is about expected value to the team, and market. Branch was our best interior lineman last year. If Belichick believes that Branch can be expected to perform at this level again, then he will be paid appropriately. Personally, I don't think that belichick will consider what he was willing to pay Hicks.

And, I suspect that we'll both be satisfied since we will likely get Branch for a 2017 $4M cap hit.
=====

With regard to Ryan and Harmon, I'd like to get them to take your under market contracts, but I think that Belichick will pay more if necessary. I don't see Butler getting a long-term deal until next off-season.

Your max prices would result in us having
CB: Butler (in his contract year), Rowe, Jones, Jones and Coleman
S: McCourty, Chung, Richards and Ebner

We would need to be in the free agent market for corners and safeties. I have NO REASON to that the market will produce better options than Ryan and Harmon.
Counting on picking up another Rowe would represent poor planning. Obviously, Belichick will take his flyers, some of which will succeed.

Should we go all in for the next 2 years?

patsfaninpa

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

mgteich

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AzPatsFan

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

QuantumMechanic

Burn it all down!

Ivan

Hall of Fame Poster

QuantumMechanic

Burn it all down!

patsbrasilpatriotas

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mgteich

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mgteich

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