Troubles in Camp Green

bradmahn · Jul 29, 2007

????? said:
Dyson - Good solid #1
Barret - was a very good #2 pre-injury, depends on how he has recovered. (looks very good in camp)
Revis - wouldnt feel comfortable with him starting as he's a no show in camp and has 0 NFL experience, could be great in the slot though.
Poteat - very useful player IMO and think he is very underated.
Miller - Lets just avoid him for now.

Kind of silly to exclude Samuel from the comparisons because he hasn't shown up to camp and yet include Revis.

????? · Jul 29, 2007

Its not like he's a 7 or 8 year vet who's been an ALL-PRO or something.

Yes he is an all-pro and a damn good LB too.

Kind of silly to exclude Samuel from the comparisons because he hasn't shown up to camp and yet include Revis

revis hasent came out and publicly said he wont play. samuel has.

Harris can't be an upgrade unless you consider Barton to be utterly worthless and dead. Harris is an unknown. Completely and totally. He's also not played in a 3-4. Michigan ran a 4-3 last year.

OH, if Barton was SO BAD, how is it that he had 100 tackles for the Jets last year as well as 3 tackles for loss and a forced fumble?

No but Harris is a MLB, Barton isnt. He also fits the 3-4 Defence perfectly physically. Read scouting reports on him, they do mention he'd be better suited fo a 3-4.
If there was a stat for how many times a player was blocked out of the play Id say Barton would be pretty high on that too.

Considering how ignorant you are, I doubt that there are flaws. But go ahead Troll boy. I enjoy playing with ignorant tools like yourself.

Please stop calling me ignorant and trying to make this personal, I though we were having a reasonable debate.

PonyExpress · Jul 29, 2007

?????,
I have no problem with a fan of another team stirring things up, or having a sig that pokes fun at the Pats. It's all part of being a fan. However, your sig,
showing a patriot burned to a crisp by what appears to be a bomb, resonates beyond football and I kindly ask you to remove it, in the spirit of good sportsmanship.
Thank you.

????? · Jul 29, 2007

PonyExpress said:
?????,
I have no problem with a fan of another team stirring things up, or having a sig that pokes fun at the Pats. It's all part of being a fan. However, your sig,
showing a patriot burned to a crisp by what appears to be a bomb, resonates beyond football and I kindly ask you to remove it, in the spirit of good sportsmanship.
Thank you.

fair enough, though it was funny though, will change it now.

Thanks for being mature about it though.

JoeSixPat · Jul 29, 2007

????? said:
Our camps actually going great.

Just cos Revis hasnt signed doesnt mean that our camp is in a shambles.

It's never a good thing when a coach begins to think his spin doctors are actually correct.

profootballtalk.com said:
POSTED 12:00 p.m. EDT; UPDATED 12:08 p.m. EDT, July 28, 2007

MANGENIUS LABEL GOING TO ERIC'S HEAD?

We love guys who think they're smarter than everyone else. Because it's guys like that who inevitably will provide proof that they definitely are not.

The latest man to wear the "everyone else is stupid" crown is Jets coach Eric Mangini, who is playing dumb about the circumstances that resulted in disgruntled offensive lineman Pete Kendall being assigned to the rookie dorm.

Look, we think Kendall is handling with contract dispute with the team poorly, but the idea that the decision to relegate a 12-year veteran to living with the youngsters was a mistake is a joke.

"I heard about the rookie dorm," Mangini said. "There is no conspiracy theory, no grassy knoll, no secret agents. It was a mix-up, it has been changed. There are guys in all different dorms. They're 100 feet apart."

Said Kendall: "To me, it speaks volumes about what the atmosphere must be like if someone in the organization must have thought it would put them in good graces with the head coach and G.M. to turn the screw just a little bit."

We think Kendall is underestimating Mangini's reach. Based on what we know of him, we think that Mangini was directly involved in the decision.

And we've got no problem with the Jets sending Kendall a message. The thing that bothers us is the attempt to make it look like an accident.

Meanwhile, Kendall has been relegated to the second team in practice sessions. We suppose that was an accident, too.

Seymour93 · Jul 30, 2007

PatsFan37 said:
Steelers linebacker Lawrence Timmons, the 15th pick in April, signed a four-year deal that guarantees him $8,053,000 in bonus money and could be worth as much as $15 million.

Woaaaa... how did Pittsburgh let Timmons sign for just four years?

spacecrime · Jul 30, 2007

Seymour93 said:
Woaaaa... how did Pittsburgh let Timmons sign for just four years?

That was my first thought. Not that I care if they are dumb, but the advantage of rookies is that after you pay the signing bonus, they are relatively cheap compared to their second contract or to FA veterans, and very cheap compared to the franchise tag.

If we had signed Branch to a four-year deal instead of a five-year deal, we would not have Meriweather. Even if Branch did cause a ruckus about the fifth year after the fact, it was worth the five-year deal in my opinion, just to have Meriweather on board.

PatsFan37 · Jul 30, 2007

Seymour93 said:
Woaaaa... how did Pittsburgh let Timmons sign for just four years?

And doesn't that just ratchet the pressure on the Jets who are trying to get a six-year deal. Shades of Watson.

As far as this thread goes, I'm surprised (though I shouldn't be) that a Jets troll would jump in and start arguing. The thread quoted statements of fact from nfl.com about current negotiations. No opinions, here, just facts and a little humor about how Mangini is making himself into a maxi-me of Belichick without the gravitas.

Flying Fungi · Jul 30, 2007

PatsFan37 said:
And doesn't that just ratchet the pressure on the Jets who are trying to get a six-year deal. Shades of Watson.

As far as this thread goes, I'm surprised (though I shouldn't be) that a Jets troll would jump in and start arguing. The thread quoted statements of fact from nfl.com about current negotiations. No opinions, here, just facts and a little humor about how Mangini is making himself into a maxi-me of Belichick without the gravitas.

if i understand correctly, the maximum is 5 years for that pick, but less than 5 years is acceptable, whereas more than 5 years is not allowed by the CBA...

tatepatsfan · Jul 30, 2007

I believe (could be wrong though) that for the first half of the first round, the max deal is 6 years. Timmons would fit in this category as he was picked at #15, so while many players in the top half of the 1st have signed 5 year deals, a 4 year deal definitely seems strange.

NE39 · Jul 30, 2007

This Kendall thing is getting pretty funny. First he says the only reason he came to camp is to avoid the daily fines, now he is saying that Mangini told him he is unhappy with his contract as well:

NY Daily News said:
Disgruntled guard Pete Kendall spent 90 minutes in the principal's office Saturday night, meeting with Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum. If Tannenbaum asked him to stop ripping the organization, it didn't work...

Later, speaking to the Daily News, he hinted that Eric Mangini conveyed frustration with his own contract situation during a private meeting in March.

"He told me a lot of things (in confidence)," said Kendall, who sat out yesterday's afternoon session with an apparent leg injury that doesn't appear serious. "He sounded empathetic to my situation. I don't want to go much further than that right now."

Asked specifically if Mangini mentioned his own contract situation, Kendall replied, "He said he understands how players have it, and that he's had frustrations." He declined to elaborate.

Mangini is in the second season of a four-year, $7 million contract from the Jets. His predecessor, Herm Edwards, received a new contract after making the playoffs in his first season. When Mangini made the playoffs last season, it fueled speculation that owner Woody Johnson, following the Edwards precedent, would give his coach a new deal. But it's believed that Mangini still has his original contract, making him one of the lowest-paid coaches in the NFL.

Asked about Kendall's intimation, Mangini, through a team spokesman, said, "There's nothing to it."

JaredOfNazareth · Jul 30, 2007

Actually according to Sagarin the jets had the 8th most difficult schedule. The Pats had the 4th most difficult.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/nfl06.htm

---------------------------SCHEDL (RANK)
2 ----New England Patriots = 22.82 (4)
7 -----------New York Jets = 21.91 (8)

Sundayjack · Jul 30, 2007

NE39 said:
This Kendall thing is getting pretty funny. First he says the only reason he came to camp is to avoid the daily fines, now he is saying that Mangini told him he is unhappy with his contract as well:

I find Pete Kendall's conduct. . . . unsettling. I expect better character out of former Eagles.

First, he was Denny Green's team example in Arizona, when he squealed to the NFLPA about tough OTAs, and was released at the start of training camp. Now, he's decided that the best way to negotiate a new contract is to shoot up the joint. This is akin to Deion Branch's situation last year, except that it was Deion's agent who was the mouthy one. Here, it's the player. Strange. And, as I said, unsettling.

Jacky Roberts · Jul 30, 2007

Kendall has been a big mouth since his days at BC. I do think he gets released. The Revis thing is intriguing as is the Houston thing. I dont think Mangini is going to get the free ride this year when the struggle.

VJCPatriot · Jul 30, 2007

Flying Fungi said:
if i understand correctly, the maximum is 5 years for that pick, but less than 5 years is acceptable, whereas more than 5 years is not allowed by the CBA...

Yup. 1st round picks can be signed to 5 year deals. 2nd round picks up to 4 years. That extra year of controlled price service is valuable to teams. My guess is that the Jets want 5 years and Revis camp wants a 4 year deal.

Pennington may have a noodle arm but he has been effective when healthy.
Thomas is an upgrade for them over the ancient and now retired Curtis Martin.
The AFC however is a tough division. The Jets might improve but that may not translate to the record books.

Jets will probably end up 9-7 and 2nd place in the division.
Miami looks even more horrible.
The Bills... who knows what they are thinking trading away their best RB and losing their best corner to free agency.

Underoath · Jul 30, 2007

revis hasent came out and publicly said he wont play. samuel has.

Uhhh, no he hasn't...

Dude face it. The Jets are going to come in second place this year. Probably at like 7-9, so maybe third actually. But idk who's worse, the Dolphins or the Jets, it'll be fun for you guys to watch while the Patriots are going 12-4 or 11-5 with the hardest schedule in the NFL.

PatsFan37 · Jul 30, 2007

VJCPatriot said:
Yup. 1st round picks can be signed to 5 year deals. 2nd round picks up to 4 years. That extra year of controlled price service is valuable to teams. My guess is that the Jets want 5 years and Revis camp wants a 4 year deal.

This is how bad information becomes popular knowledge, so let's nip this in the bud. First round picks are divided into two groups where the top group can be signed for a maximum of six years and the bottom group for a max of five.

I believe the groups are divided between the 16th and 17th picks, but I'm not certain about that.

If you follow the link in the first post, the full article doesn't state what the Jets want vs. what Revis wants and the only assumption we can make is that they differ.

VJCPatriot · Jul 30, 2007

PatsFan37 said:
This is how bad information becomes popular knowledge, so let's nip this in the bud. First round picks are divided into two groups where the top group can be signed for a maximum of six years and the bottom group for a max of five.

I believe the groups are divided between the 16th and 17th picks, but I'm not certain about that.

If you follow the link in the first post, the full article doesn't state what the Jets want vs. what Revis wants and the only assumption we can make is that they differ.

Ok that's true, the 1st half of the 1st round can be signed an extra year longer. But one can assume based on controlled money that the Jets would want the longer contract and Revis camp would want the shorter contract so he could hit free agency sooner.

ctpatsfan77 · Jul 30, 2007

VJCPatriot said:
Ok that's true, the 1st half of the 1st round can be signed an extra year longer. But one can assume based on controlled money that the Jets would want the longer contract and Revis camp would want the shorter contract so he could hit free agency sooner.

And now, PFT is suggesting the possibility that Revis might sit the year out entirely and re-enter the draft in 2008. . . . as one of his relatives did before.

It would be hilarious if the JEST gave up three draft picks, and then got absolutely nothing in return.

Sundayjack · Jul 30, 2007

I think one of the under-appreciated wildcards in this drama is the Neil Schwartz connection.

Revis’ agent, Neil Schwartz, also represents Pete Kendall, who is engaged in a bitter dispute with the Jets. You’re probably wondering if the bad blood from the Kendall situation is affecting the Revis talks. That question was posed to GM Mike Tannenbaum at last month’s minicamp, and this is what he said:

"Darrelle Revis was the 14th pick in the draft and I’ve been negotiating contracts long enough to know that he’s going to get less than the 13th picks and more than the 15th pick in the draft. It doesn’t matter if Scott Boras, Arn Tellem or Neil Schwartz represents him."

It's that last Tannenbaum sentence that particularly concerns me. Tells me that this has become a battle of personalities.

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/jets/

Troubles in Camp Green

In the Starting Line-Up

Practice Squad Player

In the Starting Line-Up

Practice Squad Player

Pro Bowl Player

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

2nd Team Getting Their First Start

In the Starting Line-Up

Third String But Playing on Special Teams

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

On the Game Day Roster

On the Game Day Roster

2nd Team Getting Their First Start

Pro Bowl Player

On the Game Day Roster

2nd Team Getting Their First Start

Pro Bowl Player

PatsFans.com Supporter

On the Game Day Roster

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