A Case For A Return To The 2-TE Offense

martellus bennett might get cut

AndyJohnson said:

But the offense that creates the mismatch is not really 2 TEs, its a TE and a hybrid TE/SlotWR/HBack.
There are not many of those in the league.

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I didn't consider Hernandez a slot WR and neither did the Patriots.

If you read the snippet from Bedard, They consider him an "F" tight end, aka flex TE or move TE. In the past, a lot of these guys would be considered tweeners. Too slow to play WR, too small to play traditional TE.

Ideally, i want a carbon copy of Hernandez. I agree these types of guys don't grow on trees, but there are a good number of guys out there to be had.

Guys like Charles Clay, Delanie Walker, Zach Ertz, Ladarius Green, Gavin Escobar, Mychal Rivera, Jordan Cameron all possess a lot of the traits you look for in an Aaron Hernandez replacement. Guys who are more dynamic in the passing game and just good enough as a blocker. Guys who can create the mismatch like Hernandez did.

You've also got guys that are in between the Gronk types and Hernandez types, like Dwayne Allen or maybe even a Virgil Green, who is a better blocker than Hernandez was but is less dynamic in the passing game. He won't be able to create the same one on one mismatch as a guy with the speed of Hernandez can, but he will be more effective in the running game, in pass protection, and still enable you to create formation mismatches IMO. A guy like that might not be able to roast LB's as well as Hernandez can, but if a defense is committing it's best defenders to Gronk and Edelman and leaves a lower level defender on Allen or underestimates Allen as just a blocker, Allen has the requisite skillset to expose that defense. So although this type of TE doesn't help you in the exact same way, he still contributes effectively in an all around way.

These guys are available, the problem is price. When these guys hit the free agent market, they are paid like #1 tight ends because coordinators salivate at the matchup mismatches they can create and overlook the blocking deficiencies. Such as Charles Clay last year.

That's why it seemingly needs to be addressed with devalued/bargain free agents or in the draft, such as in rounds 2 through 5 where a ton of good tight ends have gone in recent years, so the cost is well controlled and not outrageous. We can't just go out there and give a guy like Julius Thomas 9 million a year. Hence, a guy like Ladarius Green may be out of our price range.

The suggestions like Dwayne Allen and Jordan Cameron in free agency are shrewd, as they come with their injury/production issues and may be undervalued on the open market -- a prime opportunity for the Pats to pounce to get an above average talent that could flourish in this offense on a bargain contract.

If you want to go the draft route, I'm fine with that too, although it may be a little more risky as it's more of a projection from college. I had a post the other day about the success of drafting tight ends in the middle rounds, so there are definitely guys to be had. I'm not entrenched in the draft stuff yet, so I have no idea if there are a lot of guys available this year.

Gronkowski123 said:

martellus bennett might get cut

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Another guy I'd be interested in as well. Playmaker in the passing game and a pretty good blocker as well.

He has been making noise about his contract in Chicago though over the last year, so he may be looking to just go to the highest bidder.

AndyJohnson said:

Chandlers last 3 season in Buff were 655,571,497 yards

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That...is a lot of Yards.

Sign the Beast.

supafly said:

Yes, without a doubt. The number one question that we have to ask ourselves is "why" we don't use that formation more, and the easy answer would be lack of adequate personnel.

Wright couldn't block for anything, and Chandler couldn't really do anything all that well. Those types of players aren't going to allow us the opportunity to take advantage of mismatches, nor is the lack of a running game.

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I have never seen a softer 6'8" man.

Snake Eyes said:

Would Marcel Reece qualify?

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Now that is an interesting and very nice outside the box idea. Color me highly intrigued. That guy is the definition of electricity and power packed into one body. He was always my fullback in Madden because of how fast and powerful He was while also being able to catch the ball haha.

He got popped for PED's though right? I don't even care, I'd still take him lol.

For a team to have two elite TEs like we had with Aaron and Gronk is incredibly rare to replicate that will be very difficult. Aaron was also unique in that he was an athletically gifted TE who could play as a wideout on the line and he was even lined up as a rb in the flat. He was basically Jimmy Graham.

When I look at TEs there are maybe three players that you can shift anywhere on the field in Gronk, Graham and Reed. Graham and Reed are below average blockers and are basically wideouts. Kelce can block and runs good seam/out routes but his hands are just ok. I'm not sure where we can get this 2nd TE?

SalemPats said:

For a team to have two elite TEs like we had with Aaron and Gronk is incredibly rare to replicate that will be very difficult. Aaron was also unique in that he was an athletically gifted TE who could play as a wideout on the line and he was even lined up as a rb in the flat. He was basically Jimmy Graham.

When I look at TEs there are maybe three players that you can shift anywhere on the field in Gronk, Graham and Reed. Graham and Reed are below average blockers and are basically wideouts. Kelce can block and runs good seam/out routes but his hands are just ok. I'm not sure where we can get this 2nd TE?

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I expect this type of TE to be a below average blocker. He needs to be just good enough as a blocker to help out. He needs to ideally be more of a dynamic pass catcher with speed. Those guys are typically smaller/shiftier/faster like Hernandez was.

It's not easy to find a replacement but it's not impossible. Obviously we're not going to go out and throw 8-10 million dollars at guys like Julius Thomas or Charles Clay. That's why we've been talking about finding guys in the bargain bin in free agency. Guys who have the skill set but are devalued due to injury or production.

Or you can go the draft route. People seem to think it's impossible to find a guy comparable to Hernandez, but if you look back at the last few years, it's really not. It's not like these guys are all first round picks. A ton of them are available in the middle rounds of the draft, possibly because of questions surrounding how their skill set projects to the pro level

Jordan Reed and Travis Kelce were third round picks.

Charles Clay and Delanie Walker were sixth round picks.

Zach Ertz was a second round pick.

Ladarius Green, Jordan Cameron, and Julius Thomas were all fourth round picks.

These guys are there to be had. It's not like you're investing a ton of draft capital on them. I'd much rather spend a third or fourth round pick on a TE with that type of skill set than draft special teams players as Bill sometimes chooses to do.

BillBelichickFan79 said:

I expect this type of TE to be a below average blocker. He needs to be just good enough as a blocker to help out. He needs to ideally be more of a dynamic pass catcher with speed. Those guys are typically smaller/shiftier/faster like Hernandez was.

It's not easy to find a replacement but it's not impossible. Obviously we're not going to go out and throw 8-10 million dollars at guys like Julius Thomas or Charles Clay. That's why we've been talking about finding guys in the bargain bin in free agency. Guys who have the skill set but are devalued due to injury or production.

Or you can go the draft route. People seem to think it's impossible to find a guy comparable to Hernandez, but if you look back at the last few years, it's really not. It's not like these guys are all first round picks. A ton of them are available in the middle rounds of the draft, possibly because of questions surrounding how their skill set projects to the pro level

Jordan Reed and Travis Kelce were third round picks.

Charles Clay and Delanie Walker were sixth round picks.

Zach Ertz was a second round pick.

Ladarius Green, Jordan Cameron, and Julius Thomas were all fourth round picks.

These guys are there to be had. It's not like you're investing a ton of draft capital on them. I'd much rather spend a third or fourth round pick on a TE with that type of skill set than draft special teams players as Bill sometimes chooses to do.

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I think what i would rather have is a TE who can block and catch passes down the seam giving us flexibility to go with 2 TEs on the line or flex Gronk to the outside and still have a blocking TE who can get those short passes. I would love a healthy D Allen type/

SalemPats said:

I think what i would rather have is a TE who can block and catch passes down the seam giving us flexibility to go with 2 TEs on the line or flex Gronk to the outside and still have a blocking TE who can get those short passes. I would love a healthy D Allen type/

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Agree, I'd welcome that Dwayne Allen type as well.

There's a trade off either way.

You get a Dwayne Allen type and you'll be better off in terms of run blocking and pass protection but will have times where he finds it harder to get open in the passing game.

You get a Hernandez type and you'll have a guy that's consistently dynamic in the passing game but will be more of a liability in pass pro/run blocking.

It's really a matter of which you prefer. I'm fine with either one, but may lean slightly towards the Hernandez type because we saw first hand how dynamic it was here and because I believe the passing game is more critical in winning championships in the modern day NFL.