Why Pats-Jets trade won't fly

broadwayjoe · Jun 12, 2007

Hell will freeze over before the Patriots allow holdout, franchised corner Asante Samuel to bolt to the Jets - unless New York is willing to part with two first-round draft choices. Of course, it will also take hell freezing over before Eric Mangini gives Bill Belichick and Scott Pioli two first-rounders.

Potential for Patriots-Vikings trade

Posted: Tuesday June 12, 2007 10:14AM ET

If the Vikings trade outspoken cornerback Antoine Winfield, the Patriots, who have two first-round draft picks next spring, would seem a logical destination.

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/nfl#

I believe someone mentioned this earlier about an Antoine Winfield scenario just thought this was interesting to see it come up again.

Va_Pats_Fan · Jun 12, 2007

I'd take Winfield and a 1 for AS...

spacecrime · Jun 12, 2007

Va_Pats_Fan said:
I'd take Winfield and a 1 for AS...

Except that Winfield is the better CB, so the trade would be Asante and a 1 for Winfield.

Va_Pats_Fan · Jun 12, 2007

spacecrime said:
Except that Winfield is the better CB, so the trade would be Asante and a 1 for Winfield.

we could always try

37Harrison · Jun 12, 2007

I'd take that trade especially since that would get Asante out of the AFC.

Water Boy · Jun 12, 2007

broadwayjoe said:
Hell will freeze over before the Patriots allow holdout, franchised corner Asante Samuel to bolt to the Jets - unless New York is willing to part with two first-round draft choices. Of course, it will also take hell freezing over before Eric Mangini gives Bill Belichick and Scott Pioli two first-rounders.

Potential for Patriots-Vikings trade

Posted: Tuesday June 12, 2007 10:14AM ET

If the Vikings trade outspoken cornerback Antoine Winfield, the Patriots, who have two first-round draft picks next spring, would seem a logical destination.

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/nfl#

I believe someone mentioned this earlier about an Antoine Winfield scenario just thought this was interesting to see it come up again.

Anyone know what Winfield's current contract status is?

letekro · Jun 12, 2007

Why can't we just keep him, pay him the prorated portion of his salary, and have him for the stretch run and the playoffs? Would his holdout be more of a distraction than trying to find someone to step up (or in) and fill his shoes? Maybe, but I think this is probably the best option as far as this year is concerned. And it works well going forward as well, as we already have the ammo to draft our LCB of the future next year.

Patsfanin Philly · Jun 12, 2007

kurtinelson said:
Anyone know what Winfield's current contract status is?

2007 $4.9 mill
2008 $5.6
2009 $6.0
He is entering year 4 of a 6 year $34.8 million contract with $10.8 guaranteed, most of it having been paid in signing bonuses...

http://www.nflpa.org/Resources/ActivePlayerSearch.aspx?id=27035
----------------------
http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/numbers.asp
Oh and the Vikings have plenty of cap space to sign Assante.....
How about a straight up trade??Each team gets rid of a "problem" without weakening themselves.......
For the Vikings, they could lock up AS for more than the 3 that Winfield is signed for and the Pats could
get a guy signed for three more years who already got his big contract and appears to 'just want to win'

Born_a_Patriot · Jun 12, 2007

Send him to the NY Giants. That will really Kill the Jets. So close yet so far.

Va_Pats_Fan · Jun 12, 2007

Patsfanin Philly said:
2007 $4.9 mill
2008 $5.6
2009 $6.0
He is entering year 4 of a 6 year $34.8 million contract with $10.8 guaranteed, most of it having been paid in signing bonuses...

http://www.nflpa.org/Resources/ActivePlayerSearch.aspx?id=27035

I'd take a 3 year flyer on those #'s

patsgo · Jun 12, 2007

Va_Pats_Fan said:
I'd take a 3 year flyer on those #'s

ya it sure beats 80 million or whatever he wants id to it strait up and wouldnt think twice winfield is better than samuel

BelichickFan · Jun 12, 2007

spacecrime said:
Except that Winfield is the better CB, so the trade would be Asante and a 1 for Winfield.

Winfield is also older - given that Samuel's value is at least a #1, that would be two #1s for Winfield which isn't happening. Winfield turns 30 in a few weeks, we wouldn't trade a single #1 for him.

Patriotic Fervor · Jun 12, 2007

Born_a_Patriot said:
Send him to the NY Giants. That will really Kill the Jets. So close yet so far.

Oooooo, I like it! How do you think the media would play that one up?

theONLYJerseypatsfan · Jun 12, 2007

Samuel will be playing week 1......everyone is just showing who has the biggest you know what right now

Flying Fungi · Jun 12, 2007

theONLYJerseypatsfan said:
Samuel will be playing week 1......everyone is just showing who has the biggest you know what right now

disagree

Asante saw what the Seahawks gave Branch and what the Patriots would not give Branch. He has his rings and based upon the Patriots initial offer, a baseline for his next contract.

I see zero logic to support the belief that Asante Samuel will sign the current Patriots offer.

BelichickFan · Jun 12, 2007

Flying Fungi said:
I see zero logic to support the belief that Asante Samuel will sign the current Patriots offer.

Well one piece of logic is that the Patriots can Franchise him again next year and trade him. If we traded him right now "all" we would get, most likely, is a 2008 pick - which is the same as we'd get in February if he say out this year.

So an argument can be made that by sitting out this year Samuel will cost himself $8M that he'll never get back but the Patriots aren't forced to trade him now becuase they can just as well trade him after the season (an argument can be made his trade value is higher now but who knows). If we couldn't Franchise him again it would be different as he'd know we'd have to trade him or get nothing.

Va_Pats_Fan · Jun 12, 2007

BelichickFan said:
Well one piece of logic is that the Patriots can Franchise him again next year and trade him. If we traded him right now "all" we would get, most likely, is a 2008 pick - which is the same as we'd get in February if he say out this year.

So an argument can be made that by sitting out this year Samuel will cost himself $8M that he'll never get back but the Patriots aren't forced to trade him now becuase they can just as well trade him after the season (an argument can be made his trade value is higher now but who knows). If we couldn't Franchise him again it would be different as he'd know we'd have to trade him or get nothing.

If he sits out the whole year, we can still franchise him 2 more times. He would come back in week 10 just to prevent that situation.

BelichickFan · Jun 12, 2007

Va_Pats_Fan said:
If he sits out the whole year, we can still franchise him 2 more times. He would come back in week 10 just to prevent that situation.

Which adds to my point even more - I've not been sure if the Week 10 accrued year think applies in this situation or not.

Va_Pats_Fan · Jun 12, 2007

BelichickFan said:
Which adds to my point even more - I've not been sure if the Week 10 accrued year think applies in this situation or not.

yes, thats the latest he can leave it, and still count towards the franchise tag as 1 of the 2 years.

DaBruinz · Jun 12, 2007

Flying Fungi said:
disagree

Asante saw what the Seahawks gave Branch and what the Patriots would not give Branch. He has his rings and based upon the Patriots initial offer, a baseline for his next contract.

I see zero logic to support the belief that Asante Samuel will sign the current Patriots offer.

I can give you 4.8 million reasons as to why Samuel would sign the current Franchise offer. I could give you some $30 million reasons why Samuel should have signed the Pats long term offer that they gave him.

Unfortunately, greed isn't logical. And that is what the Pats are facing with Samuel. A guy who has a tattoo that says something to the effect of "Get Paid". Well, I have news for Asante, $30 million is more than a generous offer over 5 years for a guy who has been a tremendous beneficiary to this defense. As others have pointed out, Samuel was actually the #1 corner until Hobbs hurt his wrist last season.

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