Zoltan to Steelers

DaBruinz said:

We're going to regret letting Zoltan go..

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There was no guarantee that he wouldn't have been gone next year anyways, since his rookie deal would have expired and he'd be a free agent.

ewg_gestalt said:

There was no guarantee that he wouldn't have been gone next year anyways, since his rookie deal would have expired and he'd be a free agent.

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I wonder how much Vinatieri v. Gould weighed on BB's mind here.

Of course, if I were Allen, I wouldn't plan on setting down roots here. . . .

RobAllan said:

This sucks.

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people need to get over mesko. he's a nice guy but the better punter is on the patriots.

TommyBrady12 said:

people need to get over mesko. he's a nice guy but the better punter is on the patriots.

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I don't think Allen proved himself better (or worse).

In particular, I'm concerned about his relative lack of holding as well as that rather ugly outkicking-the-coverage kick he had early in the preseason.

that didn't take long. :snob:

People, Zoltan was a very nice guy with a cool name but we are talking about a punter here. I am confident this is not a move the Pats are going to regret. We aren't the friggen Jags for crying out loud.

So much for the "see, nobody even claimed any of the Pats' cuts!" brigade.

This happened to be a funny year when a lot of their bubble players were vested vets and/or had significant contracts that made them unattractive waiver pickups. I'm betting on Fells and Washington also getting signed somewhere after game 1 to avoid contract guarantees.

At least it wasn't the Giants or Jets!

ewg_gestalt said:

There was no guarantee that he wouldn't have been gone next year anyways, since his rookie deal would have expired and he'd be a free agent.

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That has no bearing on my statement.

37Harrison said:

People, Zoltan was a very nice guy with a cool name but we are talking about a punter here. I am confident this is not a move the Pats are going to regret. We aren't the friggen Jags for crying out loud.

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People who don't understand the value of a good punter are ignoring a very important part of the game.

TommyBrady12 said:

people need to get over mesko. he's a nice guy but the better punter is on the patriots.

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Really? How do you know that? Please show me Allen's stats that PROVE what you just stated. OH. You can't. Because Allen has proven nothing in the NFL.

I have news for you. Allen was badly out-kicking the coverage. And it will lead to longer returns and better field position for the opposition. That will result in more pressure on the defense.

ewg_gestalt said:

There was no guarantee that he wouldn't have been gone next year anyways, since his rookie deal would have expired and he'd be a free agent.

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That doesn't mean you just downgrade a position for one year. Allen had to have showed BB something to think that we won't miss Mesko's stability much. I think it's a risk personally and not a fan of the switch, if it ain't broke don't try to fix it. But we'll see how it unfolds.

ctpatsfan77 said:

I don't think Allen proved himself better (or worse).

In particular, I'm concerned about his relative lack of holding as well as that rather ugly outkicking-the-coverage kick he had early in the preseason.

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I think the concern was that Allen wasn't going to make it to the PS, and that they weren't going to stumble across a 2 time Ray Guy award winner again next season when Mesko's pact was up when there was a good possibility that we'd lose him.

On top of that you know the financial implications much better than most, so I would greatly assume that the opportunity to save money both now and in the future came into play--just the same as any other personnel decision.

I'm sure there will be some growing pains for some part of his rookie year, but he may have the upside to be better and cheaper than Mesko, who definitely served his purpose nicely while here.

37Harrison said:

People, Zoltan was a very nice guy with a cool name but we are talking about a punter here. I am confident this is not a move the Pats are going to regret. We aren't the friggen Jags for crying out loud.

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We may be 4 time SB champs right now if the Giants punter wasn't able to pin us inside the 5 on multiple occasions (one led to a safety, one was on our last real possession where 10-15 extra yards from where the drive stalled puts us in FG range). That's just one example of how having a good punter vs. a crap punter can change a game. If Allen turns out to be more like Chris Hanson than like Mesko it could have a huge impact on some of these close games. Punters are very relevant in this game.

I think Mesko is the superior punter right now, but economics are certainly the deciding factor here. Mesko was slated to earn $1.323m this year. But that is not the real issue. Based on the most recent two punters to sign new deals, the average price for a top punter (and I believe Mesko qualifies) is a little under $4m a year. No way the Pats would shell out anything near that, and I wouldn't blame Mesko for looking for it.

By comparison, here are the salaries for Ryan Allen:

Ryan Allen:
2013 - $405,000
2014 - $495,000
2015 - $585,000
2016 - (RFA Tender?)

In summary, the Pats probably felt that a two-time Ray Guy Award winner at UDFA money for three years is a viable risk/reward given that Mesko would probably walk next year. Sure, it is a gamble but the kind of gamble that BB takes to keep he team on top for so long.

PATSYLICIOUS said:

If Allen turns out to be more like Chris Hanson than like Mesko it could have a huge impact on some of these close games. Punters are very relevant in this game.

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I fully agree with you that punters should not be tossed to the side like they are irrelevant. No way.

That said, we did end up with a 2 time Ray Guy award winner for the nation's best punter in college, so it's not like we're going back to Chris Hanson.

They were able to save 1 million dollars towards the cap this year and must have felt as though the odds weren't too good that they'd be able to retain Mesko again in the offseason when his pact was up.

If they had any chance whatsoever of attempting to retain Mesko, they'd have had to shell out a couple or even a few million per year (in comparison to the top punters in the NFL). There's no way that was going to happen.

Lamanai said:

I think Mesko is the superior punter right now, but economics are certainly the deciding factor here. Mesko was slated to earn $1.323m this year. But that is not the real issue. Based on the most recent two punters to sign new deals, the average price for a top punter (and I believe Mesko qualifies) is a little under $4m a year. No way the Pats would shell out anything near that, and I wouldn't blame Mesko for looking for it.

By comparison, here are the salaries for Ryan Allen:

Ryan Allen:
2013 - $405,000
2014 - $495,000
2015 - $585,000
2016 - (RFA Tender?)

In summary, the Pats probably felt that a two-time Ray Guy Award winner at UDFA money for three years is a viable risk/reward given that Mesko would probably walk next year. Sure, it is a gamble but the kind of gamble that BB takes to keep he team on top for so long.

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Excellent breakdown and great points made.

supafly said:

I think the concern was that Allen wasn't going to make it to the PS, and that they weren't going to stumble across a 2 time Ray Guy award winner again next season when Mesko's pact was up when there was a good possibility that we'd lose him.

On top of that you know the financial implications much better than most, so I would greatly assume that the opportunity to save money both now and in the future came into play--just the same as any other personnel decision.

I'm sure there will be some growing pains for some part of his rookie year, but he may have the upside to be better and cheaper than Mesko, who definitely served his purpose nicely while here.

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You'll forgive me if I could care less about the "Ray Guy" Award. There were 10 players who have won the award before Allen. Only 3 of those played in the NFL. Danield Sepulveda, Ryan Plackemeier, and Chas Henry. Sepulveda played for 4 seasons and Plackemeier for 3 and Henry just got cut by the Buccaneers after being cut by Philadeplhia.


Sepulveda had a avg of 43.7 with a net of 38.2. 81 of his 223 went inside the 20.
Plackemeier had an avg. of 42.2 with a net of 35.1. 72 of his 236 punts were inside the 20.
Henry has an average of 44 with a net of 37.6. 21 of his 82 punts were inside the 20.

Mesko had an avg of. 44.2 with a net of 39.5. 71 of his 175 punts were inside the 20.

I don't know what Allen will do. But, the fact that he won the Ray Guy award twice doesn't mean anything to me. In fact, it would make me more likely to be leary of him than to think it bodes well for him.

Good for Zoltan. Class organization, good head coach, nice rivalry to see him down the road.

I like this. Welker with Denver, Vinatieri in Indianapolis, Mesko in Pittsburgh.

Mesko was 28th in the league in punting average last year. 24th in Net avg.


http://http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/punting/sort/netAvgPuntYards

supafly said:

I fully agree with you that punters should not be tossed to the side like they are irrelevant. No way.

That said, we did end up with a 2 time Ray Guy award winner for the nation's best punter in college, so it's not like we're going back to Chris Hanson.

They were able to save 1 million dollars towards the cap this year and must have felt as though the odds weren't too good that they'd be able to retain Mesko again in the offseason when his pact was up.

If they had any chance whatsoever of attempting to retain Mesko, they'd have had to shell out a couple or even a few million per year (in comparison to the top punters in the NFL). There's no way that was going to happen.

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Like I said I hope the gamble pays off and I'm willing to give Allen a chance here. But at the time it is a risk until we see what Allen can do over the course of a season in the bigs. Mesko wasn't amazing but if we take a considerable hit in the punting game this year because we're worried about retaining him NEXT year it's a horrible miscue on BB's part because we did have a very solid guy for this season.