Wes Welker at 8 million per year for 5 years?

anotherbruschi said:

The $8 Million @ 5 years is a figure proposed by Ian Rapaport that "in my mind" would be enough to get a deal. There is no inside information concerning the terms of the contract.

Click to expand...

Seriously. It doesn't take much to get the media worked up and misinterpreting items. Here's what we do know:

1) Ian Rappaport and Albert Breer independently have separate sources which indicate that Welker's camp is talking with the Patriots, and each source indicates that there's enough common ground and sentiment that an extension might be reached before free agency.

2) Ian Rappaport admits he knows none of the specifics, and openly guesses on what he thinks the numbers would be that would satisfy Welker.

The only tangible fact here is #1, assuming those sources are correct. Although I do sometimes wonder if the Pats would be better off better served spending their limited cap dollars on defense and going with younger physical receivers on the outside, I would be very happy if the Pats and Welker could come to terms.

But #2 isn't a news story, it's speculation. I'm not going to get worked up over the dollar and year figures until we hear anything other than wild guesses.

Pats history suggests a signing bonus and a small quarantee, with the last two years possibly heavy on a per year basis, but with a get out of jail card for the Pats after year two or three.
Again, just speculation on my part. I doubt if this is going to be a cap killer contract in 3 to 5 years, or one that would even put the Pats in Cap hell like so many teams (Jets come to mind).

A.C Vegas said:

Deals like this are not strange to me and I think TB has had some say in this. I also think that they are planning to keep TB's favorite targets around untill he is ready to retire. There would obviously be an out clause and that deal would allow the Pats to contend for hte next 5 years and allow the FO to prepare to "reload" after TBs retirement

Click to expand...

Coaches coach and players play. Tom Brady has no say over personnel, including whether he will play "until HE is ready" to retire. Those decisions will be made for him.

Welker has been one of my favorite players since he got here. But like you say he has taken a TON of big hits, has the ACL repair, and is bound to start breaking down physically pretty fast in the next few years. I think anything longer than 3 years for welk would be kind of ridiculous. Lets face it ....the guy is going to continue to take massive shots based on the kind of routes he has run.....is already demonstrating the psychological "ghost" footsteps stuff because of all those spine seperating hits....and as a result has been dropping balls at key moments..that the younger welker never dropped. I think he has 2 REALLY good years left.....

tonyto3690 said:

The Patriots valued him at 2 years 8 million a year ago.

Giving him 5 years 8 million a year later is completely absurd, terrible negotiating, and way too big a commitment to a guy who takes the abuse he does every game at the age he is at.

Click to expand...

Two things:


Let the games(offseason) begin :rocker:

How can we all not be excited about this our biggest FA is being reported as likely back in the fold :singing: whatever the money is so be it he is one of the most productive players on the team and this allows to build and not replace. Great start to the offseason. Of course this is still far from a done deal but I will take it as a great sign.

letekro said:

Coaches coach and players play. Tom Brady has no say over personnel, including whether he will play "until HE is ready" to retire. Those decisions will be made for him.

Click to expand...

Everything is negotiable. For example, Brady could have just said, "Look, I have a choice to make...either sit tight with my current contract and then make about $25 million a year in my next contract, from you or someone else, or we can negotiate an extension at a huge discount for the Patriots that gives us the cap space to sign my buddy Wes. The deal is if I choose the latter, you sign Wes. If you don't wish to agree to these terms, that's fine...it's your choice as the boss. But then I have a choice to make too."

If he said that, do you really think BB wouldn't pay close attention and work with him?

tonyto3690 said:

The Patriots valued him at 2 years 8 million a year ago.

Giving him 5 years 8 million a year later is completely absurd, terrible negotiating, and way too big a commitment to a guy who takes the abuse he does every game at the age he is at.

Click to expand...

No, it's not completely absurd. What is absurd is people like yourself ignoring the fact that Welker could get 10-12Mil/yr for 3-4 years on the open market with ease. You also forget how dynamic a player Welker is. Yes, he is one piece of the puzzle, but a very valuable piece. And it allows the Pats to focus on other areas going into free agency and the draft.

For Welker I would go 3 years $24 million max with around $18 million guaranteed. Beyond that,I would pass.

ivanvamp said:

Everything is negotiable. For example, Brady could have just said, "Look, I have a choice to make...either sit tight with my current contract and then make about $25 million a year in my next contract, from you or someone else, or we can negotiate an extension at a huge discount for the Patriots that gives us the cap space to sign my buddy Wes. The deal is if I choose the latter, you sign Wes. If you don't wish to agree to these terms, that's fine...it's your choice as the boss. But then I have a choice to make too."

If he said that, do you really think BB wouldn't pay close attention and work with him?

Click to expand...

But then to get back, BB and Josh will sit Welker and start Edelman

Patriots and Welker discussing new contract

Per Rotoworld

According to the Boston Herald, Welker and Patriots are discussing a new contract.
A new deal does not "appear" to be imminent, though. Tom Brady's new three-year extension with the team has freed up $15 million in cap space over the next two seasons, leaving New England much more room to work with for locking up other key pieces. Welker, 32 in May, is expected to seek around $9 million annually on his next deal.

Click to expand...

Re: Patriots and Welker discussing new contract

Brady has said that working in the personnel dept is not in his job description, but I can't help
but wonder if there was some form of a wink-wink that the FO would put forth its best effort
to re-sign Welker in exchange for the extension.

There are only 3 numbers that matter in any NFL contract. The signing bonus, the guaranteed money and to a lesser extent the AAV. I don't know what it is that folks find so hard to grasp about NFL deals. They are never fully guaranteed (well, unless your name is Brady and you're taking half market value in the tradeoff...). You could sign Welker to a 15 year deal at $8M per and it wouldn't matter. All that matters is the guaranteed money...and how much of it you amortized in the form of signing bonus. Once is paid out the deal isn't worth the paper it's printed on from the players standpoint. Team can cut him at will. Rule of thumb is after 3 years you've taken the hit for 60% of any signing bonus (which is sunk cost, as opposed to future salary). So in year 4 or 5 teams who are not happy with a players production will either approach him to take a real paycut or cut him and absorb the dead cap while freeing space by not paying any more salary.

If it helps Wes' psyche to be signed to a $40M deal, who cares. He'll either earn it or he won't see much more than half of it... because his guaranteed money will be paid up within the first 2-3 years between signing bonus and salary.

Re: Patriots and Welker discussing new contract

KDPPatsfan85 said:

Per Rotoworld

Click to expand...

You don't say...Wonder where they heard that...

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...08-wes-welker-8-million-per-year-5-years.html

A.C Vegas said:

Deals like this are not strange to me and I think TB has had some say in this. I also think that they are planning to keep TB's favorite targets around untill he is ready to retire. There would obviously be an out clause and that deal would allow the Pats to contend for hte next 5 years and allow the FO to prepare to "reload" after TBs retirement

Click to expand...

I think, and this is based on no evidence, that a decent part of the extension for Brady was at least a handshake agreement that a good part of the cap savings would be made available for Welker's extension.

MoLewisrocks said:

There are only 3 numbers that matter in any NFL contract. The signing bonus, the guaranteed money and to a lesser extent the AAV.

Click to expand...

What is AAV? Is that related to the amortization or something else?

While the actual structure will determine how good a deal it is this is a great deal for the Patriots as they get one of the 2 most productive receivers in football for a fraction of the price. If they get it done Brady has his best weapon back for years to come. If true the Patriots are on the path to get better this poffseason, not worse, even though there are many in this forum who want them to do just that.

Ivan said:

While the actual structure will determine how good a deal it is this is a great deal for the Patriots as they get one of the 2 most productive receivers in football for a fraction of the price. If they get it done Brady has his best weapon back for years to come. If true the Patriots are on the path to get better this poffseason, not worse, even though there are many in this forum who want them to do just that.

Click to expand...

Come on. This type of hyperbole serves no purpose.

tonyto3690 said:

I will be horrified if that deal happens.

Anything more than two years is way too long.

Click to expand...

They should have signed Rondo, he's tall and he's fast.

JackBauer said:

Come on. This type of hyperbole serves no purpose.

Click to expand...

That isn't hyperbole. Welker is one of the 2 most productive receivers in football and the deal is a fraction of what the others get. It's a great deal for the Patriots, and many here want them to get rid of him with only hope as his replacement, and that is getting worse on purpose.

Feel free to challenge any of these assertions and i will get back to you.

Ivan said:

That isn't hyperbole. Welker is one of the 2 most productive receivers in football and the deal is a fraction of what the others get. It's a great deal for the Patriots, and many here want them to get rid of him with only hope as his replacement, and that is getting worse on purpose.

Feel free to challenge any of these assertions and i will get back to you.

Click to expand...

I don't really care to discuss this with you because you seemingly are unable to do so without being comically overwrought, but just because someone wants to invest the monies elsewhere doesn't lead to the ineluctable conclusion that the team will be worse off, nor would that necessarily be the case in reality.

Though, this is all kind of water under the bridge now that Lloyd is apparently gone.