Hybrid SuperBeast!! Patriots Merge 2004, 2007, & 2010 Offenses!!

captain stone · Dec 19, 2012

Off The Grid said:
Good CHRIST, this Connection is weak, today.

Is it just the Site, or is it my Connection, as well??

In any case: Very strong Point, Brother Stone.

For The Love of Ganja, indeed. :snob:

So serious am I for my love of ganja, that I only use the phrase when I want to make myself perfectly clear.

Off The Grid · Dec 26, 2012

1 ~ With 1 Game left, the 2012 Patriots have already scored more points ~ 529 ~ than all but 6 Teams in the History of this Great Game.

2 ~ Considering the cacophony of injuries & absences that we've born to All Pro Caliber Talents ~

Kong
Aaron The Navigator
Logan Mankins
Brian Waters
Sebastian The Cruel

~ the phenomenal year we're crafting is flat out astonishing.

3 ~ One note of caution ~ indeed: of Grave Concern: All 6 of those teams ahead of us ~ including, of course, our own 2007 Patriots at #1 ~ fell short of Super Bowl Victory.

It would be too much of a simplification to collectively accuse those 6 of going "soft" ~ especially our own Patriots, who persevered through a Gauntlet of High Expectations & SpyGate to earn the Championship, only to get screwed in the end

~ but I think it's fair to say that there is ample historical evidence, here, to suggest that an excess of scoring success could possibly ~ just possibly, mind you ~ put a team in danger of losing a little bit of its Edge.

...And perhaps just enough to be fatal.

Then, again: There are 32 teams competing, and all 6 of those above, while they weren't ultimately the 1 in 30 or so to go all the way, had, nevertheless, tremendously successful Seasons.

4 ~ My greatest concern, today, is the same as it was when I opened this Thread, Week 1, which was in fact the same as it was back in April, when I felt we missed a spectacular Opportunity to address it: The Offensive Line.

If Aqib Talib & Alfonzo Dennard and their buddies are healthy throughout the PlayOffs, I believe not only that our Defense will be fine, but that it will be ~ how you say? ~ dominant.

The O Line, though?

I'm crossing my fingers.

mayoclinic · Dec 26, 2012

Off The Grid said:
1 ~ With 1 Game left, the 2012 Patriots have already scored more points ~ 529 ~ than all but 6 Teams in the History of this Great Game.

2 ~ Considering the cacophony of injuries & absences that we've born to All Pro Caliber Talents ~

Kong
Aaron The Navigator
Logan Mankins
Brian Waters
Sebastian The Cruel

~ the phenomenal year we're crafting is flat out astonishing.

3 ~ One note of caution ~ indeed: of Grave Concern: All 6 of those teams ahead of us ~ including, of course, our own 2007 Patriots at #1 ~ fell short of Super Bowl Victory.

It would be too much of a simplification to collectively accuse those 6 of going "soft" ~ especially our own Patriots, who persevered through a Gauntlet of High Expectations & SpyGate to earn the Championship, only to get screwed in the end ~ but I think it's fair to say that there is ample historical evidence, here, to suggest that an excess of scoring success could possibly ~ just possibly, mind you ~ put a team in danger of losing a little bit of its Edge.

...And perhaps just enough to be fatal.

Then, again: There are 32 teams competing, and all 6 of those above, while they weren't ultimately the 1 in 30 or so to go all the way, had, nevertheless, tremendously successful Seasons.

4 ~ My greatest concern, today, is the same as it was when I opened this Thread, Week 1, which was in fact the same as it was back in April, when I felt we missed a spectacular Opportunity to address it: The Offensive Line.

If Aqib Talib & Alfonzo Dennard and their buddies are healthy throughout the PlayOffs, I believe not only that our Defense will be fine, but that it will be ~ how you say? ~ dominant.

The O Line, though?

I'm crossing my fingers.

You might add Julian Edelman to your list, as he was becoming a significant offensive weapon and our best deep threat when he went on IR.

It does seem like we have come full circle to the preseason concerns about "this team will go as far as the OL can carry them". And I share your concerns about high scoring offensive juggernauts becoming Super Bowl champions.

ivanvamp · Dec 26, 2012

mayoclinic said:
It does seem like we have come full circle to the preseason concerns about "this team will go as far as the OL can carry them". And I share your concerns about high scoring offensive juggernauts becoming Super Bowl champions.

There have been numerous offensive juggernauts that have won the championship. But usually those offensive juggernauts also had a pretty good defense to go with them.

Year, Team - Def Pts Rank, Def Yds Rank
1994, SF - 6, 8
1989, SF - 3, 4
1984, SF - 1, 10
1991, Was - 2, 3
1999, StL - 4, 6
1998, Den - 8, 11
1996, GB - 1, 1

So it definitely helps having a really good defense (duh). Teams that are offensive juggernauts with poor defenses do not seem to win championships. And some of the great offenses that also had very good defenses (1983 Redskins, 2007 Patriots, 2001 Rams, etc.) did not manage to win. Football is a funny game - a bounce of the weirdly-shaped football can determine a winner in a one-and-done format.

It's important that the Patriots have several ways they can win.

- Shootout? Yep.
- Grind-it-out? Yep. They've done that this year.
- Bad conditions to throw and you have to run? Not sure, but they do have a good running game this year.
- Rely on kickers? Dunno...Gostkowski has been shaky.
- Defensive struggle? Hmmmmm....not sure about that.

So I am very optimistic about this team but there's plenty of concerns, for sure.

mayoclinic · Dec 31, 2012

Pats' offense finishes with 7028 yards (439 YPG), 2184 yards rushing (most since 2008, over 136 YPG average), 557 points scored (3rd most in the SB era, 34.8 PPG average) and records for 1st downs and number of plays in a season. Gronk was clearly not at full speed yesterday, and I'm sure the Pats weren't showing their hand for the playoffs, but there was some hint of waht the offense could look like at full strength.

Hybrid superbeast indeed.

PATSYLICIOUS · Dec 31, 2012

In the 3 games Branch played since he came back, he's made 2 very clutch plays. One against SF on a 4th down conversion - leading to a TD. One yesterday on a 3rd and 12, leading to another TD when the game was still close. If he can come up with 2 or 3 of those in the playoffs, that alone would be well worth the roster spot.

PatsFanInVa · Dec 31, 2012

captain stone said:
So serious am I for my love of ganja, that I only use the phrase when I want to make myself perfectly clear.

Is it just me, or is there some irony in this post?

patsfaninpa · Dec 31, 2012

ivanvamp said:
There have been numerous offensive juggernauts that have won the championship. But usually those offensive juggernauts also had a pretty good defense to go with them.

Year, Team - Def Pts Rank, Def Yds Rank
1994, SF - 6, 8
1989, SF - 3, 4
1984, SF - 1, 10
1991, Was - 2, 3
1999, StL - 4, 6
1998, Den - 8, 11
1996, GB - 1, 1

So it definitely helps having a really good defense (duh). Teams that are offensive juggernauts with poor defenses do not seem to win championships. And some of the great offenses that also had very good defenses (1983 Redskins, 2007 Patriots, 2001 Rams, etc.) did not manage to win. Football is a funny game - a bounce of the weirdly-shaped football can determine a winner in a one-and-done format.

It's important that the Patriots have several ways they can win.

- Shootout? Yep.
- Grind-it-out? Yep. They've done that this year.
- Bad conditions to throw and you have to run? Not sure, but they do have a good running game this year.
- Rely on kickers? Dunno...Gostkowski has been shaky.
- Defensive struggle? Hmmmmm....not sure about that.

So I am very optimistic about this team but there's plenty of concerns, for sure.

Most of the teams you mentioned were pre-salary cap. And one, cheated to avoid the cap. It's hard to build a dominant team on both sides of the ball the way the NFL is currently constituted. Every team has concerns. Denver has to be wondering how they are going to stop us. They aren't going to their defensive meeting saying we held KC to three points. We'll be fine. Like the commentators do. GB has a terrible defense. Atlanta looks good on paper. But, hasn't won a playoff game. SF has to worry about Kaepernick. You want talk poor kicking? Akers is shakier than Don Knotts.

ivanvamp · Dec 31, 2012

patsfaninpa said:
Most of the teams you mentioned were pre-salary cap. And one, cheated to avoid the cap. It's hard to build a dominant team on both sides of the ball the way the NFL is currently constituted. Every team has concerns. Denver has to be wondering how they are going to stop us. They aren't going to their defensive meeting saying we held KC to three points. We'll be fine. Like the commentators do. GB has a terrible defense. Atlanta looks good on paper. But, hasn't won a playoff game. SF has to worry about Kaepernick. You want talk poor kicking? Akers is shakier than Don Knotts.

The salary cap era began in 1993.

Year, Team - Def Pts Rank, Def Yds Rank
1994, SF - 6, 8
1989, SF - 3, 4
1984, SF - 1, 10
1991, Was - 2, 3
1999, StL - 4, 6
1998, Den - 8, 11
1996, GB - 1, 1

Of that list, the '94 SF, '99 StL, '98 Den, and '96 GB teams qualify.

So again, not many offensive juggernauts win the championship without also having a good defense. The Giants last year were good offensively but not a juggernaut.

ATippett56 · Dec 31, 2012

Congratulations to the 2012 New England Patriots offense:

1st Rank - Points Scored
1st Rank - Total Yards
1st Rank - First Downs

2012 New England Patriots Statistics & Players - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Kudos to 2012 NFL Season starters Solder, Wendell, Connolly replacing 2011 NFL Season starters Light, Koppen, Waters at their respective positions (LT, C, RG).

PATSYLICIOUS · Dec 31, 2012

ATippett56 said:
Congratulations to the 2012 New England Patriots offense:

1st Rank - Points Scored
1st Rank - Total Yards
1st Rank - First Downs

.

Where do those rank all time? I think I read somewhere that the first downs is a record

captain stone · Dec 31, 2012

PatsFanInVa said:
Is it just me, or is there some irony in this post?

Uhhh...what?

Bman12 · Dec 31, 2012

We would be 18-0 all the time! Too bad 2007 season we lost..

PatriotSeven · Dec 31, 2012

If this was true we would still have an amazing deep ball threat as an equal part of our offense.

Is it foolish to still hope we're saving it for the playoffs and Lloyd's true purpose will be unveiled in two weeks?

Hey, it happened with out D last year...

PatsFanInVa · Dec 31, 2012

captain stone said:
Uhhh...what?

I forget

that stuff messes with your short term short term short term... I want some doritos.

Off The Grid · Jan 4, 2013

PatriotSeven said:
If this was true we would still have an amazing deep ball threat as an equal part of our offense.

Is it foolish to still hope we're saving it for the playoffs and Lloyd's true purpose will be unveiled in two weeks?

Hey, it happened with out D last year...

One can only assume that you're responding to the OP, and if so, I'm afraid that you're wrong, my good man. :nono:

The "2007" Aspect of this stunning 2012 Offense is both the inclusion of an High Caliber Split End ~ which Brandon Lloyd most certainly is, and which was noticeably absent from the 2004 & 2010 Teams ~ and the employment of The Spread Offense, which was the Signature Formation of the 2007 Team, and an invaluable but merely complementary component ~ thank you, Jeebus!! ~ of the 2012 Offense.

Obviously ~ at least I hope it's obvious

~ only an Aspect ~ a significant Aspect, mind you ~ of each of those 3 Offenses need be present for my original Premise to be true: If all of the 2007 Offensive Scheme was present ~ Heaven Forbid ~ then it wouldn't be an Hybrid: It would just be 2007 Part Deux...true?

mayoclinic · Jan 10, 2013

Nice read on Ridley, the added dimension of the running game to the offense, and a possible return to SB glory:

Stevan Ridley, balanced offense might be Patriots' final Super Bowl piece - NFL - Ben Reiter - SI.com

captain stone · Jan 11, 2013

I might become physically aroused if I were to see both Ridley & Vereen/Woody in the backfield
at the same time. Houston would have to defend sideline-to-sideline, thereby opening the middle
for Gronk/Hernandez, and perhaps allowing Welker/Lloyd to run to the sticks more often on route combos.

The possibilities are endless. Git 'er done, Bill.

mayoclinic · Jan 11, 2013

captain stone said:
I might become physically aroused if I were to see both Ridley & Vereen/Woody in the backfield
at the same time. Houston would have to defend sideline-to-sideline, thereby opening the middle
for Gronk/Hernandez, and perhaps allowing Welker/Lloyd to run to the sticks more often on route combos.

The possibilities are endless. Git 'er done, Bill.

More information than I need to know regarding your personal reaction, but otherwise, I'm with you. And your 2 RB scenario leaves 1 more skill player spot open:

- Ridley
- Woodhead/Vereen (who can also split out wide or go into the slot)
- Gronk/Hernandez
- Welker/Lloyd

So we could have both Welker and Lloyd on the field with 1 TE, or both TEs on the field with 1 WR. Since Hernandez can be moved around in so many ways as can Vereen (if the offense ever decides to use him to his full potential), there is considerable the potential for creating mismatches.

Off The Grid · Jan 17, 2013

40++ Points on the Oh So Recently Awesome Planet Hoosten Defense TWICE???

What an amazing Beast we have built!! :rocker:

Here's an highly intriguing Article on the our utterly One Of A Kind Offense from GrantLand.

Hybrid SuperBeast!! Patriots Merge 2004, 2007, & 2010 Offenses!!

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