Waters' Locker Cleaned Out (Update: Reports Nameplate Taken Down)

My best guess is that this is at least partially about money. Waters probably feels he deserves more than 1.4, and I can't blame him for that. However, if the Patriots cave and up his salary (after skipping the offseason), they may end up sending an unwanted message to any current and future Patriots that are unhappy with their deals. Welker showed up on time and still didn't get extended. I'm sure they want to remain as consistent in negotiations as possible.

Maybe Waters will show up at the latest possible time to get an accrued season, and "finish" the contract, allowing him to play in TX next year if he wishes to. This could be a holdout, and has just been a well-kept secret. Giving his number away doesn't bode well for a return any time soon.

Kicking_Game said:

My best guess is that this is at least partially about money. Waters probably feels he deserves more than 1.4, and I can't blame him for that.

Click to expand...

If that is the case, ship Waters to Dallas and deal with Jerry "glory hole" Jones.

BBass said:

I agree with what you're saying. I would like to see Waters back too.

My only thought is that this is obviously something BB was aware of since the superbowl. I would like to believe he is comfortable with what he has in house otherwise he could of made a play for a number for FA guards or used a draft pick on someone.

I cannot sit here and say that Brian Waters is the key to are offensive line. I think he would be an asset to have on the team but not to the level at which people are suggesting.

The reaction is obviously based on the poor play during preseason but in my opinion it was more of us not using are normal schemes and not a question of poor talent.

Click to expand...

I can't help but disagree with this, Waters played at an all-pro level last year and that can't be easily replaced unless you believe cannon provides that level of play.

Losing an all-pro on the offensive line when your best player is the QB or RB is a major hit. Of course the O-line's poor play is apart of this as it should, it's a direct correlation to the instability that's been there all pre-season.

But once again, when your best player is the QB and you depend heavily on keeping that player clean for success, the importance of that unit can't be overstated imho.

If he shows, great. If he doesn't want to play for the Patriots this season, let him watch football from his couch.

Hightower gets Waters jersey #54

I believe this is a huge indication that Waters is gone and the team has given up hope on his return.

It's time to move on folks.

IMO its almost a certainty that your starting OL lineup for the 2012 season until/if injury hits is...

Solder,Mankins,Wendell,Connolly,Vollmer

The Pats will live....or die with this group.

Deus Irae said:

If he shows, great. If he doesn't want to play for the Patriots this season, let him watch football from his couch.

Click to expand...

That's pretty much how we should feel about it at this point, as I highly doubt anyone in the front office is losing any sleep over it.

Looks like Connelly will be playing RG after all, with Wendell as the starting center.

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

Hightower gets Waters jersey #54

I believe this is a huge indication that Waters is gone and the team has given up hope on his return.

It's time to move on folks.

IMO its almost a certainty that your starting OL lineup for the 2012 season until/if injury hits is...

Solder,Mankins,Wendell,Connolly,Vollmer

The Pats will live....or die with this group.

Click to expand...

They've lived or died with worse.

Personally, I'm not even remotely concerned about the RG spot. Connelly can play that just fine, with Wendell as the starting center.

We have to hope that Solder continues to improve and Vollmer's back holds up.

Has Vollmer played a season yet without being out with injury at least several weeks?

Who would play RT? .....I do believe that if Vollmer's back is still bothering him as Bedard says it looks that way,then I am worried about that.

I think Koppen could be making a return again to add depth in case of injury and move Wendell over,I would rather see Connolly or even Wendell at RT than Cannon who looked like a turnstile in preseason

supafly said:

Looks like Connelly will be playing RG after all, with Wendell as the starting center.

Click to expand...

The organization dealt with Randy Moss, in the last year of his contract, in a similar manner.

As for the New England Patriots offensive line, "it is what it is".

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

Who would play RT? .....I do believe that if Vollmer's back is still bothering him as Bedard says it looks that way,then I am worried about that.

Click to expand...

Based upon preseason snaps, Marcus Cannon.

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

Has Vollmer played a season yet without being out with injury at least several weeks?

Who would play RT? .....I do believe that if Vollmer's back is still bothering him as Bedard says it looks that way,then I am worried about that.

I think Koppen could be making a return again to add depth in case of injury and move Wendell over,I would rather see Connolly or even Wendell at RT than Cannon who looked like a turnstile in preseason

Click to expand...

I don't know how much if any, tackle they played here, as they're both interior guys. One would assume that they could play in an emergency situation, but I'm curious as to why that wasn't explored before--unless Belichick just wouldn't do it.

I am worried about Vollmer's back myself, only time will tell how that plays out.

Cannon looks just awful at RT, they cannot possibly feel comfortable with him playing live game reps in a meaningful game with TFB out there...can they?

Even though McDonald can play all 5 positions, I don't think he looked too good at tackle in preseason or practice either, but it all depends on what the coaches saw as far as using him instead.

I still would like to bring in a better backup tackle which obviously isn't easy just going out and grabbing one, but you'd have to think that he'd be better than Cannon at the position.

ATippett56 said:

Based upon preseason snaps, Marcus Cannon.

Click to expand...

If that's the case then Gronk becomes a 6th OL because he would be needed more over there than as a TE.

I do think that if Gronk has a lesser productive season it may be due to the fact that he is going to be used a lot more as a blocking TE in passing plays to keep Brady from getting clobbered....of course this would be much more in effect if Vollmer or Solder got banged up.

ATippett56 said:

Based upon preseason snaps, Marcus Cannon.

Click to expand...

Well that's just downright frightening to me.

I'm not understanding that one, but then again I am not a well respected coach (both OL and HC).

supafly said:

I don't know how much if any, tackle they played here, as they're both interior guys. One would assume that they could play in an emergency situation, but I'm curious as to why that wasn't explored before--unless Belichick just wouldn't do it.

I am worried about Vollmer's back myself, only time will tell how that plays out.

Cannon looks just awful at RT, they cannot possibly feel comfortable with him playing live game reps in a meaningful game with TFB out there...can they?

Even though McDonald can play all 5 positions, I don't think he looked too good at tackle in preseason or practice either, but it all depends on what the coaches saw as far as using him instead.

I still would like to bring in a better backup tackle which obviously isn't easy just going out and grabbing one, but you'd have to think that he'd be better than Cannon at the position.

Click to expand...

What happened to the interest (at least from media members) in Chad Clifton?

I don't think Bill even spoke to him.....at least he would be experienced depth..

Personally I would rather see Danny Woodhead at RT than Cannon if it came down to it

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

If that's the case then Gronk becomes a 6th OL because he would be needed more over there than as a TE.

I do think that if Gronk has a lesser productive season it may be due to the fact that he is going to be used a lot more as a blocking TE in passing plays to keep Brady from getting clobbered....of course this would be much more in effect if Vollmer or Solder got banged up.

Click to expand...

Yeah, they'll likely chip a TE somewhere already, most likely Solder in some games.

I agree that Gronk may be staying in to block a bit more, but they could also go 3 TE's and use Fells instead, allowing both Hernandez and Gronkowski to be utilized for receiving along with one of Llyod/Welker.

supafly said:

Well that's just downright frightening to me.

I'm not understanding that one, but then again I am not a well respected coach (both OL and HC).

Click to expand...

Based upon preseason and the roster, as it stands today, what is the alternative?

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

If that's the case then Gronk becomes a 6th OL because he would be needed more over there than as a TE.

I do think that if Gronk has a lesser productive season it may be due to the fact that he is going to be used a lot more as a blocking TE in passing plays to keep Brady from getting clobbered....of course this would be much more in effect if Vollmer or Solder got banged up.

Click to expand...

The New England Patriots offense may run the ball more often, as was the case during the 2010 NFL Season as opposed to the 2011 NFL Season.

In addition, the New England Patriots may utilize the screen pass to the running backs more often in 2012 NFL Season as opposed to the 2011 NFL Season.

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

What happened to the interest in Clifton?

Click to expand...

I'm guessing that maybe they just didn't like what they saw in him, but it's a good question.

ATippett56 said:

Based upon preseason and the roster, as it stands today, what is the alternative?

Click to expand...

As it stands today, nothing, unless McDonald is back from injury (seriously doubtful) and they'd rather use him.

They could also sign someone else to better prepare themselves.

As I said, I'm not the 2 respected coaches, so I guess we'll have to leave it up to them to make that call. Either way it should be alright, but I can understand how it may make some of us nervous too.

supafly said:

Well that's just downright frightening to me.

I'm not understanding that one, but then again I am not a well respected coach (both OL and HC).

Click to expand...

When it comes to Cannon as a emergency backup at RT........Dante is a miracle worker,but he would downright have to be Jesus to make it work if Cannon had to be plugged in at RT

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

When it comes to Cannon as a emergency backup at RT........Dante is a miracle worker,but he would downright have to be Jesus to make it work if Cannon had to be plugged in at RT

Click to expand...

speaking of Jesus, could Tim Tebow play RT?

sorry, i couldnt resist :bricks: