Mike Reiss lists potential players the Patriots are interested in; Mark Barron #1

manxman2601 · Apr 23, 2012

rookBoston said:
Ten minute limit plays no part. I promise you, BB and Pioli have already discussed and agreed on terms for a trade up to #11, contingent on the right player being there. What's more, I'm pretty sure BB feels good about the terms, or he would never have bothered to invite Melvin Ingram to Foxboro.

I'm pretty sure a deal for 27 + 63 + Hoyer (or a variation) is on ready-hold, just waiting for a final thumbs up from both parties. With the rigth pre-work, that conversation could easily be consummated in 10 minutes.

"My guy is still there. You still good on that deal?"
"Hold one sec, taking another call... Okay, deal is good. Confirm 11 for 27, 63 and Hoyer"
"Confirmed"
"We'll send the card up right now"

Agree with you on the deal being set up before the draft. The problem with including Hoyer in that trade is that you are effectively giving him a late-second round grade and I don't think teams will value him anywhere near that high:

11 = 1250 pts

27 = 680 pts
62 = 284 pts

difference = 286 pts.

Patriot Missile · Apr 23, 2012

I'm at the point now where I'm like, "Just make the pick". Make it a good one, whether it be trade up, standing pat. I'll support the player and BB no matter what considering his 1st round success. Of course you want your player drafted but as we all know it hardly ever works out that way.

The week of the draft is always hard for me. There's a dozen players I like, a handful where I'm intrigued by late information or solid poster views. It's gonna be a long 4 days.

WhiZa · Apr 23, 2012

Reiss is usually pretty good at picking Patriots type players. I wouldn't surprise me if we take 2 or 3 off that list.

PatsDparty · Apr 23, 2012

manxman2601 said:
What if he sees him as the second coming of Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel in terms of intangibles and locker-room leadership? I think that Barron's cut from the same cloth as them intangibles-wise and I think that that is why Barron is likely to be very high on the Patriots board.

I think you can find guys with strong intangibles throughout the draft. I do like Barron, but it's hard for me to see BB jumping up to the 10-15 range to grab this kid unless he's really high on his ability (along with the intangibles, dedication to football, work ethic, etc).

BB will know better than anyone else considering his connections to Saban. If he falls into the late teens/early 20s, I can definitely see that, but I think the cost is too prohibitive to move up to 10-15.

I can easily see a scenario this year where we move up with our first 1st round pick and then move back with the seconding, where overall we come out neutral or positive in terms of neg aggregate value of picks after both moves.

manxman2601 · Apr 23, 2012

PatsDparty;3021640[B said:
]I think you can find guys with strong intangibles throughout the draft.[/B] I do like Barron, but it's hard for me to see BB jumping up to the 10-15 range to grab this kid unless he's really high on his ability (along with the intangibles, dedication to football, work ethic, etc).

BB will know better than anyone else considering his connections to Saban. If he falls into the late teens/early 20s, I can definitely see that, but I think the cost is too prohibitive to move up to 10-15.

I can easily see a scenario this year where we move up with our first 1st round pick and then move back with the seconding, where overall we come out neutral or positive in terms of neg aggregate value of picks after both moves.

That's true but they don't necessarily combine that with being exceptional players.

as for the trade up, I think it's unlikely to happen but as I'm not enamoured with the prospects in the late first and I think Barron is one of the best players in the draft, then I'm happy to mock the trade up. Only four days till we see.

PatsDparty · Apr 23, 2012

manxman2601 said:
That's true but they don't necessarily combine that with being exceptional players.

as for the trade up, I think it's unlikely to happen but as I'm not enamoured with the prospects in the late first and I think Barron is one of the best players in the draft, then I'm happy to mock the trade up. Only four days till we see.

He's pretty intriguing though. The National Football Post has him falling to us at #27, so who knows where he'll go (or if we have to move very far to get him).

silenthuntr7 · Apr 23, 2012

I'll say this: if that list isn't just conjecture, someone in the Patriots' FO should be fired.

manxman2601 · Apr 23, 2012

PatsDparty said:
He's pretty intriguing though. The National Football Post has him falling to us at #27, so who knows where he'll go (or if we have to move very far to get him).

When I research my mocks I go on a lot of teams forums. The Cowboys fans are getting to the point where they absolutely expect Barron to be the pick.

JackBauer · Apr 23, 2012

Don't mind Barron, but not sure how I feel expending that much capital to get him.

Don't want any part of Harrison Smith, who is rather overrated.

Thirdbasekid24 · Apr 23, 2012

I saw that too. They were even listing tweets from him about the cowboys.

PATSNUTme · Apr 23, 2012

Tonight I'm going to get my 2002 draft guide out and compare what was written about Ed Reed vs what is now beign written about Barron and Smith.

Not saying that either Barron or Smith are the next Ed Reed. But Reed went 24th, so there must not have been sure fired Pro Bowl/HOF write up on him and I want to see the pre-draft grade. Should be fun to see and compare.

WhiZa · Apr 23, 2012

PATSNUTme said:
Tonight I'm going to get my 2002 draft guide out and compare what was written about Ed Reed vs what is now beign written about Barron and Smith.

Not saying that either Barron or Smith are the next Ed Reed. But Reed went 24th, so there must not have been sure fired Pro Bowl/HOF write up on him and I want to see the pre-draft grade. Should be fun to see and compare.

That would make for an interesting article. Comparing what the media said about pro-bowlers before the draft and then seeing what changed (or what they were wrong about). Maybe there's a trend in their somewhere.

Ron Sellers · Apr 23, 2012

PATSNUTme said:
Tonight I'm going to get my 2002 draft guide out and compare what was written about Ed Reed vs what is now beign written about Barron and Smith.

Not saying that either Barron or Smith are the next Ed Reed. But Reed went 24th, so there must not have been sure fired Pro Bowl/HOF write up on him and I want to see the pre-draft grade. Should be fun to see and compare.

Presumably Reed was not the highest rated safety as the Cowboys took Roy Williams with the #8 pick.

Going through the names of that draft is a trip down memory lane.

National Football League: NFL Draft History | 2002

PATSNUTme · Apr 23, 2012

WhiZa said:
That would make for an interesting article. Comparing what the media said about pro-bowlers before the draft and then seeing what changed (or what they were wrong about). Maybe there's a trend in their somewhere.

Joel Bushsbaum (RIP)said" not as big as scouts would want at safety or as fast at CB, and has trouble playing the deep ball"

. But he had him ranked 23 overall 2nd safety behind Williams and had a long "positives' write up on him.

Sfpat · Apr 23, 2012

I know this is heresy on this board, but I don't think safety is as big a need for the Pats as most assume as I don't believe safety play is critical to the Pats defensive scheme (bend but don't break). Afterall, they came close to winning the Super Bowl with some of the worst safety play ever. A small improvement in safety play is probably all that is needed, which can probably be found in the middle rounds (CB conversion). I just don't see BB trading up for Barron.

DL and LB play is more important to the Pats.

WhiZa · Apr 23, 2012

Sfpat said:
I know this is heresy on this board, but I don't think safety is as big a need for the Pats as most assume as I don't believe safety play is critical to the Pats defensive scheme (bend but don't break). Afterall, they came close to winning the Super Bowl with some of the worst safety play ever. A small improvement in safety play is probably all that is needed, which can probably be found in the middle rounds (CB conversion). I just don't see BB trading up for Barron.

DL and LB play is more important to the Pats.

BB is very good at hiding the teams weaknesses. It just so happened to be safety last year. The biggest reason I see safety as a need is the fact we don't have a true free safety that can play and Chung and Barrett are both FAs after this year. No reason to wait til next year to sign a safety when it's a need today.

JMarr · Apr 24, 2012

PATSNUTme said:
In my post today in the "draft game" I suggested that the Patriots trade up to #15 to take Barron. 10-13 may be a little high but it may work. .

Only problem is that the Cowboys are taking Barron, even if they have to trade up to do so. That is the third surest lock of this draft behind Luck and RGIII.

supafly · Apr 24, 2012

JMarr said:
Only problem is that the Cowboys are taking Barron, even if they have to trade up to do so. That is the third surest lock of this draft behind Luck and RGIII.

Yeah, #15 wouldn't do it unfortunately.

Just today alone I saw 3 different highly rated mocks (one was Peter King, one was Silva, and I cannot remember the 3rd) who ALL had the CBoys taking Mark Barron at #14.

We also have heard some rumors about team like SD wanting to move up in front of Dallas at #14 to try and snag him.

At this point, he seems like a pretty sure thing to go in the range of 7-14.

supafly · Apr 24, 2012

WhiZa said:
BB is very good at hiding the teams weaknesses. It just so happened to be safety last year. The biggest reason I see safety as a need is the fact we don't have a true free safety that can play and Chung and Barrett are both FAs after this year. No reason to wait til next year to sign a safety when it's a need today.

That aspect alone may tend to have more bearing on the situation than the perceived majority thinking that we are super desperate at the position now.

While I do agree that it's a need, I don't see it as high of a need at the front 7 picks. I also think that no matter what, we'd be in a better position than last yr already.

Your thoughts on the preparation for the FA period of Chung/Barrett with a year under the new rookie's belt may have a high chance of making a lot of sense. I like that theory.

Mike Reiss lists potential players the Patriots are interested in; Mark Barron #1

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