Anyone have any graphical evidence for Touchback?

Ok, ill bite, just out of curiosity, for all those saying "It should have been ruled a touchback in the first place".....Could someone explain why the refs are obligated to call this a touchback? Im just curious to pick up on your faulty logic....

buile said:

The line chart is still inconclusive because the ball's height affects how the lines intersect. For example, drawing a line from Troy's outstretched hand to the head of the camera man standing out-of-bounds at the 6 yard line will show a line clearly intersecting the goal....

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That's not my point at all. I'm acting as this were an overhead shot. The green X is the actual straight-down shadow of the ball.

If I were to use Troy as an example, logic obviously places his arm straight down to where his feet are, and that's where I'd make my mark, unless a side-view shows otherwise. That's why I had the size view to show approximately how far out the ball was from his body when it came loose.

pats1 said:

That's not my point at all. I'm acting as this were an overhead shot. The green X is the actual straight-down shadow of the ball.

If I were to use Troy as an example, logic obviously places his arm straight down to where his feet are, and that's where I'd make my mark, unless a side-view shows otherwise. That's why I had the size view to show approximately how far out the ball was from his body when it came loose.

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This is your conclusive evidence? Hahahahaha, even with you trying to cheat, look how close that bad boy is....but that's "Definately" out huh? Give me a break.

Is this the first time we've had physics on this board?

broncoted said:

This is your conclusive evidence? Hahahahaha, even with you trying to cheat, look how close that bad boy is....but that's "Definately" out huh? Give me a break.

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Since it's obviously your brain capacity barely extends beyond that of a 3rd grader, I was drawing him a simple diagram to show how I came about acquiring the spot of fumble from the real pictures.

pats1 said:

Since it's obviously your brain capacity barely extends beyond that of a 3rd grader, I was drawing him a simple diagram to show how I came about acquiring the spot of fumble from the real pictures.

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Hahaha I think you drew the line first and then spotted the ball HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

NEM said:

That is an awesome video, and as far as I am concerned it is enough proo fto verify that the ball went into, and out of, the end zone.

If you freeze the pictre it is 100% obvious that the ball is in FRONT of his head, not over it.....and it would virtually impossible from the trajectory of the ball for it not to have passed over any part of the goal line, and once it does, even if it a fraction of an inch, it is considered to be in the end zone...PERIOD, NO ANDS , IFS , OR BUTS ABOUT IT.

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There is no question in my mind that it was a touchback now. I mean, there wasn't any doubt on Saturday night either, but now I am sure of it. The refs just plain blew it, just like they did with Asante's BS PI call. Maybe the league should hold tryouts for the refs to show whether they have the ability to work during the playoffs. I mean, the more I look at that video, the more pissed I get that the refs just blew a fairly easy call. I won't cry over spilt milk, but I have a right to be pissed at that play.

Proof positive... Touchback call blown

PatFan1974 said:

OK it's done.

I have the frames 2 sec apart, no editing or cleaning up of the vidcaps whatsoever. I will take requests to modify the file if more time is needed between the frames. The animated gif clearly shows the ball out of Bailey's posession at the half yard mark (ball appears in front of his helmet) and then forward momentum in the next 3-4 frames clearly show the ball at LEAST over the pilon if not through the endzone outright.

You can all be the judge

http://x12.putfile.com/1/151234099.gif

Let me know if the file is inaccessible.

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This is proof that the "Quantim Tunnel" through Champ's body by the football did not happen. That's the only way the football could have gone from his right hand at least 30 inches inbounds, through his body to Out of Bounds on the left side of his body at the half yard line. Look at his left foot; it, not his right foot, contacts the pylon. That establishes where the ball has to be. For the ref's call the Law of Inertia would also have to have been violated. Any body in motion toward the goaline would tend to stay in motion in that direction, unless a force directed it elswhere. But even if forced sideways, at most it would bounce into Champ's body which blocks the out of bound line and must rebound right & forwards again, across the goaline, as it did. Therefor TOUCHBACK and another confirmed blown call.

PatFan1974 said:

OK it's done.

I have the frames 2 sec apart, no editing or cleaning up of the vidcaps whatsoever. I will take requests to modify the file if more time is needed between the frames. The animated gif clearly shows the ball out of Bailey's posession at the half yard mark (ball appears in front of his helmet) and then forward momentum in the next 3-4 frames clearly show the ball at LEAST over the pilon if not through the endzone outright.

You can all be the judge

http://x12.putfile.com/1/151234099.gif

Let me know if the file is inaccessible.

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Whatever you did, that's unbelievable work --- thanks! My mathematical sense was telling me it was probably out of bounds at the 0.4 yard line, since it was fumbled at the 1.6 and took a fairly sideways out-of-bounds angle. But your work has turned me to believing it probably was a touchback.

CheerforTom said:

I think the bottom line is that we're not going to get the answer from ANY camera angle. No offense, but certainly not those. That's why it wasn't overturned.

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Where was the blimp, d%#*!@t?

shakadave said:

Where was the blimp, d%#*!@t?

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Could we get the satellite images from the government?

Willie55 said:

Could we get the satellite images from the government?

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why isn't there a Google Earth angle? What the hell possible better use is there for that technology...

I don't give a rip about Abdulah Abdulah, all I care about is that the chump fumbled the ball through the endzone...I could watch that hit all day...

Still don't see any travesty here. The refs didn't have time to perform a trigonmetry calculation out there.

The whole comedy of errors leading up to this were the false start penalty, the stupid incomplete out pass, then the final mistake and great play by Bailey.

Personally, it would have been better for Bailey to have run it all the way back for a TD. At least the Defense wouldn't have to go out there and get shamed by having a gimme rushing TD counted against them.

I thought is was through the end zone. Based on the location of the ball (in his right hand, correct?) and the angle that watson hit him, and the latent speed of his body moving forward, the ball would have had to go through Bailey's body to go out of bounds before the pylon. That would be one magic football.

Where the h*ll is the Zapruder film of this?

The Gr8est said:

Notice that you can see that the ball is in front of Bailey as his helmet is originally blocking it.

Also you can see that Bailey's left leg hits the pylon.

Combining the two facts if is obvious that the ball almost certainly passed through the endzone.

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I thought the same thing.

When you look at the fact that his leg has hit the pylon, and the fact that the ball is in front of him, it is clearly going through the endzone.

In a minute and a half, I can agree it is tough to make that call and overturn it.

I hadn't noticed that during the replay on TV either. But it is every obvious when you get 10 minutes to look back at it.

Add this with the bogus int and that is 14 points right there, to say nothing of the missed false start on the other field goal.

Still, the Pats put the game in a situation where the refs could decide it.

Kevin Faulk doesn't fumble, then the bogus PI doesn't happen, and Hobbs doesn't have a chance to fumble, thus the FG with the missed false start doesn't happen.

Brady doesn't throw the pick, we aren't sitting here analyzing camera angles.

I was actually hoping when I looked at it it would be clearly not a TB. Now I just feel like I got kicked in the got again.

Willie55 said:

Could we get the satellite images from the government?

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Yuhhhh, awesome idea! They could have someone from the Dept. of Defense in the replay booth... I love it!

CT_Pats_Fan said:

I thought is was through the end zone. Based on the location of the ball (in his right hand, correct?) and the angle that watson hit him, and the latent speed of his body moving forward, the ball would have had to go through Bailey's body to go out of bounds before the pylon. That would be one magic football.

Where the h*ll is the Zapruder film of this?

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I just think you guys are seeing what you want to see....that bottom one that Patsfan1 tried to cheat on clearly proves the ball was out....not that it matters to me, the Broncos have another playoff game to prepare for muhahahahaha

sieglo said:

If the call had gone the other way, take 7 off the board for Denver and put a Pats offense that had moved the ball well all night back on their own 20. I like our chances to make back that other 7 points.

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great point and end of story.

broncoted said:

I just think you guys are seeing what you want to see....that bottom one that Patsfan1 tried to cheat on clearly proves the ball was out....not that it matters to me, the Broncos have another playoff game to prepare for muhahahahaha

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any salary cap violations this year? because we all know the donks have never won a super bowl without cheating: per nfl salary cap sanctions. that must hurt huh? you donks have never won a super bowl? LOL... we have three.

broncoted said:

Ok, ill bite, just out of curiosity, for all those saying "It should have been ruled a touchback in the first place".....Could someone explain why the refs are obligated to call this a touchback? Im just curious to pick up on your faulty logic....

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You know the thing that kills me is the ref that called the play out of bounds and waves his hand over his head for play over marks the ball on the goal line, then looks down at his mark and moves his foot to the 1 yard line. He knew that if the ball went out of bounds ON THE GOAL LINE, then it was a touchback.....the review ref didn't screw it up, the stupid back judge did. Either way, they are both morons and I have talked about this play with a lot of people who are NOT Pats fans and they say the same thing...."you got screwed on that call too"