"Absolute Terrific Pick"

hwc said:

Plus, the kid is a coach's son and apparently just eats up film study and breaking down defensive schemes. Hard to imagine how the Pats see that fitting into what what they do with Belichick and Brady... :rocker: I think this was a great pick and a fantastic situation for the kid. I'd say that there's a decent shot that the Pats just drafted Tom Brady's replacement. If it doesn't work out, what have they lost? It's not like it would be the first 3rd round pick that didn't pay off. Most 3rd round picks don't have franchise QB upside. 253 pounds, throws a rope 80 yards, loves breaking down film. Proven winner at every level. High completion percentages. Heck, even a decent backup QB for several years would justify a third round pick.

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We've drafted some kids who really wow'd Bill on the board before... There is a world of difference between on the board and on the field at NFL game speed, let alone at this position... Backups don't last several seasons in this league, even in Indy. Your either too good to keep down or to easily replaced to be worth a second contract. Rogers was the exception to that rule but he was also drafted in the first AS the heir apparent to Favre and his second contract reflected that. He only had to wait because Brett was not only an icon but such a freakin' drama queen.

The only holes in his game aren't merely the ones between his ears. This kid has mechanical issues and on field decision making issues that will kill him at the next level unless they can all be corrected.

MoLewisrocks said:

We've drafted some kids who really wow'd Bill on the board before... There is a world of difference between on the board and on the field at NFL game speed, let alone at this position... Backups don't last several seasons in this league, even in Indy. Your either too good to keep down or to easily replaced to be worth a second contract. Rogers was the exception to that rule but he was also drafted in the first AS the heir apparent to Favre and his second contract reflected that. He only had to wait because Brett was not only an icon but such a freakin' drama queen.

The only holes in his game aren't merely the ones between his ears. This kid has mechanical issues and on field decision making issues that will kill him at the next level unless they can all be corrected.

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Here's a question, would you rather Cam Newton and his physical intangibles and described mental aptitude problems even in light of the huge bust potential/possible fantastic play to play the QB position or Ryan Mallett and his favorable football knowledge, massive ceiling and potential character issues backing up Tom Brady?

It seems a no brainer for mine given the value of the pick.

TheSolderKing said:

5-6 year deal w/ DRUG clause that protect us,

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The max deal they can sign him for per the old CBA is 4 years. A new one may limit that to 3. He won't make enough guaranteed or bonus money to require protection either way...

VJCPatriot said:

I think someone mentioned earlier that most 'franchise QB's retired around age 37-38. And Brady is 33 now. Mallet's rookie contract will run 4 years. Which would make him ready about the time Brady decides to ride off into the sunset. I know as fans we never want it to end but someday it will. And the Pats aren't wrong to prepare for the future.

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Forget about the off field stuff. Lets assume he's going to be a hard working good character guy. And its not about the value. I'm sure he had the best grade at the time. And lets make the assumption that in THIS system 2 or 3 years down the road, he starts to show his is becoming EVERY BIT the QB people hoped he might become. He starts to WOW us in pre season games and the VERY rare opportunities he is going to have to actually get on the field. My problem is what has he done to make this a better team for next year or even the year after. QB depth? We won't be better on the field, just a little more protected in case Brady goes down?

Now at the end of 4 years, we have taken the time to train and develop this fine QB....he's a FA. So what happens then. We trade him for a 2nd round pick? Big whoop. Listen if we even thought that Brady would ride off into the sunset at the end of this contract, it might start to make a little MORE sense, but clearly he isn't.

I know its just a personal opinion, but common sense would make us think that the team would have been better served at that point in the draft to pick some player who even MIGHT h ave helped us on the D, or at OG, or at WR, etc I would have rather taken a shot at a guy like Juston Houston, or Greg Romeus, and failed with the pick, than pick a guy who, even if BB is right, and Mallet is going to end up being a steal....but for some OTHER team.

In the end and all my rantings, THIS is were I really had a problem with this draft. The pick of Mallet and the pick of Ridley. Those 2 picks COULD have been used better IMHO. Ridley's skill could have be easily duplicated by a minimum wage FA RB, WITH NFL experience, and Mallet who might have been the best pick in the Fantasy Draft league, just isn't going to help this team in the near future

patfanken said:

Forget about the off field stuff. Lets assume he's going to be a hard working good character guy. And its not about the value. I'm sure he had the best grade at the time. And lets make the assumption that in THIS system 2 or 3 years down the road, he starts to show his is becoming EVERY BIT the QB people hoped he might become. He starts to WOW us in pre season games and the VERY rare opportunities he is going to have to actually get on the field. My problem is what has he done to make this a better team for next year or even the year after. QB depth? We won't be better on the field, just a little more protected in case Brady goes down?

Now at the end of 4 years, we have taken the time to train and develop this fine QB....he's a FA. So what happens then. We trade him for a 2nd round pick? Big whoop. Listen if we even thought that Brady would ride off into the sunset at the end of this contract, it might start to make a little MORE sense, but clearly he isn't.

I know its just a personal opinion, but common sense would make us think that the team would have been better served at that point in the draft to pick some player who even MIGHT h ave helped us on the D, or at OG, or at WR, etc I would have rather taken a shot at a guy like Juston Houston, or Greg Romeus, and failed with the pick, than pick a guy who, even if BB is right, and Mallet is going to end up being a steal....but for some OTHER team.

In the end and all my rantings, THIS is were I really had a problem with this draft. The pick of Mallet and the pick of Ridley. Those 2 picks COULD have been used better IMHO. Ridley's skill could have be easily duplicated by a minimum wage FA RB, WITH NFL experience, and Mallet who might have been the best pick in the Fantasy Draft league, just isn't going to help this team in the near future

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You've been a bit of a drama queen the past couple of days pfk. That's most unlike you. Given the amount of time you put into your reviews of the Patriots, their performances and the roster I would have thought you'd realized the team started addressing needs for today and tomorrow especially with players who seem "now ready". Hell just Bodden and Warren being back is a massive injection of experience into a young D.

It's most unusual to be reading your tone like this.

37Harrison said:

Ron Jaworski, who I think knows a thing or two about QB's, LOVES the Mallet pick. He said it this morning on ESPN. For those out there who think the Mallet pick makes absolutely no sense and can't help the Pats, there are more and more "experts" coming out saying how great this pick is...

Something else for people to ponder... Brady seemingly gets injured every year and has to have some sort of off season surgery. Couldn't the Mallet pick not only improve the backup position but also be used to length Brady's career?

I mean, if Mallet is good in the system, BB could take Brady out here and there if the situation presents itself and save Tommy from getting more abuse. Just a thought which may be way off base but a thought none-the-less.

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These are many of the same "experts" who said the Patriots had NO CHANCE against Indianapolis in 03 and 04 and NO CHANCE against Pittsburgh in 04...I didn't believe them then and I don't belive them now...I take what the experts say with a heavy grain of salt...oftentimes these guys are in bed with a certain team or individual within a certain team or they have a personal vested interest in "shaping" a story/storyline one way or the other...

ausbacker said:

Here's a question, would you rather Cam Newton and his physical intangibles and described mental aptitude problems even in light of the huge bust potential/possible fantastic play to play the QB position or Ryan Mallett and his favorable football knowledge, massive ceiling and potential character issues backing up Tom Brady?

It seems a no brainer for mine given the value of the pick.

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Given that choice I'd prefer neither... They simply don't remotely resemble the skillset in the QB manual that was supposedly written here to reflect this system and scheme before they even knew who Brady was...

As a pure backup and potential replacement due to injury I'd have picked a kid like McElroy later on. But once the perceived value potential of Mallett vs. whatever else was left on their board unfolded, I can understand the move for what it is. Same move they made a couple of years ago with KOC. Hopefully this time it works out better...

MoLewisrocks said:

Given that choice I'd prefer neither... They simply don't remotely resemble the skillset in the QB manual that was supposedly written here to reflect this system and scheme before they even knew who Brady was...

As a pure backup and potential replacement due to injury I'd have picked a kid like McElroy later on. But once the perceived value potential of Mallett vs. whatever else was left on their board unfolded, I can understand the move for what it is. Same move they made a couple of years ago with KOC. Hopefully this time it works out better...

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That's comparing apples and oranges though. KOC was a waste of a pick and a definite project. He didn't come to the Pats with Mallett's CV and potential.

To be fair I've tried to wrap my head around the Mallett pick of the last few days and the more I consider it the better I feel about it. I can't imagine it would take someone with his football aptitude that long to pass Brian Hoyer on the depth chart. We've all seen how useless the Colts are without Peyton Manning under centre. I wouldn't feel safe with Hoyer at QB in the Cassel role if so. Mallett offers unreserved potential to tap even for all his rookie flaws.

Sometimes you've just got to say "what the frig" and pull the trigger.

ausbacker said:

That's comparing apples and oranges though. KOC was a waste of a pick and a definite project. He didn't come to the Pats with Mallett's CV and potential. To be fair I've tried to wrap my head around the Mallett pick of the last few days and the more I consider it the better I feel about it. I can't imagine it would take someone with his football aptitude that long to pass Brian Hoyer on the depth chart. We've all seen how useless the Colts are without Peyton Manning under centre. I wouldn't feel safe with Hoyer at QB in the Cassel role if so. Mallett offers unreserved potential to tap even for all his rookie flaws. Sometimes you've just got to say "what the frig" and pull the trigger.

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KOC was graded as a first rounder by some scouts too, possibly even here... Chalkboard aptitude doesn't always translate (as Patsfans should well know) and you do Hoyer a disservice - he kicked KOC and Andrew Walter to the curb and developed so well that Belichick was comfortable with him as the lone backup to Brady in an MVP season. It doesn't matter where they rank or where they're drafted - it's what they do once they are that matters. Mallett will have to improve a lot not only from a character standpoint but from a functional, mechanical standpoint and a decision making under pressure standpoint. He was asked to do nothing like that at Michigan or at Arkansas. Petrino's system does most of the heavy lifting wherever he goes. No QB's developed in it have ever taken their performance to the next level.

I have no trouble with the value pick concept. I just see it for what it was and is.

MoLewisrocks said:

KOC was graded as a first rounder by some scouts too, possibly even here... Chalkboard aptitude doesn't always translate (as Patsfans should well know) and you do Hoyer a disservice - he kicked KOC and Andrew Walter to the curb and developed so well that Belichick was comfortable with him as the lone backup to Brady in an MVP season. It doesn't matter where they rank or where they're drafted - it's what they do once they are that matters. Mallett will have to improve a lot not only from a character standpoint but from a functional, mechanical standpoint and a decision making under pressure standpoint. He was asked to do nothing like that at Michigan or at Arkansas. Petrino's system does most of the heavy lifting wherever he goes. No QB's developed in it have ever taken their performance to the next level.

I have no trouble with the value pick concept. I just see it for what it was and is.

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I'm not doing Brian Hoyer a disservice at all I simply think Ryan Mallett has a higher ceiling to be a considerably better NFL QB than Hoyer. Either way when it comes to Mallett we're arguing hypotheticals not truths.

We agree upon the value-draft choice.

BB spent a lot of time and couldn't wear out the kid looking at film. The kid has all the physical tools (OK he doesn't run well neither does Brady). BB feels he loves football and that it is important to him.

Brady will be 37 at the end of Mallett's rookie contract, Brady is building an injury history, injury problems tend not to diminish with time. At some point careers end. This is a good pick it could end up being a Montana/Young or Farve/Rodgers situation, unique opportunity to take a shot.

look at it this way........the pats have the 2 best QB's in the AFC east

patfanken said:

Now at the end of 4 years, we have taken the time to train and develop this fine QB....he's a FA. So what happens then. We trade him for a 2nd round pick? Big whoop. Listen if we even thought that Brady would ride off into the sunset at the end of this contract, it might start to make a little MORE sense, but clearly he isn't.

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It doesn't matter whether we think Brady is going to retire at the end of his contract. We have to be ready incase he does. You dont count on a 38 year old player in the NFL.


We need to train a guy up to be ready to play when Brady retires, because we won't have an extra top 5 pick sitting around.

MoLewisrocks said:

KOC was graded as a first rounder by some scouts too, possibly even here... Chalkboard aptitude doesn't always translate (as Patsfans should well know) and you do Hoyer a disservice - he kicked KOC and Andrew Walter to the curb and developed so well that Belichick was comfortable with him as the lone backup to Brady in an MVP season. It doesn't matter where they rank or where they're drafted - it's what they do once they are that matters. Mallett will have to improve a lot not only from a character standpoint but from a functional, mechanical standpoint and a decision making under pressure standpoint. He was asked to do nothing like that at Michigan or at Arkansas. Petrino's system does most of the heavy lifting wherever he goes. No QB's developed in it have ever taken their performance to the next level.

I have no trouble with the value pick concept. I just see it for what it was and is.

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show me who graded oconnell as a 1st rounder.......at SDSU, tehy didn't even execute an offense that any NFL scout would take seriously

really......I'd like to see who graded oconnell a 1st rounder

one thing is certain......mallett has the best and most accurate arm in the draft, can make throws that none of the other's can make........hell, he can make throws many NFL QB's can't make.

there will be several teams who should be very upset if most or all of the negativity surrounding mallett was fabricated.......watching footage of the guy, he hits 20-30 strikes off his back foot

again.......he was labeled a human JUGS machine

One thing in this whole PICK-WORTHY debate that I absolutely disagree with is that Mallett was drafted for future gain through draft picks. Since when do we consider BB to be managing a farm system with draft picks as his pay? He did it once, and that was to dear and trusted colleague. Which may have factored into the decision.
How many here know how Brady's recovery from foot surgery is coming along? Will he be ready for a full load in camp? If not, can Hoyer take all the snaps and keep his arm from falling off? BB was going to draft a QB. He spent a pick that was probably a round or two higher than he expected to and got a better physical specimen as a result. Period. Mallett battles Hoyer for the number two spot.
Mallett to BB projects a better number 2/3 QB than someone else appeared to project a number 4/5 DE/OLB. BB put in A LOT of time coaching up defensive youngsters last year. Should he shelve any one or two of them and do it all over again?

VJCPatriot said:

I think someone mentioned earlier that most 'franchise QB's retired around age 37-38. And Brady is 33 now. Mallet's rookie contract will run 4 years. Which would make him ready about the time Brady decides to ride off into the sunset. I know as fans we never want it to end but someday it will. And the Pats aren't wrong to prepare for the future.

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The exact stat is that the Average Retirement Age for a Super Bowl-era QB who is in the HOF is 37.5; the median age is 38. Only one QB has won an SB after the age of 35: John Elway, who won two at the ages of 37 and 38.

Most of the guys who retired older than 38 were "old timers:" Len Dawson, Sonny Jurgensen and Johnny U at the age of 40. Warren Moon stayed around until 42.

Of the others, Aikman and Namath retired at 34; Bradshaw and Bob Griese at 35, Fouts and Kelly at 36, Starr and Staubach at 37, Elway, Marino, Montana, Tarkenton and Young at 38.

*ChungFu* said:

One thing in this whole PICK-WORTHY debate that I absolutely disagree with is that Mallett was drafted for future gain through draft picks. Since when do we consider BB to be managing a farm system with draft picks as his pay? He did it once, and that was to dear and trusted colleague. Which may have factored into the decision.
How many here know how Brady's recovery from foot surgery is coming along? Will he be ready for a full load in camp? If not, can Hoyer take all the snaps and keep his arm from falling off? BB was going to draft a QB. He spent a pick that was probably a round or two higher than he expected to and got a better physical specimen as a result. Period. Mallett battles Hoyer for the number two spot.
Mallett to BB projects a better number 2/3 QB than someone else appeared to project a number 4/5 DE/OLB. BB put in A LOT of time coaching up defensive youngsters last year. Should he shelve any one or two of them and do it all over again?

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Mallett will be what most NFL-insiders believe: Ryan Leaf.

Mallett does not have the mentality of a NFL QB.


If Patriots truly want the Patriot QB, they trade their 2012 2 1st for :

Andrew Luck in 2012.

zipster9 said:

Mallett will be what most NFL-insiders believe: Ryan Leaf.

Mallett does not have the mentality of a NFL QB.


If Patriots truly want the Patriot QB, they trade their 2012 2 1st for :

Andrew Luck in 2012.

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The flip side...if Mallett sticks around for 2 years, stays out of trouble, and looks good in spot duty or in an injury replacement role...a guy with his talent...could be worth a high 1st round pick.

There are some ifs, but if he is truly willing to learn from the best for a couple of years, he will have QB value. For Mallett, there is no better situation than this one.

He could also go bust, but I'm rooting for him, if only for the potential value.

stinkypete said:

The flip side...if Mallett sticks around for 2 years, stays out of trouble, and looks good in spot duty or in an injury replacement role...a guy with his talent...could be worth a high 1st round pick.

There are some ifs, but if he is truly willing to learn from the best for a couple of years, he will have QB value. For Mallett, there is no better situation than this one.

He could also go bust, but I'm rooting for him, if only for the potential value.

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Yes. agreed.

But, he is not the "randy moss" or "corey dillon" type problems. Both these guys are experienced players who respect BillB. So their problems were muted by BillB.

Not sure about Mallett. He seems like the QB that wants to play to show everybody that he is as good as he think he is. Will he have patience behind Brady? Will he be a distraction to Brady and the Patriots?

Will get a glimpse this year (if no lockout)..

patfanken said:

I know its just a personal opinion, but common sense would make us think that the team would have been better served at that point in the draft to pick some player who even MIGHT h ave helped us on the D, or at OG, or at WR, etc I would have rather taken a shot at a guy like Juston Houston, or Greg Romeus, and failed with the pick, than pick a guy who, even if BB is right, and Mallet is going to end up being a steal....but for some OTHER team.

In the end and all my rantings, THIS is were I really had a problem with this draft. The pick of Mallet and the pick of Ridley. Those 2 picks COULD have been used better IMHO. Ridley's skill could have be easily duplicated by a minimum wage FA RB, WITH NFL experience, and Mallet who might have been the best pick in the Fantasy Draft league, just isn't going to help this team in the near future

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PFK - It's simple, the year before Brady retires, the Pats will wait until the 6th round and draft his successor who will be waiting there with all other teams again not understanding his potential. The Pats will swoop in and reprise Brady at that time.

Maybe Brady does play another 10 years. I hope so and I hope his skills don't diminish one iota during that time. Of course, he'd be older than Brett Favre is now. No matter, it's likely not going to happen that way. This pick is called contingency planning. The teams that are prepared tend to be successful. The teams that are not tend to draft one of the first 10 players, due to their record.

Also, how long does a rookie QB who, despite his skills, is a huge question mark in terms of even making the team, require to be able to effectively lead this team should the need arise due to injury or something else?

This is a risk, but a risk the team can afford to take. Nothing more, nothing less.